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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

That my surgeon was switched?

56 replies

AMBE123 · 12/04/2019 08:16

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Talk AIBU?
That my surgeon was switched1
Today 00:21 AMBE123

Ok so I recently had to have colo-rectal surgery. The surgeon (I'll call him Dr A) came to see me when I was admitted and explained what they were doing, then the anaesthetist came and introduced himself etc. Happy so far and they took me down for the op an hour later. I was a bit puzzled that the doctor didn't come round after the surgery to explain what they'd done, how it went etc as I thought from past experience that this was a thing, but the nurse read his notes and told me what they said before they sent me home.
So this was a week ago and I have just read the discharge letter and it says that another Dr (Dr B) did the surgery. AIBU to feel like I was misled and they switched on me? I know it's the NHS and there's no guarantee of a particular doctor, but I do feel a bit that if a Dr is going to be up my bum doing nasty things while I'm unconscious, the least he could do is introduce himself first.

(What makes it worse is that I met the Dr who it now turns out did the surgery at the previous visit; he was rude, abrupt and I just didn't trust him, which is a very very rare reaction for me.)
I feel like I was deceived about who would be doing the surgery. I know what matters is that whoever does it can do a good job, but it just still doesn't sit right with me.
Any medical people here - is this normal practice in the NHS? I lived abroad for a few years so maybe my expectations got skewed.....

OP posts:
FindYourCentre · 12/04/2019 09:18

The consent form doesn't specify a doctor, its specified the procedure.

They were likely the same team so either you saw the consultant & the registrar did the procedure or vice versa. Fairly standard

Nicolastuffedone · 12/04/2019 09:19

All letters have the consultants name on.....that doesn’t mean it’s actually who you’ll see. They’d never finish an outpatient clinic eg if they had to see everybody! It means he ‘heads’ the team if you like.

kaytee87 · 12/04/2019 09:22

I think this is normal practice. I've had various operations and had various surgeons speak to me beforehand but it's not always them that carry out the surgery.
Shifts change, surgeries take longer than expected, emergencies happen.

havingtochangeusernameagain · 12/04/2019 09:24

Yes OP it does matter. Sometimes you only agree to the surgery because you know who is doing it. I would speak to PALs.

Those of you who think it doesn't matter - it does. Some surgeons are far better qualified than others. It depends on the procedure to an extent but I as an example, if I were having surgery on my back, I would not trust any consultant to do it and have me walkng out of the hospital afterwards as opposed to being in a wheelchair.

I was doing some research for my mother a few weeks ago and came across a court case where one surgeon was supposed to be doing back surgery but on the day someone else did it. The patient did know about the switch but agreed to go ahead because she was on her xth cancellation and didn't want to cancel again. The surgery was botched.

Cheby · 12/04/2019 09:28

There are plenty of good reasons that this might have happened, however there are zero acceptable reasons for not informing the OP in person afterwards before she was discharged.

MrsPear · 12/04/2019 09:29

Did you not get introductions in the ante room - they go round the room confirming everyone’s name and position. Then you confirm name and surgery your having - in my case it was emergency so they confirmed I had children, that h was my legal husband and there second parent plus consent to blood. Bit unnerving tbh but reassuring at the same time. Then put to sleep. I had to have a meeting a couple of weeks later to explain why it took so long and why a senior was called - it was him I met.

Cheby · 12/04/2019 09:29

Also, if it was planned that a reg take over, they should have been on the ward round with Dr A meeting the patients before surgery.

Helynes · 12/04/2019 09:30

I also didn't realise until one of my operations that the consultant doesn't do all the ones on the list. I have had a lot of experience with operations in my family, but had always had the consultant say they have done them in the past. I think it would be nicer if it was explained that there is a team of people.
I only realised when the consultant at my post-op check was explaining about my complications that they had come across in theatre, and said "...and my registrar had to send someone to come and get me from the next door theatre" Up until then, I had assumed that the consultant was doing the op.

BlokeHereInPeace · 12/04/2019 09:31

Bloody hell. The surgery went fine. Move on.

Seniorcitizen1 · 12/04/2019 09:36

I do not understand what your issue is - surely as long as the surgery went well it doesn't matter who did it. YBVU to waste your energy on this

EncroachingLoaf · 12/04/2019 09:41

I really don't get the issue. I've had consultants/aenesthetists talk me through my surgery and write to me...which a registrar then went onto perform with a (different) consultant supervising. It has not even crossed my mind that I was deceived.

Do you think they're all sitting around somewhere laughing gleefully about having tricked you? Confused

Luaa · 12/04/2019 09:46

It may be that regardless of which was the consultant and which was the reg, A assisted and B was the main surgeon. I have seen plenty of op notes where the consultant has assisted and let a reg lead, presumably because this is how the reg gets the experience to get to consultant themselves some day.

As a pp said though, you should have been introduced to the team during the anaesthetic sign in, before you were put to sleep.

The reality of today's NHS is that whilst it may be ideal for the consultant and the reg to speak to the patient on the ward before, it just isn't always possible.

PerryMasonsFriend · 12/04/2019 09:46

I know it's the NHS and there's no guarantee of a particular doctor, but I do feel a bit that if a Dr is going to be up my bum doing nasty things while I'm unconscious, the least he could do is introduce himself first.

It's a bit late for you but I'm posting this for the benefit of other users. Normally you will be given a consent form that says something like "I have not been given a guarantee that any particular doctor/surgeon will perform this procedure."

A consent form like anything else is a contract.

I was once in this position and having something done that was complex. I had seen the most senior consultant and it was important to me that he did my operation because it was complicated.

I crossed out that bit and wrote in that I had been told he was going to do it - but in more legal language - I have legal training.

