Is she BU or are we bad neighbours?

[TravellingSpoon]

We have a cat who is an outdoor cat and who likes to roam but normally within the proximity of our nearest neighbours.

She likes to hunt and is a prolific hunter. At one point we were getting a bird every other day or so. Neighbour mentioned she didnt like her round her bird table as she 'stalks about looking for little birds.' WE got her a collar with a bell, now neighbour is complaining that she can hear the bell tinkling as she runs round the garden, both hers and ours.

She has been round this evening to say that our cat is ruining her enjoyment of the garden and can we keep her in the house or in our garden.

I would say that the cat is out maybe 30% of the day, the rest she is being generally lazy laid out on the sofa.

Cats are classed as wild animals, hunting is just what they do, no way would I be keeping mine in just because someone doesn't like the sound of a little bell tickling a couple of times a day.

I genuinely think she just doesn't like cats and nothing short of keeping your cat in permanently will make your neighbour happy.

I’m sure the op would rather not have dead birds brought to her by the cat 🙄

A cat's nature is to kill...red in tooth and claw and all that, so if you let a cat go out, it may very well kill something even if it's only an insect. That's the same insects that the birds will eat, it's a cycle.

Cats foil bells, so the only sureproof way to not have this happen is to keep the cat indoors. Some cats are fine with this but for a sizeable number, doing so is just cruel.

She is being super precious if a catbell annoys her. The cat's right to wander is just as important for her need for absolute silence. How does she get on with the birdsong?

Anyone who kills a pet wants locking up because as sure as eggs are eggs, those people will one day turn their aggression to someone weaker themselves.It is also illegal and anyone wjho tries to promote this as an answer is a brain dead, soulless, sub-human shit.

This year is the first time we have no songbirds visiting our bird table in years. We used to get lots but now it’s nothing, pigeons, magpies, gulls, but no songbird except a robin and a pair of blackbirds.

Mostly though it’s the insects or lack of that is most ominous.

Cats are free-roaming. That’s how it’s been for hundreds of years. If she doesn’t like it, she can take steps to keep cats out.

The law is on your side BUT she is entitles to do what she likes in her garden, that could be putting out antifreeze, poisoned meat, bear traps, getting an air pistol etc etc - which so long as she keeps to the confines of her garden, she wouldn't be prosecuted if your cat came to harm.

Pretty sure that poisoning/trapping/shooting people's pets isn't legal, no matter where you do it, so no, she's not entitled to do this

Not condoning deliberately harming an animal in any way, but isn't that the legal trade-off with cats, as opposed to dogs?

As I understand it (may well be incorrect), you don't have any legal responsibility to stop them wandering or clear up their poo from other people's property, as they're classified as free-roaming, untrainable animals; but because of that, you also don't have any right to complain or redress if they get hurt/run over/killed, as you would for a trainable/tameable pet such as a dog.

Moaning about a tinkly little bell is silly, but I don't think she should be slapped down for wanting to have enjoyment of her own garden and the birds that visit it.

If she had a dog that got into your garden and killed your cat - the same animal that you are unable/unwilling to restrain when it kills other creatures - people wouldn't be telling you that it was up to you to dog-proof your own garden.

@Gomyownway surely a bit harsh to have the OP spayed, even if her cat is annoying?

Birds are constantly being killed... by other birds. It’s part of nature. The OP’s cat is not a murderer, and the birds do not belong to her neighbour.

@notthetoothfairy it autocorrected slated to spayed, but I decided to keep it as it seems in keeping with the topic

WeBuiltThisBuffetOnSausageRoll - I don't think so, no. People can't go around killing pets, regardless of what pet it is. And actually, killing anything that isn't classed as vermin is also illegal.

I would never condone hurting cats, but I hate that cat owners are allowed to let their pet go and shit in other people’s gardens and pointlessly kill wildlife (pointless since they’re not killing to eat).

However, OP has put a bell on the cat as requested by the neighbour to protect the wildlife. The neighbour is BU to now object to the noise of the bell. How loud is a cat bell anyway? I can’t imagine it being heard much among all the general neighbourhood noise of traffic, birds, kids playing etc

For those in any doubt about hurting cats who come I to your garden, the police took it very seriously when our cat was shot with an air rifle. It is definitely not legal to do this.

I don't like cats - the cats themselves are fine and I will happily have one on my lap and pet it or play with it, but cats do ill wild animals and I hate that there is an attitude which says "Oh well, it's nature." It's not nature. It is their instinct but they are not native predators in this country. Native predators are subject to natural laws (for example, too many predators = not enough food to go round = dead predators.) Because cats get fed by humans, there is no law of nature which operates in the same way, so they can have a disproportionate effect. Not all cats do, but some are clearly effective hunters. So the "it's nature" argument needs to stop. It isn't nature - cats are a man-made problem for our wildlife and we need to acknowledge that. It is frustrating when you are trying to do your bit to help wildlife and someone else's cat is undoing your work and preventing your enjoyment.
I don't however think she can then complain about the bell.

