to consider handing back the keys of my house to the bank?

[LifeContinuesToChallengeMe]

Hi,

So, just when I thought I had sorted out life a new and overwhelming challenge has come along.

I live in Ireland. I bought a house in 2005 as I was just married and expecting a baby. It is a tiny house far away from my family. Because of the crash I was unable to sell the house and buy elsewhere and so I rented it out and now rent a house near to family.

For many years the rent did not cover the mortgage. We fell into arrears. Couldn't sell the house due to negative equity. That is all sorted now. Arrears are cleared and the rental value increased so rent covers the mortgage. House no longer in negative equity. So, we still owe pretty much the full mortgage because of these problems but we could sell it now and walk away free. My plan was to keep hold of the house, with rent paying mortage, until the mortgage is paid, then sell the house and buy a tiny place here so that I don't have to rent in retirement (and rent myself in the meantime).

But......I just found out my estate has pyrite!!! I cannot sell the house without getting pyrite clearance. Banks won't give mortgages without the clearance certificate in my area. The test alone costs 2k. The repairs cost between 30-60k if there is pyrite. My next door neighbour got his house tested. He has pyrite. The houses are terraced so there is a very high likelihood I do too.

Should I just send back the keys to the bank and walk? I can't afford the pyrite remediation. I could wait for years maybe and do it then. But ultimately will it ever be worth it?

Very overwhelmed and would love to hear some perspectives on this! Thank you for your patience in reading

how about living in it instead of paying rent? doesn't solve the pyrite issue but will save you money for a while and you can put any action off til you've decided the best course of action/found out who to sue/things are more settled in future etc

That isn't true!

Your panicking but you need to calm down and try not to catastrophic it and make a list of people to contact.

Go on line on Irish websites and do some research. Contact Helen McEntees office and the pyrite office.

On a positive there is some potential government redress available if you owned a Celtic tiger apartment with defects and fire proofing issues you would be completely screwed they are totally on their own. So there may be a possible way out still.

Bankruptcy is an extreme option but contact David Hall if you want advice.

That also isn't true the arrears fall of your record 5 or 6 years after the last payment was in default.

I have a friend just about to buy again. The bank took her circumstances into account at the time and have still approved her. Sure half the country defaulted in some sort of debt during those years.

Hmm sounds familiar, not you OP the situation. Is the house in Portarlington by any chance.
My DFriend has a similar issue, she returned her keys in 2010 and has nothing but trouble, the bank refused as the house can't be sold, she is in her finals studying law, her bank has take a judgement out against her, she can't claim bankruptcy as the house is can't be sold so can't be used as a debt or something like iti don't no law on it, she thought she would hand the keys and they would sell it on. she has aged years.
Can you continue to rent it out.

No you misunderstood. It is not covered by any commercial insurer in Ireland.

That is why there is a government scheme in place. All insurers exclude it. They just manage the exclusion in different sections.

If it is the only property you own you can get free financial and legal advice through the Abhaile scheme. Contact MABS and they can get you the vouchers.

Am I missing something here? The existence of pyrite is the responsibility of the builders who put up the estate, surely. Can't you and fellow suffers take class action against them?

I am no help to you situation, but it sickens me that the quarries that sent out materials containing pyrite were not held accountable.

These quarries that are meant to carry out quality testing as per the BS standards and didn't are getting away with it when the homeowners have to pay for it. Similarly contractors should be testing the materials that they are using, but in the height of the boom they didn't.

Now the home owners, or the tax payers, are footing the bill, while Roadstone, Kilsaran etc. have no financial implications.

I don't have a house with pyrite but it still annoys the shit out of me!!

The existence of pyrite is the responsibility of the builders who put up the estate, surely
All those big builder bastards fecked off went bankrupt walked away. The Irish government is a joke in this respect. One of the bigger companies lost millions they rebranded and got more large tenders from the government.
Back scratches

Wait.

That’s the best advice I can offer. At the moment you are able to cover the mortgage. You should now be able to live your life, live where you choose. You might have to just put on hold whether the house is your retirement plan, but it shouldn’t be a mill around your neck either.

See how other people are dealing with it, what is out there, and don’t stress. It’s not in negative equity, rents are high for a good while probably. Then, when you are sure what is your best, financial, next move, decide then what to do. A lot can happen in 5-10 years.

