Mums microdosing

[Far2go46]

www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/science/2019/may/03/psychedelic-drugs-women-taking-tiny-doses-hattie-garlick

Anyone into this? Prefer macrodosing myself but each to their own.

I find it interesting but I think we don’t know enough about the long term effects of taking these things like this. I take a cocktail of prescription drugs for various things - thyroxine, steroids for asthma and Addison’s disease, painkillers and iron tablets etc. All of which we know the side effects, we know what happens if we overdose and we know the risks long term. I think it’s quite dangerous to be taking things, even at a lower dose, when they’re not properly controlled.

While there is some promising research for some psychedelics helping with some conditions and I can see with that why it could appeal to some, the article is about self-medicating and drug use. Calling it 'microdosing' or 'natural' or comparing them to sacraments (which aren't usually done multiple times a day and are done communally) or whatever to dress it up isn't going to change that. There are benefits and risks that each person needs to consider, but this isn't any different than the other 'mother's little helpers' of past generations which helped some and fucked up others.

Part of me feels that it's very individual on how a person deals with their choice of self-medicating habits, but having grown up with both parents who were well known to self medicate on 'natural' and prescription drugs, I really couldn't do any of that with my kids around even if the idea of being under the influence of any of these had any appeal for me, which they really don't. Personally, still a bit pissed that the general attitude growing up was that these types of habits were okay for parents around their kids as long as they looked okay, that can change really fast.

I'm generally happy, but there are things I'm unhappy with that I cannot change. As one of those things is having PTSD after multiple events in my childhood with parents under the influence, I'm not sure that continuing that cycle of fucked-up-ness by taking anything like this would do me or anyone else any good. I'm far from the only person whose parents 'taking this to cope' was a big part of their horrific childhood that we have to live the rest of out lives with their choices. Maybe we'd have fewer people feeling a need to self-medicate if society had a better handle on helping people deal with shite we can't change in other ways.

I wouldn't be happy if my children's teacher, or nurse, or bus driver, was doing it. So why should a university lecturer or business owner? These drugs are illegal for a reason.

The LSD sounds like the dose is very inaccurate.

Do these women drive on the drugs? Presumably they are responsible for their children on them?

And yes, I think there is a class element. I can't imagine it would go well if somebody told social services, either. They have a pretty hard line on hallucinating while you look after kids and drugs in general (with good reason!)

I think there is a lot more drug use generally than people think. I used to work in a hotel in a very middle class, small Norfolk town and almost everyone - including the owner / manager, a woman with 2 young children - and the head chef and all kitchen staff - were snorting cocaine on a daily basis. As someone who has never, ever taken any illegal drugs I found it absolutely shocking. But to them it was all normal and they felt they needed to do it to cope with the busy, full on nature of the job. No one locally would ever think they were the type of people to do it but I witnessed it first hand.

fuzzyshadowchatter
In the article I read it wasn't done several times a day, it was once every three days and the woman in question used 1/16 of a standard small recreational dose. I can't get too worked up about such a tiny amount really.

'These drugs are illegal for a reason'?

So self righteous! There are a lot more factors than 'people's well-being' behind criminalising drugs. Case in point - Tories being shareholders in 'legal' cannabis production but still keeping its criminalisation as policy. When big pharma companies find a way to mass produce so called illegal substances for profit, they won't be so bad anymore and will go straight to market

You may as well believe in fairies if you believe that the government is a big benevolent force keeping us all safe from drugs.

@AsleepAllDay

Why is that self righteous?

What's the reason that they're illegal then?

People talking about drug abuse and tolerance as if they're pharmacologists or have ever taken anything stronger than some whisky

Amazing how you call others self righteous AsleepAllDay but you’re openly self righteous and arrogant enough to decide that nobody commenting on this post has ever done anything ‘stronger’ than whisky. Not going to disclose my own personal history with substance use (and that doesn’t mean anything either way) on a public forum but you are incredibly naive if you think substance use is something that happens to ‘other people’. Bit of an odd assertion to make tbh, plucked out of thin air with no discernible grounds other than feeling it somehow backs up your point I guess.

As others have pointed out, I’m curious what the response would be if this article was about working class women using substances instead of palatable middle class women

Agreed. There would be calls of 'report to social services'

@DulcieRay It's self righteous because as I said, there are more political rather than benevolent reasons for drugs to be criminalised. It was a political play at the time, the 'war on drugs' was designed to fail & resulted in the incarceration of minorities on minor drug charges than anything

It also put an end to genuine scientific study of these drugs and their potential benefits. It is only recently that the benefits of medical marijuana and like I said, ketamine infusions etc have become known.