Obviously I drew it to the attention of the hospital at that point and they were fine with it.

In fact, it was one of the more sensible decisions I have ever made to ensure that this experienced surgeon did my operation.

It's fact sensitive but all I'm saying is that no one faced with a consent form should be afraid to challenge it and say "no this isn't right. I'm expecting Mr/Ms X to do my operation. If they aren't available on the scheduled day then I'll wait." In many cases you may not care but if you have something complicated or unusual then you probably should.

Nesssie · 12/04/2019 10:01

I'd rather not meet the person who would be doing my rectal surgery tbh.

Redken24 · 12/04/2019 10:04

It could be that your Dr A needed further expertise and Dr B had it? Or whatever way round it was.

trixiebelden77 · 12/04/2019 10:07

On consent forms - ours specifically state that another dr may perform the procedure. It is very very common to be consented for a procedure by one dr and another performs the procedure.

Original poster
AMBE123 · 12/04/2019 10:11

Thanks everyone. It's interesting to see the range of opinions but I'm glad to know that this was normal practice, that makes me feel better.
To all those saying 'It went fine, just move on' :. It's not like I've been sitting brooding about it all week, I literally just discovered this last night when I wrote the OP. I'd dug out the paperwork because I'd started bleeding and was waiting at midnight to hear back if I needed to see a doctor. I was just a bit surprised. I totally accept that feeling like they switched on me is a subjective feeling, and I'm just someone who likes to be in control of what happens to me. But I just spent a week thinking I knew exactly who did the surgery - and being pleased it was the consultant I'd previously been impressed with - so it was somewhat of a surprise to find it wasn't him but another surgeon who I'd previously had a strong 'I don't want this person anywhere near me' feeling about. But yes, what ultimately matters is not my feelings, but whether they did a good job, and I'm sure they were perfectly competent.

OP posts:
bobbypinseverywhere · 12/04/2019 10:14

to PPs - it is understandable to 'only want the best' person operating you, but there has to be an understanding that that experience can only come through practice and training.

that means if they never let the junior doctors do anything, you wouldn't have 'the top surgeons' of tomorrow and we would all be screwed. the supervision of these juniors is very monitored tho and they aren't just let loose on you!

keepforgettingmyusername · 12/04/2019 10:19

Oh yeah I had this when I had an oophorectomy , it was a Dr D who talked me through everything and said he wanted to take my ovary out etc but then a mysterious Mr T who did the actual surgery. Turned out Dr D was the head of gynaecology and I think he makes the decisions and tells patients what's happening but doesn't always (ever?) do the actual surgery. I got where I needed to be in the end so figured it didn't really matter who was with me on which step of the journey.

QueenoftheFarts · 12/04/2019 10:21

I didn't like one of my son's bowel surgeons at all. He was an arrogant fucker and utterly patronising.

However, his job was not to be popular, it was to be an excellent bowel surgeon. Which he was.

He insulted my husband but saved our boy.

I think you should focus on your recovery and let go of this. In some countries you would be dealing with insurance and sorting bills right now but thankfully not!

I hope you recover well. Don't let this disappointment over which surgeon went up your bum cloud your recovery.

Honeyroar · 12/04/2019 10:24

My husband has had three major colorectal operations in the last ten months. Years ago he had two more under consultant A. Last year he went in as an emergency and ended up under consultant B, however on the day that he had surgery consultant B was busy so consultant C did the operation. For the fortnight that he was in hospital all three consultants and their teams seemed to work together and all of them came to see him. They decided to transfer him to the care of consultant C, as he'd done the operation. The operation failed, so they scheduled another five months later when things had healed enough to reoperate. Consultant C did the operation, however the operation failed again and he had to have emergency surgery on a Sunday night, and it ended up being Consultant B and a more senior surgeon, consultant D, who did the operation. Officially he remains under consultant C, but we saw more of consultant B afterwards, who is much better at dealing with patients. All very complicated! However it's quite good that a whole team of consultants are involved and discussing the issues.

I hope you get an answer and the bleeding is nothing to worry about.

Sindragosan · 12/04/2019 10:35

From having a csection, there were up to 15 people in the room, including a consultant, 2 doctors, anaesthetists, nurses, pediatric doctors and nurses, midwives and possibly others, its not a one person job, and I'm sure other surgeries can have similar numbers.

I can see how it would be disconcerting to realise that what happened was different from what you thought, but it won't have been one person on their own in surgery with you.

PrincessPee · 12/04/2019 10:46

The unit I work in - has a separate team for electives but this changes daily. We also have the emergency team and our areas of healthcare is very acute - situations change minute by minute. Often you will be consented by 1 doctor but by the time the unit activity is safe , if the doctors have been called away to attend another emergency etc it will often have been a shift change or just another member of the team is free to undertake your procedure. Very very standard - no one has cheated you out of anything as long as they were qualified, competent and safe.

Would be a different story if you were a private patient and paying for a particular doctor - but even then they often have a colleague they work alongside to cover emergencies and holidays etc.

havingtochangeusernameagain · 12/04/2019 10:49

they never let the junior doctors do anything, you wouldn't have 'the top surgeons' of tomorrow and we would all be screwed. the supervision of these juniors is very monitored tho and they aren't just let loose on you

people know the more junior doctors are heavily supervised. That is not the issue. The issue is when you think one surgeon is carrying out the surgery and another does, who isn't as good but is too experienced to be supervised and then botches it. It can and does happen.

If you're having your appendix out it's probably not too much of an issue. Straight-forward operation. As I said above, complex back surgery - you really need to trust the person who is doing it.

ScrewyMcScrewup · 12/04/2019 10:51

I would feel the same but I don't think you should complain or take it further. Hope all is okay and you're recovering well.