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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Sick of gender quota jokes/remarks

35 replies

liviii · 13/03/2019 17:18

I recently got offered a place on a graduate scheme for a tech giant. The job description stated that candidates from a STEM background were preferred. When I attended the assessment centre I was the only female out of 12 candidates- mos applicants were Engineering students.

My brother, cousin and boyfriend have all "jokingly" commented that I was probably given the job due to some gender quota. Every time they say it it really pisses me off as I feel it undermines so many of my accomplishments. I remember pointing out that fact at the assessment centre (as I was genuinely surprised) and some guy told me it would benefit me. I have no idea what the company's policy is re quotas but I wouldn't have hired had they not deemed me competent/capable.

AIBU to feel a bit pissed off. I know I'm being sensitive.

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liviii · 13/03/2019 17:21

Maybe it did help but that's beside the point.

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MeredithGrey1 · 13/03/2019 17:23

I don't think you're being unreasonable. You've said "every time they say it it really pisses me off" so I'm guessing this isn't a one off joke? If it was one off, I'd say you should forget it, but if they're banging on about it, I'd be annoyed as well.

Fatbutt · 13/03/2019 17:25

Yabu

obviously you had everything else they needed as well as being female - and yes, maybe that did help - but think what you are doing to help young women get into what were seen as traditionally male jobs!

its not the quotas idea thats bothering you, its the insensitive family.

AryaStarkWolf · 13/03/2019 17:27

Of course you're not being unreasonable. I mean they're basically saying the only reason you could beat a man for the job was because of the quota, it's belittling and rude whether they said it as a joke or not

liviii · 13/03/2019 17:28

Hmm they're not really banging on about it on their own. I've shared my good news with family memebers- including the fact that I was the only woman attending the assessment centre and that's when the "jokes" tend to be made.

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Sickoffamilydrama · 13/03/2019 17:30

I'm with you this kind of thing pisses me off too.

Saying that I'm hiring for a STEM job at the moment and I'm desperate for a woman to apply, so fed up of there being 9% women in our workforce.

HerBigChance · 13/03/2019 17:32

My response would be that there are plenty of men in the world who only got their jobs etc because they are men. This side of the equation is known, but rarely mentioned. Men tend not to like this response, for obvious reasons.

BlingLoving · 13/03/2019 17:36

I think the only response is to remind them that for 1000s of years, in a choice between a man and a woman, the man always got the job. So you're not too heartbroken if in a competition in which two equally qualified people are candidates, a woman winning for a change feels pretty good.

BlingLoving · 13/03/2019 17:38

Also, I'd be questioning how much time you want to spend with family members or boyfriends who think you're unqualified for the job you do. Not exactly a resounding endorsement of your capabilities. Almost understandable from a brother as they so often seem to think their job is to bring their sisters down. but your partner? Move on and find a better one. there'll be lots of men at your new job, you'll probably find one there.

RenegadeMrs · 13/03/2019 17:40

YANBU.

First of all... congratulations on the job offer!

I was the only woman offered a graduate position at a bank and often felt like the token female during the training and that is hard in itself. People saying stuff like this is undermining and belittles your achievements. Women often suffer from imposter syndrome and is it any wonder if everyone thinks what they achieve is due to them just being women and given an easy ride because of it?

STEM industries are trying to recruit more women for a reason... because they have something to offer the industry. But they won't recruit just anyone, you still have to have the skills to do the job. You might have been the only woman at the assement centre, but I bet others will have applied and not got through.

You worked hard and got the job. You will need to perform to keep the job regardless of gender. Own your achievements and try not to worry about everyone elses gender jibes.

liviii · 13/03/2019 17:40

I'm tempted to ring HR

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AmaryllisNightAndDay · 13/03/2019 17:42

You are not being over-sensitive. They are being very insensitive to make "jokes" like that. Telling someone that they didn't get their job on merit is a putdown, pure and simple. It's not a friendly thing to say.

And if they keep doing it after you've told them it's not funny then feel free to judge them. Especially the boyfriend - you can't choose your brothers or cousins but you do have a choice about boyfriends.

SpoonBlender · 13/03/2019 17:44

Ask the twatty boys "So you think I'm not worth employing otherwise? Because that's what you're saying". Try and train the little shits to think before they spout such crap by embarrassing them.

SlipperyLizard · 13/03/2019 17:47

How many white middle class males wonder whether they only got the job because of being white middle class males?

Of course, in the same way all car drivers somehow believe their driving skill is above average, all white middle class males think they’re the ones that got there by “merit”.

