To be disappointed in hearing that many UK woman drink during pregnancy [shock]

[Leati]

Yesterday, I was on a thread when some of the women started questioning about US policy on drinking alcohol during pregnancies. One of the women had heard that if you have a glass of wine, you could be arrested. I assured her that wasn't true but there was chance that if you were visibly pregnant that the restaurant or bar might exercise their right to refuse service. And if a pediatrician became suspicious of drug or alcohol abuse, they could have the baby?s blood tested at birth. If the baby is found to have these in their blood, the child will be taken away. Another woman pitched that she found it disturbing that restaurants had signs warning pregnant women.

I couldn't believe what I was hearing. These women seemed to believe it was actually okay to drink during their pregnancies. Hadn't they heard of Fetal Alcohol Syndrome. So today, I did a little research and was shocked to learn that it is a big problem in the UK and that there is little education about it there.

Women who are angry over mothers choosing the bottle over nursing are damaging their children by drinking alcohol. This is not minor damage, in some case it is equivalent to severe mental retardation and in others it less obvious cognitive problems. Overall nearly 10% of babies born in the UK are suffering from some sort of cognitive problems directly related to alcohol exposure in the womb.

What broke my heart the most is that I have been on this site and I know that the mothers on this site care so much for their children. That while I may not always agree with everything said and our perspectives are not always the same, that we share a common love for our children. So I felt compelled to start this thread and share the information. I hope that you will share it, with your loved ones and it may spread.

I have attached some sites so you can research this yourself. These sites are both from the UK and the US.

www.fasaware.co.uk/

www.bbc.co.uk/insideout/west/series2/fetal_alcohol_syndro mfaspregnancydrinkinglearning_difficulties.shtml

www.healthychildrenproject.org/glossa ry/

For anyone who wants to read recent info from the BMA:www.bma.org.uk/ap.nsf/AttachmentsByTitle/PDFFetalalcohol/${FILE}/Fetalalcohol.pdf
After a quick glance it seems that the jury is still out on what smaller amounts of alcohol are harmful. Seems that binge drinking, heavy prolonged drinking are absolute no-nos and unborn babies particularly vulnerable in first and 3rd trimesters. There seems to be a suspicion that any drinking might cause problems but no real evidence.
As I said I haven't read it all, so may have misinterpreted what I've read. But it looked interesting.

During my pregnancies, I was told that an occassional alcoholic drink now and then would do no harm. When breastfeeding, I was advised to have an alcoholic drink at the start of the feed as it relaxed you and aided let-down.

As regards gluten and weaning. I understood that it is best to avoid introducing it into the diet until baby is at least 10 months old , when the gut will be mature enough.

'abstain' Leati, not substain

Leati - google crohns disease.

leati, what is known about the level of alcohol consumption of the mothers of these 135 babies?

"recommend", not DICTATE

i googled substain

You know, call me suspicious if you like, but I'm not inclined to accept that a speaker at the "Foetal Alcohol Syndrome Aware UK Syndrome Conference, London, UK" is going to be 100% unbiased...

What is now very very worrying is the realisation that me and just about every poster on this thread must be living survivors of FAS, given that in the 60's/70's drinking during PG (at much higher levels than todays' guidelines) was widespread. And you know what? We all seem to have survived it (as well as surviving the effects of our parents' tobacco consumption, butter consumption, whatever. Not to mention the alcoholic gripe water they gave us all). Wow. We must all be wildly lucky, eh? And we even seem to have much better immune systems than our own children, if evidence of allergies/asthma etc are anything to go by. Go figure.

Leati, we are very pleased for you that you have worked through your own views and determined what to believe. Now please accept that we are all entitled to do the same. If I wanted a lecture I'd go to college. And if I wanted an opinionated rant I'd go down the pub (preferably not while PG). People read what they want to, decide their views and act accordingly, and blow me down if they don't usually do the sensible thing anyway. However well-intentioned your OP, the increasing insistence on your viewpoint and reliance on throwing medical experts opinions on here as if they were objectively researched facts isn't clever. Leave that kind of rationality to the creatonists and scientologists (and government ministers of course).

now now ladies, you are making yourselves look petty and childish..........