She's a loon.

I love cats and birds.

I'd appreciate the bell.

Haha Mumsnet bingo indeed..

TBF I’m one of the cat haters. Although it’s the shit I hate rather than the actual cats. I love gardening and can’t stand it when I find cats shit. It smell vile. (and yes I know what’s cat and what’s fox etc

OP, suggest your neighbour ‘shoots’ your cat with a water pistol or ups some motion activated pet scarers. I’ve got them and they work a treat. I get them from Amazon.

The law is on your side BUT she is entitles to do what she likes in her garden, that could be putting out antifreeze, poisoned meat, bear traps, getting an air pistol etc etc - which so long as she keeps to the confines of her garden, she wouldn't be prosecuted if your cat came to harm.

^ absolute bollocks. Currently dealing with a case of a neighbour killing another neighbours cat because it ate one of his chickens, he killed it in his own garden and is being prosecuted for it. And quite right

The law is on your side BUT she is entitles to do what she likes in her garden, that could be putting out antifreeze, poisoned meat, bear traps, getting an air pistol etc etc - which so long as she keeps to the confines of her garden, she wouldn't be prosecuted if your cat came to harm.

Are you absolutely mental?

No. You can't shoot a cat with an air rifle, or put down poison for it. The reason? The cat is classed and "property" and as such killing or harming it is criminal damage. Trust me. Also animal cruelty offences too, anti freeze is a slow, horrible death.

Oh. And my cats are indoor cats just due to how busy the road is near me.

But just for reference, you can't "damage" a cat thinking it's not a crime.

I love most animals but I do not like cats at all. We had one that kept leaving dead birds at our back door, so we turned to the hose pipe to try and deter it from "visiting.

I think the neighbour is being unreasonable about the bell, but I would do something to stop a cat roaming in my garden.

Its dumb a_holes that think 'you can do what you like in your own garden, poison ect...'
RUBBISH!

I had neighbours who actually thought this crap was true, and shot my poor beloved cat with an air rifle, she was blinded in one eye and had a sore on her side where her hair fell out, and she almost died from stress.
I do not believe in keeping cats indoors, they have claws for climbing, and to keep a cat indoors for its entire life I reckon is as cruel as if you were to do it to a person...they crave the air, the sun, the fields, the hunt, not a bloody bit of carpet, a litter box and daytime telly!

Anyways, tell this woman to bugger off, yes birds get killed, tough, its nature, much more natural than us eating bits of cow in a bun, (though probably not as tasty!)
Your cat has the right of way, and fair play to it. x

I found this interesting recently, think it was being discussed on Springwatch. Still not nice that they kill birds, however the RSPB says:

Despite the large numbers of birds killed by cats in gardens, there is no clear scientific evidence that such mortality is causing bird populations to decline. This may be surprising, but many millions of birds die naturally every year, mainly through starvation, disease or other forms of predation. There is evidence that cats tend to take weak or sickly birds.

We also know that of the millions of baby birds hatched each year, most will die before they reach breeding age. This is also quite natural, and each pair needs only to rear two young that survive to breeding age to replace themselves and maintain the population.

It is likely that most of the birds killed by cats would have died anyway from other causes before the next breeding season, so cats are unlikely to have a major impact on populations. If their predation was additional to these other causes of mortality, this might have a serious impact on bird populations.

Those bird species which have undergone the most serious population declines in the UK (such as skylarks, tree sparrows and corn buntings) rarely encounter cats, so cats cannot be causing their declines. Research shows that these declines are usually caused by habitat change or loss, particularly on farmland.

Read more at www.rspb.org.uk/birds-and-wildlife/advice/gardening-for-wildlife/animal-deterrents/cats-and-garden-birds/are-cats-causing-bird-declines/#qUVLxHhvcxViox7U.99

If anyone ever deliberately harmed a cat of mine, I'd throttle that person with my bare hands.

From that quote, humans are much more of a threat to her birds on her feeder.

Perhaps suggest you wear bells 😉

(I like cats and don't trust anyone who actively dislikes them, especially to the point of wanting to harm them #psychopath)

A girl my dsis works with stole someone’s cooked chicken on a Sunday morning and someone else’s newly cooked steaks among other various items of clothing. They are moaning about a teeny tiny bell.

Presumably you couldn’t do anything, bar shoot the cat while explaining to it that this is what cats get for annoying neighbours, that would actually appease them.

anyone ever deliberately harmed a cat of mine, I'd throttle that person with my bare hands.
Ditto

One of the main reasons I keep my cat indoors is to keep him safe from the cat-hating psychos of the type that always turn up on threads like this.