To think people should move left after overtaking?!

[GinDaddy]

A mildly infuriating situation yesterday on the M25, just one of dozens I’ve experienced this year alone:

I’m in lane 1, at a bit under 70 mph. Come across someone doing 60 mph.

Just ahead of me are three cars, all spaced across the second, third and fourth lanes. All doing 70 mph, no one overtaking the other.

They are soon joined by more cars in lanes 2 and 3, none of them trying to indicate or move into another lane to overtake.

So essentially we have a rolling roadblock, where drivers have picked “their” lane, got nice and comfy on the cruise control, and sit there in their bubble.

As for me, I had to wait ages for a safe gap, move out, overtake and got back into a totally clear lane 1.

Clear to the point where if I hit 70mph I would be comfortably overtaking the second, third and fourth lanes.

What on earth goes through folks heads is all I’m asking - the Highway Code states “keep left unless overtaking”, yet no one was actively trying to overtake. I know speed cameras are an issue, yet if you move back over, others can also accelerate safely to 70 mph, then move back in.

Sadly this is why we have “smart” motorways coming in - because fewer people seem to accept overtaking, claiming “it’s more dangerous to change lanes all the time” (?!)

So, AIBU to think people should keep left?

If there are lots of slip roads I prefer to avoid the left lane if possible, because you have to keep slowing down when people joining the road pull out in front of you.

You are exactly the kind of driver this thread is about. When you use the lanes incorrectly like this, in effect (provided other poor drivers do not attempt to undertake) you are singlehandedly reducing the motorway down to two lanes. You don’t have to move left in between each and every car, for example if you can clearly see that there is another car that you will almost immediately have to pull back out to overtake it’s acceptable to continue your overtaking manoeuvre even if there are gaps between the vehicles that you are overtaking. But just sitting in the middle lane because another car may or may not join the carriageway at some point is pure laziness and exceptionally poor driving.

Meanwhile, mateyboy is driving well over the speed limit at 90 mph + in the fast lane, cuts across all the over lanes at the last minute without use of indicators to exit and no one bats an eyelid

Yea that's no better, however he's usually gone in seconds while we're still trying to get around the middle lane hogger!

Yes you should keep left except overtaking:

except if I am overtaking, don't drive very very fast up to my bumper. I am allowed to overtake and if eg the person I am overtaking is doing 60, I can do 70 and don't need to do 90 just because you are

And "middle lane sitting" seems to be defined differently by different people. To me it is sitting in the middle lane when there is nothing in the inside lane. But to lots of people it seems to be going into the middle lane in plenty of time to overtake something you can see coming up in the inside lane. Personally I think looking ahead and planning your driving accordingly is good driving but there seems to be a view that you should drive right up to the car you want to overtake and then pull out at the last possible second. I don't think that is good driving.

As for the M25, people don't use the inside lane because it keeps disappearing and becoming a slip road (at least on the section between the M3 and M40 junctions). Having to keep changing lanes is tiresome so I understand why people don't do it.

everyone uses lanes 2,3 & 4 and leaves lane 1 empty because they fundamentally don’t understand how motorway driving works (stay in left lane unless overtaking) and cannot wrap their little brains around what to do with this fourth lane

another reason is that the inside lane suddenly gets taken out of use because there is no hard shoulder and a car has broken down on it - people are worried about driving into the back of something if it is not noticed by the cameras quickly enough. And for the same reason I said above - the inside lane keeps getting used as a slip road.

You don’t have to move left in between each and every car, for example if you can clearly see that there is another car that you will almost immediately have to pull back out to overtake it’s acceptable to continue your overtaking manoeuvre even if there are gaps between the vehicles that you are overtaking

That's very magnanimous. Actually it is good driving to be aware and think ahead. Not merely "acceptable".

I recently drove on the M6 and it wasn't particularly clear when you could use the hard shoulder and when you couldn't, and it seemed to switch a lot from one to the other. It's a dumb motorway, not a smart one

This! The M42 is particularly confusing. The M3 is a smart motorway too but you can usually use the inside lane without a problem, until someone breaks down. But the M42 seems to change within a blink of an eye and you have to keep moving over.

ime no-one only overtakes on the M25 it's just so busy you would be moving lanes very minute! it works though to move into third lane then back rather then keep going back to the first lane.

I think it works quite well when it's moving

On a motorway I drive a lot at off peak times, there's a junction which has a long sweeping slip road joining it.

I often play a game to guess, purely from the way a car is being driven, which one will go direct from slip lane to lane three without stopping.

I am right 95% of the time.

I also get massively pissed off by drivers who blindly drive right up the arse of the vehicle in front of them, and then instead of just waiting for a suitable gap, just fling themselves out into the next lane like it was completely beyond their control.

All regardless that vehicles in that lane then need to sharply brake/change lanes themselves etc

YANBU

People who hog the middle lane are the fucking worst. I had one actually swear at me the other day when I overtook him - bloody move you idiot!

Yanbu. Most people i see doing it are on their phone or watching a sat nav.

