To think there should be tighter controls on mortgages for buy to lets?

[ovidivo]

Surely stopping people from having mortgages for buy to lets would make properties more affordable for people. I'd see this stretch to corporate land lords too.

If people couldn't buy to let because there were no btl mortgages, that might well put downward pressure on house prices for owner occupiers.

As a renter, I say good. But renters are still in a minority in Britain. Only when that changes will the housing situation change.

Registration is a start but we need more. I suggest nobody should be a landlord who has
- a criminal conviction
*- an unspent bankruptcy notice,
- three or more enforcement actions re unfit properties against their name

That woyld be incredibly easy to circumvent though, property would just be registered in family or spouses names.

Are we going to do the same for tenants though ? If they trash a house can they be charged with criminal damage ? If they are bankrupt that’s it, no line of credit for you, pay rent in advance only and three properties tenancy agreements not complied with ... that’s it you are done for.

Registration is a start but we need more. I suggest nobody should be a landlord who has
- a criminal conviction
- an unspent bankruptcy notice
- three or more enforcement actions re unfit properties against their name

for starters.

The Scottish system should be a template as they have a 'fit & proper' person set up.

Your local authority then checks to ensure you are a suitable person to let property. To establish that you are “fit and proper”, it takes account of any evidence that you have:

• Committed some serious offences (including fraud, dishonesty, violence, drugs, firearms and sexual)
• Practiced unlawful discrimination in connection to any business
• Contravened any law relating to housing, or landlord and tenant law, and your actions (or your failure to act) in relation to any antisocial behaviour affecting a property you already let.

The local council here have had a pilot scheme the last couple of years that I'm part of. If you register with them, charge a reasonable rent and have your property inspected to show it's of an acceptable standard and also show you have all your gas certs etc in place then they keep a list of registered landlords. It means when anyone is looking and asks them for housing then if they don't have social housing available they can point people in the direction of private ll's. It's become a bit of a thing locally that ll's who are not registered (because it really doesn't take much) are avoided more if possible as it suggests a reason for them not to be.

Tenants aren't providing housing. It's a policy matter that provision of housing be done by a fit and proper person.

I do think the criminal damage clause is going to be used more and more as will a blacklist type register

Are we going to do the same for tenants though ? If they trash a house can they be charged with criminal damage ? If they are bankrupt that’s it, no line of credit for you, pay rent in advance only and three properties tenancy agreements not complied with ... that’s it you are done for.

That's what malacious damages cover on your landlords insurance is for.

That sounds sensible lyralalala. Hope it gets introduced into the rest of the UK.

If it’s malicious damage they should be charged and have a criminal conviction as they would with any other type of vandalism

So if there were regulations stopping anyone buying to let there would be far less rentals available Would this reduce housing prices?
We brought out first home back in 1980 all our friends also brought their homes Renting hardly existed apart from council properties Quite a few of of friends went on to self build You could then purchase a large plot for around 9k
All down to the price of property renting was not a viable option
Our first house was £12k incomes obviously were not as high as they are now but the ratio of income to mortgage was much lower We did not even take my salary into account
So would no rentals reduce house prices ?

Or malicious damage cover even.

@Ivegotbills The scottish system looks much better in terms of registration. Although there's a different tenancy type there as well now which is causing issues I believe so not perfect.

@rosie1959 The main difference is the lack of social housing. The only way to get rid of the private rental market entirely would be to build enough social housing that people who can't (or don't want) buy can rent from the council/ha.

My husband is military, we bought a house to get on the ladder as we don't want to wait until he leaves in case house prices outstrip what we can save. If he is posted we will need to rent it out and go back into military quarters. We couldn't afford to buy a house on each posting, the fees alone would cripple us. Not to mention when he is posted to areas like London where house prices are too high for his wages (no London allowance in the last base we were at). So we aren't looking to profiteer, we just want to keep up with our mortgage payments so we can keep our own home and have stability in retirement. We would be completely reliant on a BTL mortgage.

We would be completely reliant on a BTL mortgage.

Yours isn’t a BTL mortgage surely?

Are we going to do the same for tenants though ? If they trash a house can they be charged with criminal damage ? If they are bankrupt that’s it, no line of credit for you, pay rent in advance only and three properties tenancy agreements not complied with ... that’s it you are done for.

That's what malacious damages cover on your landlords insurance is for.

So, if your car is stolen and the culprits known, you’d be happy for them to be let off scott free because you’d be covered on your car insurance?

