To ask how people get these jobs.

[Ecriture]

I'm over 30, I come from a working class background.

I grew up with a mum on benefits single parent, 3 kids.

I tried though.

I went to iffy poly uni and got a crap degree (2:2) because I worked three jobs just to stay on the course.

It's not been easy but I've been willing to work as hard as it takes to make a life for myself unlike my childhood.

However, in the past 7 years I'm working I've barely scratched the surface and I am only on 25 grand and still at the bottom of the pile.

Today I had to attend a meeting where 60% of people present were some type of chief officer, cfo or head of major departments.

They all seem to have very distinguished careers and have attractive salaries way beyond my own.

My question is this how did they get there?

A lot of women on this site also seem to be high earners with lots of responsibility.

Does one have to be born into a wealthy family, know the right people or go to the best university. I have none of this.

Can hard work actually get you anywhere in life?

Am I destined to spend the rest of my life doing a low paid work despite my ambitions?

Am I being unreasonable do you think that someone from my background could ever rise higher?

Can anyone give me any advice about what I can do or how they progress in the phone their own career?

It's interesting to read how many say " be the go-to person/problem solver/ work over your hours".
I work with one such lady. She is a marvel and a dynamo.
She's also been on the same pay band for 14 years.
Management do not respect or appreciate her hard work, specific expertise, helpful, positive and constantly wanting to expand her knowledge personality. It's not fair nor pleasant to witness.
The ladies who did my job then retired did the same job same band for 30 years. They were experts and worked excess but remained static.
So there's more to this.

A combination of hard work, luck and determination.

I have no degree - dropped out due to financial and MH problems. Started off at age 22 in an entry level position in a call centre earning slightly more than minimum wage at the time. Worked my way up, changing departments along the way and taking on extra training. Did lots of overtime and volunteered for things.

10 years later I was earning better, but still under £20K p.a. and I wanted to do better. The best advice I was given is that staying with one organisation is a guaranteed way to see your pay stagnate - you make your money (or your market value) by moving strategically. So that's what I did - every 2 years. And within the space of the next 5 years I'd doubled my salary. Happy where I am for now but will move again in 18 months or so and my next pay bracket should be in the £65-80K bracket.

You need to move firms. Market yourself and know your value. Don't expect people to notice hard work and want to reward you with pay rises, because it almost never happens! Negotiate HARD on salary and benefits because if you don't ask you don't get.

In my case, the biggest factors were:

1)Parents who worked in professional jobs who know about a variety of corporate jobs, and also know which degrees are most employable. I was choosing between 3 degree options and my mum was quick to point out the employable one and the ones where a lot of people struggle to find work in the field.

2. Going into a very niche career path. I've ended up specialising in an industry where there are more jobs than people. We get recruiters messaging us all the time. We earn well and don't have to work more than 37.5 hours a week, with flexitime. Lots of part-time and contract workers and a very family-friendly industry.

So maybe speak to others and find out which industries are very employable and have a shortage of people right now (for example, Data Science/Statistics is huge). There are just some industries where they're so desperate for people they'll pay well for anyone who's qualified. See if you can qualify in that, for example with a Masters.

I actually think the uni you go to has little bearing in the end. After working about a year, no-one cares anymore. The "golden girl" in my old company who got headhunted, got to lead about 5 projects at once and had 2 companies competing for her, was from Man Met. She was just really good.

(On a side note, I actually find my job dull as shit and want to requalify in something completely different and more creative, but if you're asking how to be on 50k within 3 years - that's the answer)

Council house raised- dad & brother died when I was 14 after years off illness. Had free school meals left school with average GCSEs.

Worked retail for 15 years worked way up to highest level could earning about the £25k

Changed careers 5 years ago (am mid 30’s) and have excellent career earning in the £30k plus with company car, benefits etc. No extra qualifications.

I can’t really say how I have always been good at learning as I work and in part been lucky that management saw potential in me and has trained me up. I always spoke up with wanting to learn more and asking how to progress and do better in my role. I am always 100% committed to any role I do and maybe it shows.

Also can depend on industry as public to private sector is very different.

I also have no kids yet!

And unfortunately "hard work" is not always it. You can work hard forever in a coffee shop, or read Daily Mail all day in a well-paying corporate job and always go home at 4:30. You just have to pick your qualifications, industry and specialism wisely.

Oh and I deliberately chose a field where the salary opportunities would be good. The latter stages of my childhood were impacted by money worries and very lean times, so the one thing I was determined to do as an adult, was have a well-paid job. I was far less concerned about vocation as financial security was my priority.

