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Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Ridiculous increase in council tax for police funding

183 replies

NigelGresley · 14/03/2019 20:07

Last year the increase on our council tax bill for the police was 12%, this year it has increased by 22% !!!

I am furious with the government for cutting central funding and transferring the burden to local people. But at the same time wondering whether our police force is really cutting its cloth accordingly.

Anyone else seen such huge increases?
How much longer can this continue? Some people are really going to struggle to pay.

OP posts:
yanboo · 18/03/2019 13:35

Most of my experiences come from being involved in the local neighbourhood watch, and from friends in the police in London and elsewhere.

I like the idea of policing by consent and I like police officers too, who do too much paperwork and are hamstrung by questionable management goals. Most officers have no influence over the strategies they are told to implement and individual officers routinely express regret at the limits of their powers to investigate or help owing to a shortage of numbers, time and competing directives from command.

My point is that without some serious change of direction an increase in raw police numbers will have no effect whatsoever on reducing crime.

We live in a time where a former police officer has to prosecute a force for discrimination for refusing his son entry. The crimes I’ve been involved in seeing nothing done about include life changing injuries to young man assaulted without warning by gang of IC3 youths, neighbour mugged st knifepoint on DLR by three IC3 youths, young woman beaten severely by IC1 male on neighbouring street (!), resident fatally injured following stabbing by IC3 youth outside his house as he close his garage gates - no suspect was apprehended in any case.

The property crimes include three domestic burglaries, perhaps a dozen identical accounts of illegal entry and trespass, over two dozen car crime incidents (damage, TDA/TWOC, theft from vehicle), threatening behaviour/attempted robbery on a busy bus (several counts, same time and area, similar description of suspect) and in all these latter cases there were varying degrees of evidence which were not collected.

One neighbour identified without doubt the thieves who took his van and provided proof. No action. Following four or more years of videos, photos, car registrations, descriptions and likely times (they kept a regular schedule) no action was taken about the open sale of hard drugs in the neighbouring street on a route taken by children returning from two primary schools. This was finally resolved by a civic minded resident with a persuasive manner and a large bag and claw hammer.

It is regrettable to say but if you do happen to live in a place frequented by the small minority who commit the vast majority of crime you will see how little is done, and how these people have no fear of the law.

The perception I have to manage among middle- and working class residents in our area of the borough is that (1) there is no point reporting crime to the police (2) the police are more concerned with political correctness and hate crimes than violent crime and theft (3) persistent criminals act with impunity.

The issue appears to be that in the unlikely event that some crook is caught they will be seen as a victim of society and will have a brief career break at best.

There is an obvious mismatch between reality and description in the matter of serious crime, as with the knife crime in our borough and elsewhere. Perhaps only Trevor Phillips has been bold enough to grasp the nettle. In this as with other large scale failures of policing of systematic and serious crimes the obvious is dismissed.

People simply do not have any faith in the police and the courts any more, and this is due to experience not ignorance of the system.

There is no deterrent, there is no strategic priority to tackle these crimes, and the tiptoeing around the minefield of race baiting is unpromising to say the least.

LakieLady · 18/03/2019 14:08

The real vacuum of local government spending is older persons social care. Care home placements are 600-1000 a week, and much of that is paid for by city and county councils.
I'd much rather my money went to increases in the police force

I understand why you feel that way, but wonder how you'd fund care for those too old to care for themselves?

The real culprits are the government who are intent on slashing the amount they contribute towards the cost of local services, and increasing the proportion paid by council tax payers. In doing this, they're taking the burden of paying for stuff from businesses* (corporation tax shas been cut by more than a third since 2010) and wealthy individuals and passing it on to all of us.

I don't earn enough to pay income tax, but still have a council tax bill of £1,900to pay.

*I know that businesses pay local business rates, too, but they are mostly small businesses, least likely to be able to afford it.

LakieLady · 18/03/2019 14:21

So, in the UK, police are funded by county councils? Councils pass on the cost, obviously? Does seem an expensive way to do it.

And to add to the points made by TalkinPaece, police forces often cover areas far larger than just one county. Sussex Police covers East Sussex, West Sussex and the city of Brighton and Hove, Devon & Cornwall: 2 counties, West Mercia: 3 (Herefordshire, Worcestershire and Shropshire). I'm surprised Norfolk and Suffolk haven't merged. actually.

It's by far the cheapest way of getting the money to the police, it would cost a fortune if they had to run their own billing, payments and recovery systems.

Fire and Rescue services operate on the same principle.

LakieLady · 18/03/2019 14:39

A PP who I think is a PO said the lack of Social Workers, mental health provisions etc causes a drip down effect (or rather a flood down effect, my words not hers) and the police are the last and only help some people have or can contact.

So true.

Last year, I tried to get input from the MH Assertive Outreach Team for a client who had come off her meds and was getting increasingly unwell. They had no capacity to take her case, so the community MH team couldn't hand her over. She ended up very unwell, was arrested for public order offences and criminal damage, had to stay in a police cell for 72 hours as there was no bed in a psych unit for her and ended up sectioned and was an inpatient for several months. Thankfully, housing benefit continued in payment, or she'd have ended up homeless, too.

How much money would have been saved if only the AOT had been able to help her appropriately weeks earlier?

Brighton police joke that they deal with more MH cases in one weekend than the Sussex Partnership Trust (MH trust) do in a month, and I wouldn't be surprised if there was some truth in that.

Otoh, the police wouldn't go and see the client who was sending me threatening texts, voicemails and emails last year or the year before. She ended up sectioned too, but months later, when she'd smashed up a shop and assaulted several people.

Tortycat · 18/03/2019 14:39

i have no problem in principle to paying more money to provide basic services.

But what i object to is
a) council tax varies depending on area. There should be some consistency nationally.
b) it comes at a time when my pay has been frozen for years
c) the amount wasted on Brexit is truly staggering. Millions wasted on cancelled contracts, bullshitting politicians etc. Imagine how much it costs to have MPs debate something even. And then the cost of the economy failing when it goes through
d) MPs give themselves pay rises and renovate Westminster at eye watering cost. Every other public service has been made to make efficiency savings, modernise etc, and they all inhabit a palace, have black rod wander around knocking on doors, bloated system of expenses etc. They should renovate westminster to then be used as a tourist attraction, and relocate to a cheaper modern alternative. The hypocrisy makes me furious.

So happy to pay, but we're definately not all in it together

LakieLady · 18/03/2019 14:48

council tax varies depending on area. There should be some consistency nationally.

I think this is a good idea. It would level the playing field between counties who have (for example) a high proportion of elderly people and those who have relatively few, or between rural areas, where it is expensive to deliver services, and urban ones where it is much cheaper.

The local government funding formula attempts to do that, by linking government grant to expected need, but with government grant being eroded every year, the situation will only get worse.

TapasForTwo · 18/03/2019 16:54

Our police funding increase has gone up by 14.1%
Crime round here is rocketing. The local police station closed a few years ago, and the local drug runners come over from the next county knowing that they won't be caught. We have also had a big increase in burglary and car crime. The locals are putting pressure on the police crime commissioner to open up the police station again. I don't mind the increase if it means we get more policing in our area.

dreamingofsun · 19/03/2019 09:26

i think part of the logic for local funding though is to give the people in the location some choices? So if you want a high level of local provision you presumably vote for labour councillors and accept you have to pay more for the services?

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