The total hatred for landlords on MN is really weird....

@ILoveMaxiBondi we would be if he is posted, he's due to be posted next year so we will be then (when he finally makes the decision as to whether he is staying in or coming out!)

Unless I've misunderstood, I thought a mortgage changes to a BTL when you start renting the house out? I appreciate we aren't buying a house to let it out, though I know plenty of military couples who do so to get on the ladder when they're not able to live in one place or where they're posted.

Most people don’t have a bit to let mortgage, they gave a standard mortgage with permission to let,
Which may or may not attract a premium

No it doesn’t change to a BTL mortgage fed, you just need permission from your lender to let the property.

So, if your car is stolen and the culprits known, you’d be happy for them to be let off scott free because you’d be covered on your car insurance?

The total hatred for landlords on MN is really weird.

My comment about the damages cover was in response to the suggestion that said damage, and lack of ability to make them pay, could cause a LL to end up with the three strikes and out situation.

Damages to a property shouldn't lead to a ll renting it out to another person in a bad condition because it should be covered by insurance or savings.

Hardly a LL hating comment given that just two comments previously I discussed being a landlord...

@ILoveMaxiBondi I'm so glad I'm on mumsnet! Thank you!

There has been lots of discussions, moves by the current government to remove the incentive to be a landlord. Stamp duty on second homes, increasing tenants rights, changing taxation. All of these are aimed at landlords and are more universal in their affects than BLT mortgages. We own multiple properties changes to BTL mortgages would have zero affect on us we own all outright. We are not unusual. Letting on a residential mortgage is generally for a year, lenders will not provide permission to let indefinitely, so assumptions that most landlords who do borrow do not have BTL mortgages is incorrect.

The best change for tenants would be a tightening of laws associated with their behaviours. Most of our tenants are brilliant but we have had some who are dreadful. We charge higher rents to cover the costs we incur when a bad tenant sneaks through our checks.

That wouldn't increase the amount of FTB property available. Making BTL mortgages more difficult would cut the amount of rental property, decrease prices and allow more people to buy.

As a long time lurker on mumsnet, I had to join to vent my anger.
There is virtually nothing I despise more than the grotesque self serving buy-to-let epidemic that's sweeping the UK.

I cannot put into words my absolute hatred towards these parasitic free loaders, who through their own greed will happily sleep soundly at night knowing full well that their greed has a detrimental effect on the poor sod that's struggling to get onto the housing ladder.

It is G R E E D, you cannot justify wanting to make money by creating misery for others. I hate them with a passion.

We bought our hose just before the boom, and hardly a day goes by when I don't appreciate my very good fortune. Yes, we struggled like many, overpaid the mortgage and the house was ours several years ago. We both work and the money we save by not paying a mortgage is now used to save for a retirement pension ( we both have fairly low paid jobs in the private sector) Both our cars are ancient, the newest is 17yrs old!
People often ask why we don't dabble in the BTL market... My reason for not is exactly the same reason why I wouldn't dream of kicking someone less fortunate than me. Yes, I'm sure we could stretch ourselves and "get in on it" but our morals and principles make us both turn away.
Most of our work colleagues are stuck in the dreaded cycle of paying someone else's mortgage off so never being able to save up and buy their own. The worst ones are those who have inherited properties and rather than sell, decide "To Let" then use the proceeds to fund another house purchase and so on and so on.

It is vile, I view these parasitic freeloaders with the same contempt as I would view someone who fleeced and OAP or a handicapped person...simply because they can. Their moral compass must be truly distorted by the rich trappings of screwing others.

But what goes around comes around....and eventually (god willing) you will one day realise that money cannot buy everything.

Utterly despise the lot of you!!

I couldn't care less if I'm struck off for saying what I think. The misery you create for others through your own greed is truly disgusting.

I agree that so called "accidental" landlords tend to be the worst people to rent from. Often, they don't really have the money to be landlords, and can't cover unexpected repairs or fulfill their obligations. They often don't understand the rules around renting properly either, and try to do things that are illegal as they still see the property as their home. Landlords who own multiple properties and see it as a business tend to be much better to rent from in general- obviously with some exceptions.

I agree there needs to be more regulation and professionalisation of landlords.

You don't actually even need to make it harder to get BtL. Number of BtL mortgages is falling massively every year and especially now after tax changes. And all that years prices are still going up 🤷‍♀️

@contentedsoul the part about what money can't buy isn't about health, or lives or family, is it. That would be nasty.