Father of my children does not want to marry me!

[Jessil91]

So my BF of almost ten years who I live with and have two lovely children with does not believe in marriage. This wasn’t made clear to me til a few a days ago when we were for talking about it ( I just kind of assumed we would get married at some point given circumstances). I’ve never been a massive marriage advocate per se but I can’t help but feel really depressed and down about it, like he doesn’t want me or take our relationship seriously. I know that may sound silly since we have children together but I can’t help how I feel. There’s this feeling of rejection, like the man I love doesn’t love me enough to marry me. I communicated this with him and he turned round and said that his not believing in marriage is not personal and that he felt a little offended because I seemed more bothered about marriage then just being with him. But that’s not the case, I just believe in marriage and what it stands for and I want to legalise our relationship. I must add that he’s a great Dad and we have a healthy relationship otherwise.

Am I being stupid??? Any advice would be greatly appreciated !!

www.gov.uk/inherits-someone-dies-without-will

I am so glad we married pre - DC - I said I wanted that and at time unmarried fathers didn't get PR even when on birth certificate, so he could see it was in his interests as well.

It's been impossible to get wills done yet, lots of push back advice not to behind my back from his family the cost used as a reason not to and it took second house to get my name on deeds despite it being me saved the deposit though now we are joint tenants – I think any way it should all go to the survive one of us though the buying solictors weren't in favour of that for some reason.

I've also ended up a SAHM despite not really expecting to - which I loved- and it went on longer than I expected.

I would try and see if the issue is the wedding rather than the marriage – if so registry office could be a way forward. If not get wills done and get financially independent as possible – if that’s an issue for him then you really do have problems.

Also agree about decent child maintenance arrangements.

Not unreasonable to be disappointed. Perhaps U to infer the mmeanings that you have. Such as how he doesn't take your relationship seriously etc. To some people it is just a piece of paper.

Thank you for all your comments.

For those of you that commented on security/financial factors - we live in the UK so there are many ways to protect yourself without being married and we have taken these precautions. He is on the birth certificate so he we both have parental responsibility meaning, if we split up it is by law that he pays for the children. I must add that I have no concerns here on a personal level. He’s the most doting father a person could ask for, he adores our children and I have no doubt whatsoever that he would always do the right thing by us and them.

We had a will done a few years ago confirming that if one of us dies, then the other gets all of the Others finances/assets.

We have life insurance, so if one of us goes The mortgage is taken care of and the the living partner owns the house out right with no financial obligation.

I work part time but I wouldn’t say I was entirely financially dependent on him. I still earn a pretty decent wedge.

The house is in both our names and we both contributed 50% of the deposit so everything is even.

Financially, everything is taken care of and I genuinely have no concerns in the event of us splitting up. He’s a devoted father and a good person. If you met him you’d understand what I mean. He one of life’s wholesome nice people who hasn’t a bad bone in his body.

On the topic of not discussing marriage before having children - my first child wasn’t planned, I was only 24 (we’d been together since we were 19). The first thing we discussed was parental responsibility and drawing up a will and just securing ourselves that way. At the time I was shocked I was pregnant and coming to terms with the fact we were going to be parents. We had a serious discussion about our relationship and becoming a domestic partnership and spending the rest of lives together and decided to go for it and have a child together, since then we’ve had another.

This is where I feel a little misled: We’ve ”mentioned” marriage over the years and agreed that we can’t afford a wedding right now so not had a proper discussion. We’ve gone as far as talking about what kind of wedding we’d have etc. We just agreed to do it when we have the money for the wedding we want. Then the other night he said he doesnt believe in it. We’re both atheists so point blank would never have had a religious wedding. But then He started saying that it’s just a piece of paper and that we’ve taken care of everything financially so why bother. The kids have his surname but he said I can change there surname to mine because he just doesn’t care about that kind of thing.

Since my last thread, we talked a bit more. He Went on to say that whilst he doesn’t believe in marriage he’ll do it for me if it’s that important to me.

Here’s where I am even more confused: I then went on to say that I don’t want a big wedding, just go to the registry office and get it over with. And he then went on say that there no point in doing it if we don’t have a proper wedding!!!!! I’m sorry but I just don’t get it! Surely he’d be in favour of just keeping it low key of he doesn’t believe in marriage.