Even if you got the job because you’re a woman (which you probably didn’t), I say it is about time the scales were tipped in our favour!

ForgivenessIsDivine · 13/03/2019 17:55

For you to have made it this far you have overcome centuries of the silencing of women which is ingrained in our society. You have overcome unconscious bias since the moment you were born.

In every class where you have sought to show your ability in scientific and mathematical subjects, you have most likely outnumbered by men and spoken over and given less share of voice and less respect.

You are more likely to have been asked to help other students who were struggling than given the opportunity to work with similarly talented ambitious peers from whom you would learn and spark off. You will have found youself working alone more than your peers have.

In careers advisory sessions you will have been asked to consider management, finance, business and even when being interviewed you will have been asked if you really want this as a career.

You will have been told that no one likes a girl that is cleverer than them or a girl and men want to be made to feel useful. Despite the fact that there are alleged quotas, research has shown time and again that men will choose a man over a woman even if are less qualified.

Male colleagues will be paid more, promoted more and less will be expected of them. They will never be asked to make coffee, to take notes or be asked where the photocopier is. They will never be expected to take on the thankless jobs that no one wants for no recognition and they will claim ownership of projects you have collaberated on.

Despite all of this, you have made it out the other end which makes you bigger, better, tougher than the others because you have overcome every barrier that is in your way.

Your male friends and family are likely to earn more and achieve more with half the effort. But you are worth 2 of them!!

liviii · 13/03/2019 17:57

RenegadeMrs Thank you!

The fact that they've made me question myself is bloody hurtful.

My boyfriend and brother do the lad thing when together and they egg each other on. The lack of respect is a bit disturbing really.

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liviii · 13/03/2019 18:06

ForgivenessIsDivine I resonate with so much you have written! feels great to be understood, thank you! I've been lucky enough to have very supportive teachers and parents.

and even when being interviewed you will have been asked if you really want this as a career

During my 1 on 1 interview, one of the interviewers quite abruptly asked me "do you want to be an engineer" (I don't) in quite a patronising tone. No one else was asked this.

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Mysterian · 13/03/2019 18:07

I'm a man in childcare. I get quite a bit of it from the other direction, even on Mumsnet. It annoying and sexist. Do you point that out to people?

EcclesThePeacock · 13/03/2019 18:08

YANBU.

You've probably overcome a lot of overt or more subtle barriers to get to where you are which the blokes won't have.

I'm in a STEM field myself , and DD is an engineering student. No-one ever dared try that stupid line on me, and I hope for their sakes no one ever tries it on DD.

My boyfriend and brother do the lad thing when together and they egg each other on. The lack of respect is a bit disturbing really.

Really not on. If they try to tell you they're just joking, tell them you've got a better sense of humour than them so you can tell when something simply** isn't funny.

BlackPrism · 13/03/2019 18:17

It's very very annoying. My company is trying to close its gender wage gap, it's doing. This by looking at similar positions in the company and how the men and women are paid, if a woman is paid lower then they are raising her salary to match the higher male equivalent wage. Many jokes about how they wished they could get a wage for being a woman and how they think it's not fair even though they're not lowering the male wage just raising those that are gender biased (whether because the women asked for less or didn't ask for a wage) they're not losing out but they act so hard done by when we work the same position and are just as good.

Tell them to piss of

sailorsdelight · 13/03/2019 18:21

YANBU. I hit a few ‘quotas’ being gay, female and WC but I don’t give a shit as I have dealt with discrimination most of my adult life! I get to apply for stuff for under represented peeps and listen to a lot of crap from colleagues because of it.

jellyfrizz · 13/03/2019 18:23

I'm a man in childcare. I get quite a bit of it from the other direction, even on Mumsnet. It annoying and sexist. Do you point that out to people?

You get jokes about being picked for your job because of gender quotas?

rosamacrose · 13/03/2019 18:25

Your cousin, brother and boyfriend are being utter dicks.
Pathetic.
Cousin and brother, I can understand years of childhood teasing and now they need to grow up. Boyfriend? Not so much. Isn't he supposed to be on your side?

Mysterian · 13/03/2019 18:30

@jellyfrizz Some people suggest I get employed because I'm male, because it's 'trendy', or "Everything he does will more than likely be fawned over, and management will over praise him for even the simplest thing."(Mumsnet poster). Yes.

liviii · 13/03/2019 18:34

It is pathetic, worst of all they've made me nervous that my colleagues will have similar thoughts.

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