My friends just had their house fixed under a pyrite redress type scheme. There are options so don’t do anything drastic yet. Has your loan already been sold on to a third party serviced like Pepper- if so get on to them straight away to see what they say

Did you not have a building survey done prior to purchase? Or would your legal advisers not have made necessary enquiries?

I'd contact them in the first instance

Sending the keys to the bank mortgage provider was the best thing I ever did to rid myself of an unshakeable house joint owned with an ex husband. I did go bankrupt, and now 7 years later it is off my credit history. I know I didn't want further credit anyway, and needed to get mental space from dealing with the home upkeep as well as having to keep contact with ex about it. The bank concerned were incredibly helpful once they understood my circumstances, and that I would not be in any position to pay the debt off. It was one single debt and the official receiver even finished my period of bankruptcy several months early as the rest of my finances were so straightforward (me on sickness benefit at the time having lost my job due to the my poor mental health as a result of the abuse I suffered in my former relationship). Yes bankruptcy is problematic but for me it gave me an end point to that time of my life so I could heal and move on. It's a tough decision and not one I took lightly but I have survived and reached much better mental health as a result. Wishing you well with your choices.

Another voice saying don’t hand the keys in. I worked in mortgage arrears during the big recession in the late 80s/early 90s. If you hand in the keys you no longer have the use of your home but you are still liable for the monthly repayments. You will also be liable for all the lenders associated costs will so you will pay for someone like me to visit the property and confirm it’s condition, you will pay all the costs and legal expenses the lender incurs in selling it and it will be sold at a rock bottom price and every step of the process will probably add a ‘nominal’ Admin cost to your debt. If the property sells for less than the outstanding mortgage the lender may well sell the outstanding debt to a collection agency and you will be liable for their costs too. And the collection agency will pursue the ever increasing debt very aggressively and for many, many years into the future because that’s how they make their money.

At least if you stay in the property you have an (outside) chance of the property market improving and the house price picking up or the mortgage companies/government/insurers changing their stance on pyrite.

For anyone querying surveys etc. this is a specific problem that occurred in some houses in Ireland built in 2000’s. No way of knowing at the time the house had these issues as the cracks started to appear years later. They were all new builds and in some parts of Ireland whole housing estates have been badly effected by this issue.

Op I just messaged my friend and she said she got help through the pyrite resolution board. Probably best to start with them and see how you get on

The builder that built the house, what about his insurance?

Did homebound cover the builder?
What an absolute nightmare.

Home bond went tits up a while back.

Sorry.

So when your Dh was the breadwinner did he get up at 5:30 and do the morning shift before work and then come home and cook and do the evening shift? You are being a mug.

Thank you everyone for replying. I really appreciate it.

I was panicking. You helped me be able to breathe and take a step back. I will contact the people you have recommended, thank you for that. I will calm down and wait. The house doesn't make me a penny but I am no longer having to try to top up the rent for the mortgage so it's not the huge stress it once was.

Maybe I will become eligible for the scheme to fix it in the future. Maybe the pyrite will not cause big problems and instead of selling it in the future I continue to rent it out even when the mortgage is paid. Just because I can't sell it doesn't mean I can't continue to rent it as long as it doesn't start falling to pieces, and if it does start falling to pieces then I will be eligible for the repair scheme. So this is one way of looking at it. It is still way less than my financial plan of selling in the future and buying down here and means I'll still be renting somewhere to live so it's not ideal, but maybe it'll be ok. So thanks for talking me through my blind panic

Hi life, just wondering if you've made any progress? I meant to say last time that a brother of mine had it. He was very reluctant to pay for the test too as it cost a huge amount of money he didn't have. Anyway one of his neighbours got the test done. They're in a long line of terraced houses, my brother at the end. The neighbour had it so my brother paid up and he of course had it to. There is a fund set up to cover the costs of the repairs but you need to do some digging to find out who's managing your fund.

Don't give up on it!

As for whoever mentioned the build forking out... them fuckers are all shady bastards. The one who built my estate went bankrupt. Then when he'd served his time after leaving millions behind in debt. He bought back the unsold apartment from Nama, 5 one bed apartments for 125k, 25k a piece. He bought them under a company owned by his wife and is now selling them for 180k each... scumbag. We lived beside one of the vacant ones and we were never offered the chance to buy it for that price. Which we could have.