It's something that you need to think about. A good friend of mine works in the third sector and loves her job but is very poorly paid. However it's more important to her that she's doing what she loves. Whereas whilst I quite enjoy my job I don't "love" it and it's certainly not what I dreamed of doing when I left school! But the trade-off is a good salary and that's more important to me.

@Hiddenaspie - I also know a lady who's worked in the same place over a decade and completely underappreciated. She works about 12 hours a day, is mega-stressed and is still in the same job. Everyone else in the office works 7.5.

Doing lots of overtime is a surefire way to get people to take you for granted and think "oh, they always stay late, I can just spring any old shit on them at 5pm, they won't mind!". Nah. Efficiency is the way. Get your work done and set clear work-life boundaries.

It’s a really interesting conversation. I’m a university academic and Do a little bit of research into this subject . My opinion is that it is a mixture of planning, attitude and luck.
Where you are born, the education you receive and your socioeconomic status can have a huge impact.

Personally, I was born to teenage parents, grew up in one of the most deprived areas of the country and went to a pretty terrible school. I went to an ex- poly and just about scraped a 2.1. However, I stumbled across a Postgraduate course which change my life and defined my career.

I’m now a senior academic on track to be the youngest professor in my department.before this job I’d worked in industry for a few years first to build up my experience. It’s definitely been a combinations of hard work, planning, determination and luck.

Having family connections and money to begin with certainly helps.

Have you considered getting yourself a mentor? You sound like you could really benefit from one. Someone in a position that you aspire towards who might be able to guide you and help build your confidence. I work in the civil service and there is a relatively formal mentoring process for those that want a mentor. Is there something similar where you work? If not, perhaps if you google it you could find a private sector mentoring scheme. Or even just identify someone that you already know through work who you could approach about becoming a mentor? If you go down that route I would go prepared with an idea of how you want it to work and what you want to get out of it in case the person hasn’t mentored someone before.

A 2:2 isn’t a crap degree. I have one and am a teacher who made it to deputy head at one point. I resigned though as it was a bad school and back on the main scale. I’ve opted out of management level type posts and now work part time and am a single parent. I am now doing a masters so that I can eventually get into a doctoral training degree so I can progress myself on another route.

Oh and I work in a school with a lot of support staff who are actually qualified teachers with degrees too. No one actually cares what level your degree is unless you want to progress onto a higher academic course - this is why I’m doing a masters as I could get into the doctorate if I’d have had a 1st or 2:1. But there are plenty routes elsewhere.

I also have friends who’ve never been to uni and who habe worked from leaving school and made their way to company director. Shear hard work.

Agree with JonSlow that moving around helps.
I was the first in my family to attend uni. I worked two jobs to get through and had no help from family as they could not afford to help. In 4 years post degree ( I also got a 2:3) I went from 18000 to 34000 just by moving every 12-18 months to a new job in a new part of the country if I had to. I never found it easy getting a promotion in the same dept because seniors always remember your incompetence when you are learning as a new member of staff. It's easier to start again with a new level of confidence in a new department and own your role without people doubting you!

I come from a poor household, went to a poly uni and graduated with a 2:1 and worked about 20hrs a week to top up my student loan. No connections, no other professionals in my family and first to go to uni.

Took a grad job in a large corporate and just took lots of opportunities to develop as they came along. Asked for small projects here and there, worked hard and delivered them well. It's made a difference to my CV and. Gave me a great reputation in the company. Took a few side steps and found a career that I could progress in by moving from one company to another. I stay with a job until I feel like I have nothing more to learn and then move on. I try to take a job that allows me to work on my weaknesses, for instance I got stuck in a certain industry so only went for jobs outside of it, or one where there was a lot of presenting (urgh!).

I did a pt masters at the same poly uni I did by UG in.

I've worked very hard at my cv and it's quite polished. I have tailored it for each job and I write a good cover letter. I prep for my interviews.

Get some help with applications and interview practice. Be proud of your achievements and where you’re from. Have the confidence to believe that you will go far and you will. I have similar background and degree, once you tart up your CV and practice your confident interview answers with someone drilling the questions, you’ll be surprised how much it helps. Certainly put me on a quick ladder to the top and later set up my own business when I turned 30.

I spent a few years working on the “ground” before I got my big break. I’ve been lucky to be in a middle management job.

Maybe it’s time to look at a new job or ask your manager for help to progress your career?

One thing I’ve found that really helps- meet up with one of the senior colleagues and ask them how they got there. What training did they do? Also look at maybe getting some coaching.