He also then went on to say that he thought I didn’t believe in marriage either. Apparently I said something along those lines when I was younger. I probably did but I was young and we have two children together. And surely the fact that we’ve talked about weddings and stuff is an indication that I do.

Obviously we should have talked about this properly but I can’t help but feel a bit misled.

Maybe Im being stupid

Personally I think you are being a bit silly in your assumption he doesn't take the relationship seriously but can understand the feeling of rejection.

I also don't believe in marriage & DP has been married before so isn't that bothered either - we have been together 11 years & have a joint mortgage so there's no lack of commitment we just don't see don't the point in it (we aren't religious & don't want children).

We have visited a solicitor & made water tight wills & have power of attorney etc but unfortunately we'll probably have to get married one day just to make things easier legally/financially if anything happens to one of us in our (hopefully) ripe old age.

I think any way it should all go to the survive one of us though the buying solictors weren't in favour of that for some reason.

I would advise listening to the solicitors who have years of experience in sorting ot out when it all goes wrong. They are more than likely not bullying but trying to make you see sense in the protection of your children.

How many times do we see threads on here about disinherited kids??

You die, you leave all to DH. Widowed DH finds a new wife - no love lost between her and your kids who are in 20s now and have left home. When DH dies he leaves it all to his new DW who "promises" to pass it on to the kids - but never does - especially if she has her own kids. Your poor kids

In my view, marriage is a crock of shit. He asked and I said 'no'. But I'd remain financially independent, demand he did 50% of the domestic labour and never give any DCs his surname. I agree that a civil partnership is the way to go and wholeheartedly supported the recent campaign. It always amazes me the way that MNetters see a piece of paper as protecting them financially when it actually offers very little (as any visit to the relationships thread where naice married women still have to sell their homes upon divorce shows.

I don’t want to sound mean here but you’ve been with him for 10 years, you have 2 children with him and marriage has never cropped up in conversation before now? I met my husband at 21, even quite early on we talked about values and things just generally, not in a way that would frighten you off early on! I knew he at some point wanted to get married and to have children, so did I, we didn’t know if it’d be with each other at that point but we were on the same page. I think it’s just a chat you have. I couldn’t imagine getting 10years into a relationship and discovering he didn’t believe in or want marriage if I did!

Ok. He has behaved rather badly in not mentioning his opposition to marriage until now then. That's something that should really have come up in one of the discussions. But what exactly was said about getting married, when it was mentioned?

Also, does he earn more than you?

There are legal reasons that make marriage still the sensible thing to do, especially when you have children. If anything were to happen to one of you, everything would automatically pass to the other with zero legal difficulties. This is not the case if you are just co-habiting. Look into that aspect. From a purely pragmatic and sensible point of view, in the UK it is still better to get married.

OP, he’s said that he’ll get married to you if you want to. I’d definitely take him up on that! Don’t worry about the lack of a big romantic proposal - that sort of thing is a bit irrelevant after 10 years and 2 kids. Just pick a date and start planning!

Hi OP. I was in the same position with my partner, who said similar things to your DP about not believing in marriage. We'd been together 10 years too and have a DD.

I basically forced the issue last year and we're now getting married this year with a low key civil ceremony at the registry office. I admit that I do have "daft romantic notions" about marriage still, but more than that I realised that I need to make sure myself and my DD are protected. I've been a SAHM and am in a hideously vulnerable position financially.

After a lot of reading up on here, stressing and panicking at 3am (honestly - the anxiety would keep me awake nightly) I told my DP that I wanted to get married and I was honest about the reasons why - that I do feel it means something at an emotional level but that it's more importantly a contract and we need financial security. I've been VERY naive throughout my life about financial matters. Always assuming that things would somehow magically work out without much input from me. They don't of course, unless you make them.

Anyway, perhaps surprisingly my partner agreed with what I said, and now he seems quite excited about marriage. I'm fully aware though that what I've described is a rubbish, poorly planned and thought out way to live your life and everyone here is right of course. It is SO much better to have the discussion early on and be on the same page about marriage, but clearly there are folk like you and me who are balloon animals who haven't done that and now need to deal with it.

