AIBU to wonder why it has become so impossible to get a Doctor's appointment?

[Bluebananas01]

I remember when I was a child in the 80's, if you were ill you could always get to see the Doctor the same day. I even remember the Doctor doing a home visit when I had the measles. I called up this week to try and get a Doctor appointment and it is a three-week wait (South East).
Everybody seems to talk about there being no Doctors appointments but what is the real reason? Is it just down to underfunding? Are people not turning up for appointments? A sicker population?

Even when I get to see a Doctor it is as if they are trying to get me out of the surgery asap and heaven forbid if you need a referral. Two years ago I went to the Doctors with joint pain, shooting pains, weight gain etc. I told him that autoimmune disease runs in my family and it felt AI as it came in waves (like flare-ups). He pretty much told me I was a hypochondriac. Asked if I exercise (because of the weight gain) and when I told him 6 days a week he told me to take up yoga and sent me packing.

Fast forward to this year when I was going overseas with my husband to his place of birth where it is super cheap to see consultants and have blood tests done. My symptoms had been progressing so I have blood tests etc and saw a Doctor there and discovered that it wasn't all my mind as suggested by the Doctor and that I actually had:-

Hashimoto's Thyroiditis (Autoimmune underactive thyroid)
Pernicious Anaemia
Severe Vitamin D deficiency.

How the hell did my Doctor miss so many warning flags about my health? I only ever go to the Doctors for smears and pregnancy so hardly one to visit the Doctor for the slightest sniffle.

It makes me wonder how many other people are being fobbed off and are living with a poor quality of life because their Doctor just can't be bothered to give a proper consultation.

Government says they are training more doctors than ever. Probably true. What my friends tells me is that ladies, more of us than ever are successful at getting into medical school (I'm told average is 2/2 x 3/4 ) and once we have babies many of us like to work part time. Therefore, we do t have as full time equivalents more doctors. Add to that the increasing population and that's why we can't get appointments for weeks

My GP surgery. Last count 4 out of the 5 permanent doctors were women and all were classed as part time. Not sure what hours they did though. Good on them I say but is part of the problem!!

I think that you had a very vague presentation and 'watch and wait' is a legitimate approach.

Please can you tell me what was vague when I told my Doctor that I had been suffering from the following symptoms for a couple of months:

Fatigue
Joint pain
Nerve pain -shooting pains that would jump around my body
Weight gain despite tracking food intake and exercising 6 days a week
That I had been taking strong pain killers for over a week and the pharmacist had told me to see my GP if I needed to take them for longer than 3 days.
I told him my mother had RA diagnosed at age 36 and that my symptoms feel almost autoimmune as my symptoms would come in waves (like an AI flareup).

I was told to keep taking the strong painkillers (Co codamal)
I was told that it was in my mind and that I was just worried because my Mum had an AI disease and I was automatically thinking I would have it.
I was told I need to take up yoga.
When I asked if the pains could be due to something like Fibromyalgia he told me in his words 'he had never heard of it'
Whether my actions after this were right or wrong is not my question. My question is why would I have been treated like this? I can't see that this was an appropriate consultation at all.

As it turned out I was partly correct, I actually had 2 autoimmune diseases, Hashimoto's and Pernicious Anaemia but was sent away with a flea in my ear and treated like a nuisance. I felt very low at this time and should have gone back but it really made me question my judgement. He sowed a very powerful seed that it was just in my mind. I was also scared that there was something seriously wrong with me so in some ways its suited me to take onboard his thoughts that it was all in my mind and to go away and take up yoga. Should I really have to battle with my GP with such a wide array of symptoms? It wasn't as if I went to the Doctors as soon as it started, I had observed and self-managed for two months.
I did take up Yoga.
It didn't help.
Instead of patient blaming, please tell me. Is this good practice?

camel
Yes, let's waste more money on something that's even Nigel Farage said will make us poorer.

But then, he wants to sell of the NHS anyway...so all part of the plan.

Population growth
People not turning up for appointments
Gordon Brown meddling with doctors pensions so they retire earlier
I was told by a specialist doctors do not want to live in ‘challenging’ areas so if you live somewhere nice you get better doctors
People being unreasonable/violent/drugged up

The UK has about 2.8 doctors per 1000 people compared to a European average of 3.4 doctors (www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/11271216/UK-has-fewer-doctors-than-almost-every-EU-country.html).