Completely agree with you. I was on the m40 the other day and what you're describing was driving me insane. Other thing which does is when you are overtaking and making sure you are a safe distance past before pulling back into the lane you were in before and some twat comes hurtling up behind you at 100mph in the fast lane, tailgating and trying to force you to move back over immediately

“Perhaps a good reason to adopt the American system of being able to overtake and undertake?”

No. Really dangerous and people lane hogging is not an excuse. I hate it when drivers do this.

The U.K. roads are amongst the safest in the world. We shouldn’t be adopting any other countries laws or norms because they are inevitably inferior (and the US certainly is)

my DM and step dad often complain about people "cutting them up" by pulling back in front of them from the outside lane to the middle lane, where they are happily bumbling along at 65. I tried to point out that the others drivers were possibly suggesting they should get themselves into the inside lane, but they insisted that it was all the other drives being aggressive

also, I recently drove with a friend of mine and her dp, on a major dual carriageway A-road. her dp was driving and was doing 50-ish in the outside lane for huge periods of time, with an empty inside lane and a massive queue behind him. I didn't know him well enough to say "bloody well pull over" but I really wanted to. he seemed totally oblivious.

I regularly tow a trailer and people hogging the middle lane at 50-55mph are a real pain because I can't use the outside lane to get around them. They will often go on for miles and miles without moving to the inside lane. Extremely frustrating.

That's very magnanimous. Actually it is good driving to be aware and think ahead. Not merely "acceptable".

"Magnanimous"? Weird choice of word. I didn't write the highway code. If it makes you happier, substitute the word "advisable" for "acceptable" in my comment. The point still stands: the highway code states that if you are overtaking multiple vehicles, you move back over as soon as it's safe to do so. You don't sit in an overtaking lane because you think another vehicle may want to join the motorway soon.

The M25 is by far the worst motorway for this.

You get middle lane and fast lane hoggers in other motorways, I drive the m4 most days and you get a lot but normally at least they might be going 70 or 80. On the m25 the inside and 2nd lane can be completely clear, whilst the 3rd and outside lane chocablock with cars going 50. It's bizarre.

I have honestly driven the m25 at night, only car on the road, when suddenly a car in the outside lane chugging along at 60, with 3 empty lanes to the left of them! Why?

I think it's because a lot of people don't know how to lane change or merge anymore. I learnt wait for a gap then move. But a lot of drivers will just indicate and expect to be let out when there's no gap, like they might indicate as your nose is level with their bumper. I think they don't know how to change lanes and are too scared so just sit in a lane.

With merging I see cars drive up to the slip road next to a lorry/car or something and hover next to it with their indicators on, despite the lane being entirely empty behind and in front of the lorry/car. they can't seem to work out how to find a space and merge.

I also get annoyed when people merge onto a motorway and go straight out to the fast lane, without even seeing how fast the traffic is moving. Cars will do this on a completely empty motorway, why? What is the point. If you aren't going faster than the cars in the other lanes what's the point? Why make a dangerous manoeuvre before you have any idea if you want to overtake anyone or not?

gary to be fair I see a lot of drivers cutting up other drivers. Pulling suddenly into spaces that are too small, or pulling in front of a car without leaving enough room.

I would think especially not want to cut up a middle lane hogger, because I would not be confident in their driving ability.

TheRedBarrows Not if the rules are changed it isn't. Undertaking is only considered dangerous because it's not expected. If the highway code did change then you should expect the possibility that you'll be undertaken and check before making a lane change.

I mean, you should do that anyway

YANBU. I'll only stay in the right lane if I'm overtaking a string of vehicles (usually lorries).

I also get annoyed when people merge onto a motorway and go straight out to the fast lane, without even seeing how fast the traffic is moving

YES and in some cases not bothering to check if the other lanes are clear to move into. I always move over to let cars merge more easily and a few times recently I've had people just drift right in front of me across the middle lane into the right hand lane expecting everyone else to just clear a path! So dangerous!

I’ve driven nearly a thousand miles over the last two weeks, mostly on the M4, M5 and M6.

The sheer volume of shit driving I saw was mind boggling. Middle lane drivers, no one using the inside lane of 4 on a smart motorway despite very clear signage, outside lane hogging. People sitting in lane 2 for no good reason, you get plenty of notice (usually a mile and then half a mile) for slip roads and entry slips so why just sit there when you’re not overtaking?

I recently drove on the M6 and it wasn't particularly clear when you could use the hard shoulder and when you couldn't, and it seemed to switch a lot from one to the other. It's a dumb motorway, not a smart one!

Maybe you need to take some more driving lessons!

I do a lot of motorway driving in a small car with probably below average acceleration so I don't overtake often as I need a decent gap. However when I do move out (usually to overtake a lorry) 9/10 times a car exceeding the speed limit pulls right up behind be and often tries to intimidate me back to the left.

Last week a fiesta flew up behind me and blinded me (I was going as fast as the car in front and hadn't yet cleared the lorry I was overtaking).

There really is no need for it, as soon as I could move back over I did and he proceeded to not get anywhere as the overtaking lane was slower moving than he though.