In many cases, these drugs are not half as harmful as legal opioids which have killed 91,000 Americans in two years.

Drug criminalisation only benefited big pharmaceutical companies, the black market and politicians on an ignorant soapbox.

Look at Portugal as an object lesson about sensible drug policy.

The issue is not black and white and to say 'they're illegal for a reason' is being both holier than thou and misinformed

@stacktherocks yes it's ignorant to compare microdosing psychoactive drugs, heroin and alcohol as if they're all much of a muchness. Whatever your history of using substances is, a level of nuance about the differences has been notably missing from this thread.

Your opinion on whether you agree with other people’s points isn’t what I’m highlighting. You’re no more of an authority than anyone else here, and i’m curious why you’d wade in assuming that nobody who has contributed so far has ever had an addiction or taken hard drugs?

The irony of claiming there’s not been enough nuance for you while also putting other people’s contributions down because you’ve instantly and psychically understood everyone is speaking from a position of never having used hard drugs/had an addiction/had training on psychoactive substances/worked in substance misuse...

From the obvious misunderstanding of how these drugs, tolerance and addiction work? Someone who blithely suggests that microdosing is the same as some vodka or smoking heroin can't really know anything about how it all works. There's no point in picking on me about it - it's literally from this lack of knowledge that the daily mail etc can whip up a moral panic about skunk and so on

If I was taking any drugs including alcohol on a regular basis to treat my mental health without a prescription from my Dr I would expect concerns to be raised for my ability to drive, look after my children, work etc.

But then I'm not middle class so maybe that's why.

I used to march out liberal politics on drugs unthinkingly, too, but the reality I have seen of what even so called "soft" or "safe" drugs can do to peoples lives has made me reconsider my position.

And yes, I have met people who's lives were ruined by alcohol or prescription drugs. I'm not arguing for their legality. I'm just glad the law has at least recognised some dangerous substances.

Should they still have a medical use? Definitely! But then there will be guidance (such as not operating machinery or driving) like there are for other prescription medications. And doses will be controlled and it will be easier to discern what may have gone wrong and how to help the patient if it does.

Just like gay marriage is now accepated and the norm for most people, let's hope that in a few years cannabis available legally for pain conditions and ketamine for depression will be a norm to. ketamine has been proved to help non-resistant depression and will not be just prescribed for any type of depression. It works and doctors have said it will be available in pill form...hopefully sooner rather than later.

Thomas Insel, the director of the National Institute of Mental Health says, “Recent data suggest that ketamine, given intravenously might be the most important breakthrough anti-depressant in decades.” Conventional anti-depressants aren’t able to help about one-third of patients with major depression, but new ketamine drugs such as esketamine (in development by Johnson and Johnson) may offer new hope. Infusion therapies available through ketamine clinics across the United States report a high success rate of 60% to 70% treating Treatment Resistant Depression as well as Major Depression with risk of suicide

www.depressionalliance.org/ketamine-for-depression/

www.yalemedicine.org/stories/ketamine-depression/

Basically ketamine when it leaves the body causes brain connections to regrow unlike anti-depressants which supress. The problem in the UK is that GPs treat depression generically and just throw the usual pills at a patient, in places like Australia where they are progressive they treat the individual and tailor the drugs to that person's depression.

I've used microsomes of mushrooms on and off for several years now and It's wonderful. I feel like a better version of myself. After 6 years on anti depressants which did nothing for me and at times made me feel nothing but depressed it has changed my world ten fold for the better and I can function like a normal human being again.

*mircodoses

I feel that many of the women i the article are taking much more than a microdose, it is supposed to be so small that it is barely perceptible - certainly not a 'treat'. They say they are enjoying playing with the kids... what if their was an accident while they were tripping and had to deal with hospitals or worse? That would give you PTSD or who knows how you would cope with heightened perception! and the safegarding repercussions would be tremendous if people - your children - in your supervision were injured.
That said, I am not against it and I think many of the anecdotal and legit studies show a lot of promise - but yes - microdosing is supposed to far smaller than some of the portions these ladies are taking!

I have to say that I am fascinated by the idea of this. In fact DH is out right now with a friend who "knows someone" who can supply us. I'll report back

Well as a former LSD user I think it's a load of bollocks because
(1) such a small dose unlikely to do anything so it's quite likely this is a placebo effect, think how many people reckon homeopathy works;
(2) LSD in particular has a very strong habituating effect, in other words you get used to it. You just can't trip two nights in a row. So if you are taking multiple doses a week it likely isn't doing anything at all.