An extra 0.6 doctors per 1000 people would make a massive difference. An average GP has a list of 1600 patients (practiceindex.co.uk/gp/blog/appointments-patients-ratio-complicated-matter/) so an extra 0.6 doctors per 1000 people would be equivalent to DOUBLING the number of GPs available (0.6×1600=960).

Four and a half weeks to see my amazing GP here (South West England). He is kind, patient and the best listener you could ask for. No problem whatsoever in referring me for a blood test or to physio when I had back pain.

He is always running 45-60 mins behind because he takes his time, but is one of the founders of the practice so long established and everyone knows this so just takes a book or catches up with neighbours in the waiting room.

OP you get good and bad everywhere. I've seen other doctors there over the years and not been happy with what they've said or how they make me feel, so I get a second opinion. You absolutely should have done this with all your symptoms!

In our area you can get same day or next day appointments quite easily and within a week for non-urgent ones. Good minor injuries unit, emergency dentist also v easy to access. There are places it's all still working.

My GP surgery is very good however 7 of the 8 GPs are part time so, other than emergency appointments, it can mean a 1-2 week wait but the main issue appears to be patients not turning up. Every month they put up the number of people who have not appeared and it is always 3 figures . And that’s with a text reminder service !

Of course it’s not too many people! It’s that we don’t have the right ratio of doctors/ nurses and other support teams for the number of people. With the number of doctors and nurses leaving, there are not enough being trained, in addition to which we need an increase in real terms. Underfunding and austerity is responsible. Same as the schools and the mental health service . Not enough people to do the work that needs to be done. It is a scandal in a country of our wealth.

Blue you’ve just described my symptoms almost exactly, except I also have hair loss, 1/3 of my back is numb to the touch which is spreading, constant neuropathy in both legs and hands (which has spread over the last 18 months), carpal tunnel, zero sex drive.... on and on.

They’ll take blood tests and that’s it.
If I get private tests done, they treat me like I’m crazy.
I just want to feel well.

Anyone who says “why didn’t you go back?” does not understand how some doctors can make you feel when you are suffering from symptoms like this.

Sorry, I jumped to wrong conclusions. As it now turns out you are spouting the stuff if hard Brexiteers who don't care about planning, then yes I suppose dragging the 'waste' into every thread makes sense.

But for those of us with a tad more common sense, there is probably a wider acceptance that planning is needed, and effectiveness can only be judged post-hoc. And of course, some blame the hard Brexiteers for making it all considerably mire expensive.

But back to the point of the thread - as OP and other posters note, this has been going on for years (utterly unrelated to Brexit timetable, especially the GP retirement age demographics). I think the GO contract of the early 00s was particularly detrimental - it changed the nature of the GP role considerably and choked off the numbers of doctors who chose general practice as their specialism.

And yes it us a specialist in it's own right. But people often don't see it as such, which always strikes me as a shame. Because unlike the thousands on in-jokes between other specialties, that one seems to have crept into a wider-population view in a way that tends to undervalue.

Anyone who says “why didn’t you go back?” does not understand how some doctors can make you feel when you are suffering from symptoms like this
Thank you SinkGirl for understanding. Some of the symptoms of Hashi's and PA is depression and anxiety. I felt so low like I was drowning that I had no energy to do battle with my GP, but why should I have to? I was very clear, to the point and polite with the Doctor,I should not have been treated like that.
Good luck to you, I had carpal tunnel from Hashi's and it was one of the first things to clear when I started medication. I hope you get to the bottom of your symptoms soon x

It makes me so glad that I pay to see the gp here. £45 a time is steep but I can pretty much be guaranteed to see a gp (maybe not my preferred one) same day if I need to.

We also pay for prescriptions here too.

It makes me so glad that I pay to see the gp here. £45 a time is steep but I can pretty much be guaranteed to see a gp (maybe not my preferred one) same day if I need to

I paid for my own treatment overseas in the end and within 48 hours I had seen GP, had an array of blood tests, seen an Endocrinologist and been given a prescription. It left me feeling, how easy was that to resolve? Compared to the battles we have to face even to get an appointment in the UK. But for me, it would have been nice to have treated with respect by the UK GP in the same way I was polite and respectful to him.

