Landlady is selling our flat. What is reasonable?

[Summerbreezes]

I live with my DH in a one bedroom flat. Our landlady said don't worry, it will probably take a while to sell as the housing market is slowing down. An estate agent has already been round to have a look. Then the other day we were suddenly given only a few hours notice that someone else would be coming round to take some photos. There's another estate agent coming next week.

I'm worried about random people turning up worth no notice. I work part-time irregular hours and I'm probably going to have to take a few weeks off work anyway due to stress at work. DH will be at work. I was reading the thread about your awful experiences of house viewings and it was full of people saying they viewed flats when people were in bed etc. I don't want to be in bed because then I'd feel unsafe with male estate agents visiting, but at the same time I don't want to constantly feel like people are coming in and out of my flat. I'm worried that someone might arrive unexpectedly when I'm in the shower. We don't have a security chain on the door. I'm sure they're supposed to give 48 hours notice, but let's face it, people break this law all the time.

Also our landlady is a bit obsessed with being neat and tidy. There is no storage space in our flat so we have various boxes of stuff down one end of the living room. A couple of years ago she asked us if we could store it at my parents' house! I know there are lots of stories on the other thread about cleaning standards in people's homes, but we have cleaned and tidied and we honestly feel our home is averagely tidy. If we're asked to move some of our stuff, can we say no?

I'm not going to be one of those tenants ago tries to block the sale or anything, but at the same time this is our home. I'm under enough stress as it is.

Well, I’m not surprised she’s sent vague messages about not moving out yet - she wants paying tenants right up until she sells!

Agree with all the above about stating to her clearly - and in writing - what you will and won’t accept. You can be helpful but there needs to be a line in the sand. If estate agents turn up without the requisite 24 hours notice and/or at times other than what you’ve stated, sent them away. Dim as they generally are, they’ll get the message. If you have an inside door lock (my old rented flat had a security chain) use tnwhen you’re in. That way you’ll know they can’t get in without your permission.

If your landlord gets arsey, remind her of your rights. Get Shelter involved if necessary.

Don't be bullied and if you have a chain to the door keep it on while you're at home, remind dh to do it too. Or keep your key in door, whatever you can to stop access whilst your at home.

What is the legal requirement for notice for viewings? Is it 24 hours rather than 48?

There's no legal requirement as there's no legal requirement for you to allow them at all.

The 'you must allow viewings' clause in a contract is no more enforceable than a clause saying you have to cook your LL dinner every Tuesday night.

And please remember that you need to give notice yourself if you are planning to move out and have not been given notice.

This is important advice.

Your tenancy doesn't end until one of you ends it. If your tenancy rolls over into a periodic you need to give one months notice.

I would just start looking for somewhere new now, and tell her she can do her viewings once you have gone. No one with any sense will buy whilst a property has tenants in anyway so she won't be able to sell until the property is vacant anyway so just have a few months of peace but start seriously looking for somewhere else.

Otherwise within your tenancy it's your standard notice period in the tenancy.

Email her with what you're willing to put up with. Install a chain or leave your key in the lock barrel if you have one. I'd install a camera inside to check if anyone comes in whilst you are not there. You actually do not have to allow viewings at all.

If I were you I would start looking for another place where you can enjoy living. These things could go on for ages.

What is the legal requirement for notice for viewings? Is it 24 hours rather than 48?

The law is that for any sort of non-emergency access to the property they landlord must give you a minimum of 24hrs written notice but your right to live undisturbed overrides this so even with the "correct" notice given you have the right to refuse access and there is not a damn thing the landlord can do about it. Some will try and bully their way through by claiming they can enter the property regardless because they've given you notice or that your tenancy agreement says you have to let them in, these are both incorrect.

The only time a landlord can enter without your permission and without notice is in specific emergency situations or with a court order granting possession (and you'd know about that long before it was granted).

I'd also get looking for another place to live and give your month's notice a month before your tenancy is due to end. Or look at your contract and find another place to live and give the month's notice sooner if you can. Fuck her. She's wanting to keep the money rolling in whilst incoveniencing you.

Just a hint for when you are home if you have a UPVC door put your key in and turn it 1/4 more clockwise once its locked theres no way a person on the other side can gain entry if theres a key on your side. I did this at the end of my last tenancy as they were saying they were going to do viewings when I wasnt home made me feel so uncomfortable!

On another note, in order to get your deposit back, make sure you confirm all expectations on what condition you leave the property in. If you had an inventory done at the start of tenancy, I believe it is like for like, minus reasonable wear & tear. That means no nails or holes in the wall, no paint touch ups, cleaning to the same standard. If curtains and carpets were steam cleaned at check in, they should be at check out. Same number of lightbulbs working etc. I worked in property years ago and it was a shame when tenants had some deposit deducted simply for not checking what the contract stated.

Your tenancy doesn't end until one of you ends it. If your tenancy rolls over into a periodic you need to give one months notice.

