re: employer's approach to my work related stress & complaint?

[atempusername]

I am off on sick leave and I am due to go back to my GP and request an extension (on Occupational Health advice) as I do not feel any better, OH say I'm still unfit for work, and the matter is not resolved.

There are few things I am not happy about regarding my employer's approach to my sick leave and I just wanted to know if IABU to be unhappy with their approach? I am off for work related stress caused by bullying and discrimination from my manager.

When I emailed my manager to say I was on sick leave and exactly why I was on sick leave, I also cc her manager in and put a request in that he, and only he, be the one to keep in touch with me during my sickness absence. It was my manager who initially responded to me, with a nasty defensive response and another discriminatory statement about my disability.

The next day, I got a better worded email, a short one, but still from her, requesting a meeting with her and her manager. I declined, stating that I was self certifying for a week and planning to see my doctor (who subsequently gave me a fit note). I also said "we clearly have different versions of events". A simple two sentence response from me.

I got a third email, again from her, asking me to tell her the date, time, location of my GP appointment and name of my GP. Also asking me to call her afterwards. I provided the date , time and location but did say I did not see why she needed to know this. I also requested again that all contact from here on in, came from her manager or HR.

4th email - this time from her manager. Asking me to keep in touch. Asking to refer me to OH. Offering to facilitate a meeting between myself and my manager. Apologising for not being in touch sooner but email on his phone wasn't working? (he was sending other emails) . I responded simply agreeing to the OH referral.

In the OH referral, she was very nice and expressed surprise that HR have not gotten involved yet, considering it includes discrimination, although I have not indicated yet that I wanted to raise a formal grievance (thinking about it). I have also contacted Acas who also said HR should have been in touch.

My union rep is being useless and saying just deal with it informally but I do not think informal is working, plus I know from experience that informal means "brushed under the carpet". My family are worried about the repercussions of a formal approach and are also encouraging me sending lots of emails back and forth instead.

Meanwhile I'm not sleeping, I'm having regular panic attacks, my manager is continuing to harrass me / badmouth me whilst I'm on sick leave (can't go into details as its outing) and I am just not at all happy with the approach so far.

AIBU?

bump? anyone?

Are you dealing with your union at regional level?

Keep records of anything harassing/ discriminatory. Be explicit about why you are off work and start a formal grievance if it can be evidenced.

Maybe move this over to legal?

I think it depends who you work for really, do you have a proper HR department?

Sounds horrible though so big hugs.

Speak to your branch secretary first to explain that you don’t feel supported. If that doesn’t work ask to talk to your regional organiser. If you are in unison they specifically want to get involved in disability discrimination cases.

Also the first approach would always be to deal with these kind of things informally, but that obviously depends on the discrimination and history. The only other option is a grievance, but that does come with risks. You need to also be clear on what you want to get out of it. An apology? Your manager to receive training? Many want a new manager, I’ve never seen this happen (I was subject to a grievance where this was requested), but others on here have said it does - depends on the reputation of the manager.

If you go down the grievance route it won’t be nice and is incredibly stressful, this is possibly why your rep is suggesting to try and resolve it in another way.

You might get a better response if you ask for this to be moved to Employment (lots of HR and employment people over there)...

Your manager does sound a bit gung ho and asking for additional/unncessary details that make it seem as though she's suspicious of your sickness, but obviously there's a much bigger back story here. As to your next in line manager and HR dept, they seem a bit as though they feel the ball's in your court and they are waiting for the results of the OH assessment and/or you to put in a formal grievance before deciding their next move. Speaking as an HR person myself, this is how a lot of organisations would handle this situation, not saying it's right but that's how it often goes.

It's going to be very hard for anyone online to tell you whether it's worth pursuing this formally without knowing the full facts and what evidence you have to back up the complaints of bullying/discrimination/harassment and also what you are hoping for as an outcome. If ultimately you want to stay in this role informal resolution may be worth pursuing, it doesn't have to be a case of 'swept under the carpet' but both parties do have to approach the process with a genuine desire to make the relationship work and this will probably mean changes on both sides, if you feel this situation is too far gone for that to work then your only option may be to pursue formal action and/or to leave and look for another job. I'm afraid it's a stressful process and not one that always ends happily or satisfactorily for the complainant, particularly if a lot of your evidence is open to interpretation or based on 'he said she said' conversations where the other party can simply deny what was said... sorry to be blunt, hope it works out for you...

my union rep is a colleague

I do have evidence, yes, although I am still concerned that the 'misunderstanding' and 'open to interpretation' argument could be used.

My manager has already completely denied saying things that she definitely did but unfortunately verbally. Extremely offensive things, including racist things. Even an informal approach could be a he said / she said thing. I do have some evidence in writing and I can't let this go unresolved but I am very nervous about my options.

What result/resolution would you like from this? Did you see yourself going back to working under this manager again? Have you brought up any of these issues at any time in the past or is this the first time you have said something?

I have brought up several things in the past (and can evidence this) but there are some new issues also. I can also evidence that previous OH recommendations were not followed re adjustments.

In terms of outcomes, I would like adjustments in place all the time, not just for some situations. I'd like disability awareness training for my team. I'd like an apology. I'd like a note of my complaint on record to reduce the chances of this happening again. I'd like a new manager but same job (I have had a different manager to others in the team before so I can't see why it wouldn't be possible). If I didn't have a new manager, the possibility of my becoming unwell / stressed again, would be very high. I cannot trust her. She lies and bullies.

Have you launched a formal grievance against your manager?

Stop sending emails for now, you’re off with work related stress, amd all this to and fro of emails will not be helping you. Give yourself a chance to have some distance from it, and then contact work when you feel fit to go back to discuss it.

It’s very hard to comment without the full facts, but I too would be wary about the grievance process unless you have conclusive, written evidence. I raised a grievance about unfair treatment under the part time working hours directive. It was found in my favour, HR formally apologised. 6 weeks later I was made redundant. My lawyer advised me that whilst I would probably win a tribunal, it would be expensive, stressful and would probably cost more than the £100k + I received as a redundancy pay out. I took the money and ran.

just informal at the moment but I need it resolved before I can feel well enough to return to work but no one from work seems that interested in resolving it, just denying it!

ACAS and EHRC said to make it formal and to get a lawyer. My family and union rep say not to.

Here’s my experience if the process in a similar situation. When I was off in similar circs, I called HR and told them I was off, explained why and said I was going to docs. I was then given an HR person as my point of contact and they referred me to OH to see what they could do to help. I spoke only to the HR person before I went back to work (manager was told not to contact me) and had a meeting with them to detail my issues. When I decided to go back to work I then had a pre-meeting with them and the troublesome manager to lay down clear guidance for my phased return and continuing OH appts.

This was easier for me to do though as I had a close working relationship with HR to start with so I was speaking to someone I knew and who knew the dynamics of the team and the difficulties therein. Secondly it was a big company with documented processes for this situation so it just swung into play.

I went back and got a new job. Manager had a well-known reputation for going thru staff and nothing had been done so far so I wasn’t going to hang about and tolerate it further. I was happy with this decision and thrived in my next role.

I would be insisting on no contact at all from your manager while you work this out. Best of luck.

Hi OP I'm sorry you're going through this. Your employer is clearly in the wrong, but I guess proof is hard. Can you speak to someone in hr or speak to your boss's boss so it's more informal (compared to something in writing) to ask for advice on where you go from here. No way your manager should be contacting you when you're off with stress caused by her

You need the support of a union rep at a higher level.

I would suggest you ask MN to move this to the Employment Board