Nothing to do with background (mine is very working class) everything to do with ambition and early exposure. I hung around with the rich kids at uni so I wanted that life too. I made lots of calculated moves in my career and always had my eye on the prize. I out earn a lot of those uni friends now (but they will always inherit more than me! ).

I feel similar ish, but with a different start. I'm mid 30s and was clever at school but didn't try so didnt get amazing results and dropped out of college because all my friends were working and had more money to spend on alcohol and clothes which was all I cared about at 17. I went back to university as a mature student in my mid 20s when my daughter was a baby. I went to a reasonable university and got a reasonable (standard 2.2) degree, in an arts degree. I regret it now, as my friends who stayed in the workplace are all on more than me now and didnt have to deal with the student debt either. I'm not saying its impossible, but aside from very occasional shifts, I didnt work whilst at university. Now I'm mid 30s, in a role that is entirely unrelated to my degree and although I'm relatively happy, I feel I could have done better by not bothering with uni!
Where I work, all 3 of my immediate managers of my department have worked their way up. Encouraging in one way, but these are the people that you know will be there until they retire in 20 ish years, so not much room for progression. I'm also holding my own career back inasmuch as I have absolutely no desire to manage people! So I guess I just have to look for similar rules that pay more when I want to leave.
This is more of a ramble than anything else tbh, but I do feel you. I'm also on a good few grand less than you OP, but I suppose it depends on where you live as to how that really compares!

I'm lying, I actually got a 2.1 in my degree

My parents weren’t rich, they don’t have a load of contacts in the business world. I worked hard, made some sacrifices, made some mistakes, fixed them and have ended up in a decent position in a career I really enjoy.

None of what I did was down to luck (neither am I a liar 🙄) I do find it irritating when it is suggested that success is done to people having some kind of unfair advantage. That may be true in some cases, but most of the people I know in similar positions got there on merit and not through some kind of back door.

I do believe that luck plays a big part. That's not to say that hard work isn't needed as well because 99% of the time hard work is vital as well.

But for example, if you take two people who are starting out in the world of work and they have the same qualifications, ability, work ethic and attitude. They both take careers advice, one gets good advice, one gets bad advice, but they don't know they have been given bad advice, because how could they possibly know? Or they both start their first jobs, which on paper sound like the same job with two rival companies. But one company offers training, and support to study, and they strike up a good relationship with a more senior employee who agrees to be their mentor, whilst the other person gets no training or professional development, no opportunity to learn new things, and they can't get someone to agree to mentor them, then what else can it be but luck?

Just place marking...

yabbers luck or chance does play a part in everyones career development. For some it's a huge contributing factor for others it's relatively minor .....but it's there.

Those of you who have 'professional qualifications' - how do you define them. Sorry, clumsily asking what qualifications they are. Wondering if some people (me) go after the wrong type by not knowing what they really should be looking for.

I think you are partly right that having professional parents/privileged upbringing helps- not necessarily because they have right contacts for most people, but because if your parents understand the 'system'- what you need to do to get to the next level- they can pass that knowledge on to their children. I can see the difference it makes in my household- DH and I have the same degree, same grade, same university- although he graduated a year before me. I earn significantly more despite having taken a lot of time off on parental leave and him having graduated ahead of me. (Thiugh neither of us are serious high fliers). Most of the difference is that I understand how to play the game better than he does- I watched my dad have a career, moving amd reiventing from time to time. I also had help with filling in application forms and support with interview prep when applying for Saturday/summer jobs and university so by the time I started work I already understood how to make the system work for me. DH never had that, and genuinely had faith that he would be rewarded for hard work in the end, until he wasn't...it's amazing the difference that our upbringings made.

Would your work give you a mentor who can help you develop this knowledge? Or can you find one yourself- most people would be flattered to be asked. Someone fairly senior, who you can relate to, but preferbly not in your direct line management. You sound like you work really hard but perhaps need some support in marketing yourself and looking at what training/experience/knowledge you need to get to aim for your next goal on the career front. (And possibly even encouragement in setting yourself some goals).

And as other have said, don't be afraid to move if you need to if your current workplace isn't offering you progression or support.

Ignore advice just to keep your head down and work hard- that's the kind of tactic that keeps you underpaid and taken for granted. You needs to be able to get your head above the parapet and be noticed to make progress.

Good luck!!

I wouldn't say £25k is a low wage though. It's a good wage. Does where you are have good opportunities for progression or will you need to look outside your organisation?

Professional qualifications are generally linked to a job or sector. They're often accredited by a relevant professional body.