You can end it just on the day of the end of the fixed term without notice, but if you stay beyond that, then you have to give notice.

OP - Either don't allow any access, or negotiate a significant discount in rent to continue living there and providing access, she will really struggle to sell with a tenant in place, you will get hassled a lot by people looking who wouldn't continue even if they liked it once they find out it's not vacant possession.

It doesn't matter what your contract says. You do not have to consent to viewings.
Look at it this way: she is acting in her own best interests, she isn't interested in yours.
You are having to move anyway. Put your foot down. No more viewings. Enjoy the rest of your tenancy stress free!

Either don't allow any access, or negotiate a significant discount in rent to continue living there and providing access, she will really struggle to sell with a tenant in place, you will get hassled a lot by people looking who wouldn't continue even if they liked it once they find out it's not vacant possession.

Not to mention that, when it fails to sell as quickly as she hopes it will sell, she is likely to start looking for reasons why and her sights are probably going to land firmly on you which is when she will start nagging at you to "tidy up" in preparation for viewings, rearrange this room, rearrange that room, declutter here, declutter there and so on.

I bought a flat with tenant in it.

It took ages for me to get a time to view the property as the tenant worked shifts, was often away. It took about two months after initial marketing and they held an open morning and tenant was present.

What happened in fact was the owner received a few offers but chose mine primarily because I was happy for tenant to continue living there.

Can you offer a morning one Saturday where they can get a load of viewings done?

Adding clauses to the lease that are illegal, doesn't suddenly make them legal. Or enforceable.

They can't just change the law.

www.citizensadvice.org.uk/housing/renting-a-home/renting-from-a-private-landlord/

If you are worried about anyone entering the flat while you are there (e.g. in the shower) just buy a door wedge and position it so that the door can't open when you are in on your own.
Check your lease. It should state what you have agreed to do if the owner wishes to sell. Take it to the Citizen's advice bureau to have them look it over. Start looking for a new place now.
Everything will work out for the best.

It doesn't matter what's in the lease. I could add a clause in saying that unless you change your name to ControversialFerret then you'll be evicted - doesn't mean that it's legal or enforceable!

As PP have said, the law states that LL and Agent must give 24hrs notice (minimum) of a request to enter. If the tenant refuses then they cannot enter. The only circumstances where it is legal to force entry - or enter without notice - are in the event of an emergency (such as a gas leak).

So if the contract says 'reasonable access for viewings' or suchlike, then it can be ignored because it's unenforceable.

I would give notice and move at the end of the three months.

In terms of viewings allowing viewings once a week is fair/standard.

We are buying and all the rented places were pretty much the same - you could view on Saturday between 10-12 only (or similar)

The boxes thing is laughable/ridiculous... as is her expectation you are on stand by.
I found it such a PITA I could barley be bothered and that was when I was selling my own flat for a handsome profit 😳

Conveyancer here. The Landlord must bring the tenancy agreement to and end formally. She must serve the tenants a written letter/notice in a fairly standard format. The spellings and details and dates must all be correct. If your tenancy is due to end on say 31st August 2019 the Landlord should serve the Notice no later than 30 June 2019. the Notie can be served with more than two months left of tenancy but cannot be served effectively with less than two months left. If landlord serves a Notice on say Monday 8 July 2019 the tenants have two calendar months in which to vacate e.g. by 7 Sept 2019.

The same is true if the tenant is the one serving notice on the landlord.

These are standard statutory requirements of Assured Shorthold Tenancies (ASTs)

Good luck for your move

Of course in an ideal world you’re a good tennant and she’s been a good landlord throughout your tenancy. You both work together and she gets her viewings etc and you have no pettiness when it comes to getting your deposit back and receive a glowing reference.

Of course in an ideal world you’re a good tennant and she’s been a good landlord throughout your tenancy. You both work together and she gets her viewings etc and you have no pettiness when it comes to getting your deposit back and receive a glowing reference.

Refusing viewings isn't pettiness, the OP has a right to undisturbed enjoyment of the flat she is paying to live in and has no legal or moral obligation to allow viewings if it doesn't suit her to do so.

The deposit should legally be held in a deposit protection scheme and the landlord cannot withhold any part of it without just cause so refusing viewings would not result in any part of the deposit being docked.

You don't need references from a previous landlord in order to get a new property, where they do ask for references an employer's reference will suffice.

Of course in an ideal world you’re a good tennant and she’s been a good landlord throughout your tenancy. You both work together and she gets her viewings etc and you have no pettiness when it comes to getting your deposit back and receive a glowing reference.

Imo that’s the kind of thing that gives shitty landlord the opinion that they can do what they want.

A tenant shouldn’t have to give up the quiet enjoyment of their home to protect themselves from “pettiness” from a landlord. Getting the deposit back without fucking about should be a given (if there’s no damage) and any reference should be accurate, not dependent on letting the LL take the piss- which the OP’s ll has already done with the short notice photos.

That attitude I mean.