Martial arts belts

[Kungfupanda67]

Very random one, but a friend of mine’s daughter has been to a Matt Fiddes martial arts grading today - she’s not a brown belt. She is 5.
How??

Surely, surely, a 5 year old can’t be a brown belt in any martial art? It just seems ridiculous. There are black belt kids in her class who’ve only just started school. Where do they go next?

Someone help me understand!!

No reputable martial arts instructor would have 5/6/7 year olds as brown belts. It takes 6 months and a minimum number of training sessions to get through the beginners grades for a start (white, red tip, red, yellow and orange) and then green, blue and purple normally take a year each.

A reputable club wouldn’t have kids training for black belts until they were at least 10 years old and even then they’d have to be exceptionally talented. And if they do make black belt, it’s a junior black belt which then has to be upgraded via another grading exam at the age of 18.

Also, you don’t need to go to Japan to get 2nd dan 😂

In my kids' martial arts class there are minis (under 6) juniors (7-12) and adults (13+). All have their own belt rewards system. When they move up to the next group (ie Minis to Juniors, or Juniors to Adults (age 13+) they have to start from the bottom of the new category.

So you could be a black belt in the Minis category, but when you move to the Juniors, you start at the beginning again ie training for the first belt in the Juniors section.

A "black belt" in the Minis means nothing in the Juniors (except they might probably progress better or faster due to the pre-training). Same for a black belt in the Juniors meaning nothing in the Adults (which is when the "real" or "permanent" grading system starts.

It would be a long and boring time to train from starting at age 4, with no belts to be won until you start the Adults class at 13, so it's good to have some form of recognition for effort. The mini and juniors are graded on proper criteria for their age though. It's about positioning, reach, stretch, speed, agility, anticipation, reaction, discipline, attention to detail, respect, perfecting the moves and knowing and understanding the rules in terms of contact, of the particular martial art.

Hope this helps!!

When I did Karate I think you couldn't have a black belt until 16, and the absolute minimum time you could get it in was something like 4 or 5 years. (Bear in mind that training would be 2 or 3 times a week virtually every week of the year.)

I think that there might have been something called a Junior Black Belt that could theoretically be earned by someone in their early teens who had run through all the lower grades, but I never came across anyone who had actually earned it.

I’m a bit on the fence with this - we have an exceptionally good club, their Sensei is a world champion, they do well at competitions etc. However, they grade every quarter so they all fly through the belts. They’ve tightened up on this recently but really there are kids on purple and brown belts who my child on a blue belt regularly beats. I think they ought to go much slower, really instill some discipline and only grade them if they are truly ready - there are other ways of motivating than letting them fly through the badges.

Somanycoats my ds goes to classes that follow this system. They get a coloured stripe for each of the skills and when they have collected all of the stripes and a technical stripe they are put forward for the next grading.

It will be a stripe done internally as she is too young to start the proper grading. My youngest has been going since he was 5, is 7 now and only on his Orange belt.

Martial Arts can be poorly regulated.

There are so many ' Governing Bodies '. some of which do not govern or regulate at all.

If you are going to send your. Hold to one check instructors credentials and affiliation.

Safeguarding can be very poor in some of this organisations.

Ds1, (10) has been training for almost 5 years, his next grading will be his black belt (he is currently black, red). Where he trains they only grade if his Sensei think they are ready, his sister (7) is a green belt. After black they grade for 'stars' and can't grade for their 2nd dan until they are at least 18.

I've never heard of Matt Fiddes so am on the fence too. Ds1 has never missed or failed a grading.

I actually just spoke to my DP about this thread as he holds a black belt in Wing Chun, he said he acquired his in 2 years whilst living in Dubai, BUT he was training everyday & had private lessons quite a few times a week.

He certainly didn't think it would be possible for a 'genuine black belt' to be acquired in a few years unless you dedicate everyday to it like he did.

Oh and he is also a qualified instructor now too! (doesn't work as one though😂)

My DD does taekwondo it took her 7 years of hard work (plus some talent) to get a black belt. Having said that, the first few belts where easy to achieve but it gets more difficult as they move up the belts. Once a black belt the grading continues but only one every few years.
The problem with martial arts is, that there are so many fractions and a lot of people see it as a money spinner. We had students leave because of "slow" progress to other more commercial clubs.
It's sad really, as martial arts is a lifelong journey not a quick move up some colourful belts.

DD has been training in martial arts for 10 years. She's just about to gain her senior black belt. She's trained for almost 8 hours a week for over 7 of those years. Gradings are long and thorough and include oral theory as well as a written exam. They won't hesitate to fail you either if you don't make the cut at grading (DD has not been successful in some gradings and had to re-apply).

For the senior belts, a minimum of 6 months training is required between gradings.

Not heard of Matt Fiddes but it sounds like a fad!