I think that more than enough time has passed and you should sit down with your DP and talk through all the issues. If marriage is off the table and you decide that's not a deal-breaker, then you need to get the legal/financial protections in place as much as you can to make sure that you aren't vulnerable. The advice from everyone on this thread and elsewhere on here is good and sound (I just didn't follow any of it until I stumbled across MN and started engaging my brain and prizing my head out of the sand). Try not to panic though - just work it through and get it sorted x

... sorry I cross posted with your update

@Jessil91 - doing wills is great but are you aware that without power of attorney if anything happened to one of you & (god forbid) you are on life support it would NOT be your partners decision what happens to you ?

letsgohooray
From a purely pragmatic and sensible point of view, in the UK it is still better to get married. - No, not necessarily. It really does depend on circumstances.

Co-habitors do not qualify for bereavement benefits on their partner’s death and their children will not benefit from their remaining parent receiving widowed parent’s allowance. A married partner can leave everything to their surviving spouse with NO INHERITANCE TAX TO PAY, whereas unmarried couples would benefit from the normal allowances, but after that they are likely to pay 40 per cent tax marriage the surviving spouse can also inherit their partner's inheritance tax allowance, meaning they can leave £650,000-worth of cash and potentially £350,000-worth of property to their heirs tax-free. That's a massive benefit and it is not available to unmarried couples.

OP you may think yourself protected financially and legally but there are a few glaring flags in the summary you just posted. For one, what about pensions? as his girlfriend (yes, in law, that's what you are) you wouldn't necessarily be the beneficiary if he dies before taking his pension. Same with death in service benefits offered by his employer. What about being next of kin in terms of medical decisions?

As his wife, in all of those scenarios, you have more authority/automatic rights, as he would if you die or are incapacitated.

Otherwise, you're in the grey area where his parents or other close relative could lay claims - or be dealing with a bureaucratic nightmare with organisations like insurers/pensions providers etc even if his relatives are lovely when he does become ill, have an accident or dies. (and yes, i mean WHEN not IF).

seriously, you are not as protected legally and financially as you think - marriage or a civil partnership are the ONLY ways to properly alleviate some of these risks.

speak to an IFA or lawyer if you want to verify any of this - you should have considered this years ago, and so should your partner... you are BOTH in risky positions here.

Just to echo other posters, hetero civil partnerships are coming in at the end of the year and I will be getting one with my partner who similarly doesn't 'believe' in marriage. I told him it does really exist, but no dice! 😂 But he's happy to have a CP, it's even (slightly) less fuss than a registry office wedding. Maybe chat to yours about that option.

etsgohooray you're right to point out the inheritance tax aspect too, good point. add to that HMRC's Marriage Allowance that married couples can claim if they meet other criteria.. the list goes on.

Financially and legally, there is no easier or more beneficial setup than being legally married (or in a civil partnership), it's as simple as that OP.

letsgo As I said - it depends on circumstances. If you have nothing to leave then IHT is a red herring. If you are on benefits then you are better off staying single. If you set up trusts , pass wealth on to DC in other ways then IHT less of a problem. If you leave it to DP minus IHT and he then leaves it to DC then the IHT is still payable so it depends. (But I am not a lawyer so could be wrong here)

Benefits are a bit swings and roundabouts but you are right about the ones you mention as far as I know.

I have named my DC as beneficiaries of pension benefits. My ex DP named me.

I think the ship has sailed on this marriage, its not going to happen. The time to nail this down is before you have kids it's a bit late to start discussing it now!

Because personally it's easier having the same surname as the children.

I understand this but why can't the children and the man have Mams surname? I really do understand why families all like to have the same surname but I don't think it's a coincidence that it's still the majority of women expected to do the changing of the name.

My brother for eg thinks it's very important he has the same name as his wife and child but not important enough for him to be the one to "choose" it and he'll admit himself it's because he doesn't to hassle of paperwork and contacting banks etc etc. He's very sexist in other ways too though and I don't know his wife puts up with him sometimes.

From a purely pragmatic and sensible point of view, in the UK it is still better to get married. - No, not necessarily. It really does depend on circumstances.

If there are previous relationships with children and or substantial assets there can be good reasons not to marry - or marry very clear wills taking everything into account. There was a radio 4 program about will recently and a solicitor saying well thought through wills and being clear with family what's happening was his advice.

I think the reason our solicitor for house buying didn’t like the automatic partner inheriting way we bought the house was because it would be possible for me or DH to die and for one of us to then to remarry and leave house to new wife and when they died it go to the step kids. If we’d bought is as 50% we could then leave our 50% to however we wanted and the spouse a lifetime interest.