'Giving' a birthday present but on loan terms

[AppleCiderVinegar]

My DS and DB share a hobby. DB has a piece of expensive equipment he no longer uses which he's said he'd like to 'give' 13 yo DS 'as a birthday present.'

But DB also says he might want it back at some point so DS must look after this 'gift' in order to be able to return it in pristine condition in the future.

I asked DB to clarify whether this is in fact DS's birthday present or actually a loan. DS is very responsible and will value and take care of this thing but if he uses it for its intended purpose it will potentially travel with him and could get damaged or stolen. Also, I don't think birthday presents work like that.

Attempting to discuss this with DB has resulted in him becoming angry, offended, and calling me ungrateful.

Who is BU?

Depends how you asked.

I wouldn't regard that as a present though. I'd also not want the worry and responsibility.

YANBU. That is not a gift! It doesn't even sound like a loan, but a massive burden. I'd say thanks but no thanks.

It's not a gift. It's barely even a loan.

Your brother is hugely unreasonable. A gift belongs to the recipient not to the giver no matter how much they might like it or want it back in the future.

It's a lot of responsibility for any child. Sounds more like you are being used as storage... it's hardly going to stay pristine if used.

Nope. A gift comes with ribbons, not strings.

Your brother is being massively UR.

Who will replace said item if it gets damaged/broken?

It's a loan but, the gift is the use of the item which considering you have said it's an expensive one is very generous.

Your son just uses away it with the care of a loaned item fully prepared to return it if necessary.

This shouldn't be a confusing thing! You are being gifted the loan of an expensive item.

Your db is loaning out a used item in the expectation of gaining a new one when he demands it back...

A gift is a gift. A loan is a loan. He needs to be clear what it is. If, when your son is done with it, he does not want it sold or gifted on then make it clear you cannot guarantee it is returned in the same condition. It may get stolen, damaged or otherwise. If he is happy to take the risk then fine.

I would be cross too if you were being awkward about it. I'm sure you would be a lot more put out if your brother didn't offer the use of the item at all and you had to buy it outright yourself.

Be a little more grateful. It's not all about your kid!!

A gift comes with ribbons, not strings

Very clever!

I wouldn't be keen on this arrangement as there is no way to guarantee 100% that the item will stay pristine.

I would be being very clear about the fact that I couldn't take responsibility for it.

Ha ha, 'ungrateful' that you don't want to provide free storage, care and insurance for db's expensive kit! 😂

@health then if OP doesnt want to care for the item then she shouldn't accept it!! Very simple really.

Your brother's an arse. Who the fuck loans a teen something 'as a gift' and expects them to keep it ad infinitum in pristine condition. I'd use the ribbons not strings comment and not accept it. He's the type to sue you for not keeping it in mint condition.

Can't stand people who do this. It's like people who 'give' you baby clothes and then want them back in mint condition or offer to give you them and say, 'That'll be 50 quid and you're getting such a bargain'.

Fuck that.

That's not how gifts work. Imagine hypothetically it's a really nice carbon fibre road bike. Great to ride, fast, looks amazing.

1. it can get nicked - needs insuring separately if outside the home
2. it can get scratched - would he have to repair it?
3. it can get broken - wheel rims break etc - and what about servicing, who is going to pay for that?
4. he could have a crash and completely wreck it.
   Not much of a gift if you have to be that careful with it and then give it back.

That’s a rubbish present. Personally I would decline the offer.

What is it with some people? As others have said, is it a gift or a loan? And all this crap about 'might want it back' - some birthday gift that is! And your brother has decided he's offended?? Tell your brother to stick it.

That’s a rubbish present. Personally I would decline the offer.

^this. Tell him to keep it and buy a proper present that isn’t going to be snatched back off DS at a later date.

OP's son isn't being gifted a loan of an expensive item Dinky Dolphin
He is being offered a loan of the item, it's not a gift at all.
Great expression a gift comes with ribbons not strings

Well, it’s not a gift, is it? So it’s cheeky for your DB to describe it as such.

Whether a loan is a kind gesture or an unreasonable burden depends on the item. Something like a piano would be great - very unlikely to be damaged. Something like an expensive camera is too much of a burden - likely to get stolen, lost or damaged.

The gift is the free use of an expensive item. Maybe it's a guitar, free use of a good guitar is a great gift, maybe it's a mountain bike, free use of an expensive bike is a great gift.

It really depends on exactly what the gift is, and the situation, but essentially there's nothing wrong with giving a gift that is the use of something rather than the ownership of it.

Another one who loves the line used by Knittedfairies

Bloody cheek. Him not you. I think hat s quite a mean thing to do to a kid. Loan him the equipment, and stick a foldable spendable in a card. Its not difficult.

Knittedfaires Love your 'a gift comes with ribbons, not strings' and I shall be using that in the future.