For a bit of perspective- I’ve been training for around 20 years on and off and I’m still only a purple belt. I’m simply not good enough at it to get any higher although I still strive to progress. Maybe one day I’ll get brown belt but only if I truly make the mark. I wouldn’t want to get it just because instructor wanted to keep me interested!

Matt Fiddes is an absolute con. No one who trains in martial arts would give the belts any kudos.
They are known as Mc-dojo's all about making money.
My eldest trained for 8 years sometimes three times a week to get to her black belt. The work that went in to her black belt grading was unbelievable and incredibly intense.
Our sensei charges £4.00 a lesson and £10 per grading. No contracts, no money up front and all my kids absolutely love it.

Sorry I should say dds black belt is a junior black belt (she's 14) she would have to retake her black belt grading (and then some) to get her adult black belt.

Thanks for everyone’s replies - glad I’m not the only one who doesn’t believe a 5 year old could be a genuine brown belt!

I used to do karate and only ever got to green belt (which took me a couple of years when I was about 10)... was beginning to think I must have seriously lacked any sort of martial art skill 😂

My dd7 does judo and has for a year. She's won 3 golds, 3 silvers and 4 bronzes at competitions and she's only 1st Mon. No way would she be able to have a black belt she trains along side black belts and UK and international fighters. She's got a natural talent for the sport so not rushing her up the grades she could be a orange beltif I wanted her to be.

I know this is an old thread but just thought I'd reply...

I've been involved with MF martial arts for a couple of years, so will give an objective review:

MF offered the flexibility that other clubs didn't e.g. if you can't make a session, you can attend a different class at a different location on a different night. Good for people who struggle to commit to one night.

It is quite expensive for one person (£45 a month) but... if there are 3 of you training from the same family it is £25 a month each, so much better value than other clubs in my area that charge £35 to £40 a month. They encourage families to train together. It is very family orientated.

Lessons include a mix of kicks, punches, hand drills, kick boxing drills, self defence and fitness.

The belt system for younger kids is ridiculous, but for under 7s it is about confidence and awarding effort, rather than how good they are. As an adult or junior, it becomes more serious. Kids move onto a badge system first. Yes, they do put some shockingly untalented kids through to higher belts, but they cannot pass beyond red stripe belt if they are rubbish. After this point, all gradings are very long panel gradings which are brutal (apparently).

My biggest and only gripe with MF is the cost of gradings. They are too expensive and make it feel like it's more about money than talent. If they made them much cheaper (to cover the cost of admin, belt and certificate) then the MF martial arts would be brilliant. It is just this part that really lets it down.

I only found out that MF is not federated. I attended ‘championships’ today and it was farcical. It freestyle and a franchise. Everything has to be branded or your not allowed to take part .. I am going to love my child to a federated martial arts club .

Some clubs hand them out like sweeties.

Dd has trained for 14 years, competes at high level and just earned her brown. Other clubs grade every 3 months regardless.

It’s not federated so their grades mean nothing if they go to another federated martial arts, their belt is not recognised. It’s business based on MF’s own interpretation of Taekwondo and ok for keep fit and some basic self defence. What I saw today was a rabble and indisciplined with unprofessional referees; a MF grading system that carries no real weight. And it’s very costly! All your gear has to be MF branded.. sorry but .. conned by a franchise n smart business man!

I went to watch my son at a Matt Fiddes championship today. It was complete and utter chaos, no order, no proper discipline and a set of moves I could have picked up in at least 1 hr … no technique …. Bloody awful. My husband who signed him up was totally unaware of its lack of status with no governing body. Pulling the rug!! And saving ££ by going elsewhere. I sent the details to my Forbes Judo instructor …. He is still laughing … freestyle whatever

Problem with MF is it is their own style of martial arts and no governing body. All their competitions are within franchise so not a true competition in a recognised martial art. Everything being branded and frequent expensive gradings with baby black belts- it screams mcdojo. It may be good for fitness and confidence but shouldn't be pedalled as martial arts. Maybe martial arts style fitness but not self defence.

My son is 11 and has been training for 5 years in a British judo association club. He is on the county squad and has national medals. He is an orange belt. Minimum age for a black belt in judo is 15 and to get it that young you have to be exceptional. We have two 15 year old black belts in our club - they are both ranked players and fight for gb.

My issue with child black belts is it gives them a false sense of confidence. If they got into a fight then in their head they are a black belt in whatever it is. They quickly learn that standing in a line doing hand drills and kicks will not help them in an actual fight. Judo at least they learn to actually spar against a resisting opponent when they do randori.

I am pulling my son out of Matt Fiddes - its a business, not affiliated, not federated, branded, a 9 yr old a judge - huh and a black belt; the technique for sparring was chaos; the refs were chaotic and well .. not impressed but MF .. nice house/s, cars, Michael Jackson is dead, no blanket is not your son .. . full of BS!