In my surgery, you can usually get an emergency appointment within a day or two, but a routine one may be a few weeks.

I think the problem is too few gps, too many patients and too much demands. There are so many conditions out there which can be treated nowadays. Also, some people go to their gp for the most ridiculous thing, which can be treated at home, with something from the pharmacy etc. Some people expect a miracle cure from their gp for any minor ailment.

Not enough GPs, or doctors generally. Aging population. GPs being likely to be in the crazy tax hole where they'd pay HMRC for doing extra sessions, or would be better off working part time than "full" time.

Being a much maligned part of the medical profession probably doesn't help morale, retention or recruitment either!

Everyone who says too many people/growing population. You are not wrong, but you are not completely right either.

It's a combination of factors. Population grown and we are losing GPs. In 2017 there was slightly over 34k. 2018 there was slightly over 33k.
Population of 66 mil vs 33k of GPs.

Plus people go to doctors with simple sniffles and sores. Can't believe gov has to make ads to tell people to go to pharmacy first with minor issues.

I work for a gp and have done for nearly 30 years. We now only have 500 more patients what we had thirty years ago and have an extra gp.

The reason you can't get an app now is people's expectations and lack of self care. People now come immediately to the gp for things they wouldn't have done 30 years ago thus appointments going quicker.

Another reason is people are generally on more medication now which need monitoring. For example 30 years ago it was unusual for someone to me on three medications. Now it's not unusual to be on 15.

Easy to get an appointment where I am, same day or next day or 2 depending on what it is for, North East

as to you not thinking it's due to cuts - why do you think you are 'fobbed off' with a nurse ???? Because did to cuts there is no money for doctors and no bugger wants to do it anyway because the job is truly awful now...

The second point is more significant than the first. There is money to employ doctors, but when posts are advertised - especially in GP and emergency medicine - nobody applies. There are parts of the country (especially in Wales) where many patients will soon have no access to a GP as practices are closing when partners retire.

My Gp runs a phone consultation system which means you get to speak to a doctor on the same day. If they consider your symptoms to be urgent they see you within a few hours. Some GP practices are badly run because there is no excuse to make patients wait for weeks to be seen.

For people saying why don't you go back, it doesn't always work. I went back many times as I felt so ill and was just fobbed off over and over. All my blood tests were coming up red (ferritin and most vitamins through the floor), they prescribed me some but it was making no difference. I had constant debilitating stomach pain; i was there in tears doubled over frequently and they just put me on acid reducers and said i was making a fuss over indigestion. I was repeatedly accused of being depressed and/ or not taking what they were giving me.

In the end I was taken into hospital hallucinating with the pain. I don't remember much for a few days. It was discovered I had coeliac disease which the GP had never even bothered testing for. By this time my BMI was 16, I was so severely malnourished, I had gallbladder problems and my pancreas was packing up.

Im so much better now but I still have problems two years on because of how delayed the diagnosis was. I really get it, OP. There's an up to 7 week wait (yes, 7!) to see a GP at our surgery and when you go you are only allowed to talk about one problem. I think that was another factor in them missing it because I'd go complaining of stomach pain and the minute I said "and I also have constant pins and needles, I'm so exhausted and weak and ..." they'd give me stomach medication, stop me and say "make another appointment for that" and I'd have another 7 week wait. Yet coeliac disease is often a multi system disorder. When I kept going back for different things, instead of tying them together I was told I was depressed.

I'm still angry and upset over it. I will have lifelong problems now because I was ignored and because of the way the GP system runs nowadays. I was seriously failed by the NHS.

Wow @Eastmidlandsgps I was considering setting something similar up local to me. I am an hcp and have long realised a large proportion of my patients are lonely and isolated so the gp s must be worse. Would love to know how your research goes?

I'm in the South West (Bristol) so large population.

My surgery are fantastic. My dd has had a run of problems recently and I've always managed to see a GP the same day. It's heavily triaged by the trained Receptionists, however I would never ring up for anything non-serious for a day appt. If it's not urgent it's a 2 week wait but you can choose your GP.

Both myself and my dd have been referred on many times.

I think you're unlucky in your area OP.

There's a thread on here somewhere about women being fobbed off by doctors and not taken seriously. There are so many incidents of men being treated differently. Definitely worth a read but unfortunately I don't know how to find the thread. Maybe someone can link it.