YAWN

But it was so much fun!

amidaiwish
www.wholesomebabyfood.com/readyforsolids.htm

parenting.ivillage.com/baby/bnutriti on/0,,3vp7,00.html

www.lalecheleague.org/FAQ/solids.html

pediatrics.about.com/cs /breastfeeding/a/starting_slds.htm

I am not afraid to read about when to feed my baby solids. They all suggest between 4-6 months. Now maybe you can stop intentionally harassing me.

sorry VVV, I know what you mean, but it is just born out of frustration that there isn't a sensible debate going on. Even from your standpoint you must be irritated by the constant quoting and inability to respond to debate - you seem able to do it perfectly well.

Ooops - should clarify that I'm not saying their is a link between alcohol and good immune systems by the way, but that there may well be a link between the nanny state obsession with what levels of cleanliness/ vaccinations/ excercise/ diet/ alcohol and so on is acceptable, and the state of our immune systems....

you are harrassing us leati, you should expect something in return...weaning your child is not the same as giving it gluten.....

I'm afraid Leati, you just proved everyone's point.

That you can find any old 'medical' statistic or research to back up anything.

Like those people who use the bible to back up the death penalty.

LOL, I'm not sure i'm taking it that seriously though (although I think i have made my standpoint on alcohol in pg clear ).

I expect a food fight any minute now

squiffy

Nobody tied you to this page so if you don't be here, then go to a different thread. You ladies are not even willing to look at three seperate website that show that alcohol has been found to cause some cognitive problems in smaller amounts.

Leati - that's The Point. They don't all say 4-6 months.

You can choose to ignore the ones that say 6 months and take the advice that suits you.

(Although personally I think the evidence for 6 months is overwhelming)

But the gluten one still stands at 9/10 months - sorry.

well our advice differs.

6 months.
then gluten free.

i am not intentionally harassing you, just amazed you are so focused on following one piece of advice (and lecturing everyone else the other side of the world) and not others.

leaving thread now... dull.

Answer one question

If science suggest that there is even the smallest risk and it not a necessary risk

Why would you take it?

Leati, PLEASE don't ignore this evidence...

www.babycentre.co.uk/baby/startingsolids/gluten&babiesexpert/

news.b bc.co.uk/1/hi/health/4554661.stm

www.imglutenfreebaby.co.uk/

www.askbaby.com/wea ning-six-month-baby.htm

www.kellymom.com/nutrition/solids/delay-solids.html

Ah, Google. Doctors love it. Not.

Remind me, next time I'm pregnant, to lock myself away for 9 months so as not to contaminate my baby in anyway. It might sue me for any problems it has when it grows up.

Leati, please: FAS is caused by pregnant women drinking to excess, not by having the odd glass of bubbly at a wedding.

God, the number of times I sat in the kitchen at 3am with a bawling baby, unable to get it to settle, and looked at the gin bottle thinking: "Just a little, would just a tiny drop do the job and knock her out?"!! And before anyone calls Social Services, of course I didn't give the baby any, tempting though it was!

The advice in the UK is 6 months, Leati. It was changed to coincide with the advice to exclusively breast feed for six months.

Personally, I don't subscribe to this nanny state approach. I take guidelines with a grain of salt, do a bit of research, and make my own informed decisions.

I give single MMR jabs (against guidelines)
I breast feed what I can, but never made six months. (against guidelines)
I wean them somewhere around 5 or 6 months.

I do a lot of things in life with being told to do them. I don't jump off a bridge because some pomous arse in a position of power tells me to. I have a brain and I take pride in my ability to use it.

You have not convinced me that my few drinks in 2nd and 3rd trimesters has done my lovely NT children any harm.

"Actually, I don't see anywhere on the site or on the page that shows those babies were born strictly to alcoholics or not born."

so what you're saying is you have no idea how much the mothers of these babies were drinking? Interesting.