To ask if you realise au-pairs are seriously under threat after Brexit?

[Dontblameitontheboogie]

On another thread discussing a potential au-pair who would be starting this summer, I was struck that not a single poster pointed out that it’s far from certain au-pairs will be able to arrive or even stay after 29 March!?!

I thought this deserved its own thread, and in AIBU rather than the “Brexit” echo chamber. People may not even realise they could be affected.

Even in a “Deal” scenario, au-pair status isn’t guaranteed, as far as I know. They won’t qualify for pre-settled status, as they’re here temporarily and won’t be able to provide proof of ordinary residence. So technically they could be here illegally from 29 March. Access to health care would be a worry, as would re-entering the UK after trips home - or getting here in the first place.

The current au pair scheme is an EU-wide arrangement, that allows young EU nationals to temporarily live in another EU country without exercising Treaty rights. Some countries, like France or Germany extend the scheme to au-pairs from outside the EU too, but the U.K. doesn’t.

In case of a no deal Brexit, the Immigration Bill that was passed last Monday means that EU citizens wishing to come here must have a job offer worth at least £30,000k. Some exceptions I believe, such as nurses and doctors, but I haven’t seen any mention of au pairs anywhere.

Check out www.saveaupairs.uk for more info.

Echobelly - you try finding reliable wrap around care when you earn close to minimum wage and live hand to mouth even before childcare.

The middle classes have no idea how most people in this country live

This is like the Erasmus scheme debate.

Erasmus is a project that mutually benefits young people from all around the EU, providing a grant that means they can spend time perfecting their language skills, gaining insights into other cultures and therefore becoming more aware, more open-minded, more tolerant, less insular and inward-looking. Things that were deemed important as part of the post-WW2 European project. (The au pair system is a little similar...)

I've read comments from people saying they don't care about some middle class kids not getting a gap year any more.
That is missing the point.
Middle class kids can have a gap year ; Erasmus allows students who can't take a gap year to spend a semester/year studying (not dossing) abroad.
Now it's dead in the water as far as the UK is concerned.
I work in a French university and we have been informed that they have decided to exclude outward mobility to the UK due to the chaos and uncertainty as whether/how/when Brexit will occur. Which means mobility to our university from the UK will cease, as it's reciprocal.
Sure, it's less serious than many issues in the world, but that doesn't mean it's not sad to see it happen, and sad to see how the consequences of the UK vote will affect young people all around the EU.

callmeadoctor
How on earth did we manage before?
In the same way that we managed with 3 tv channels
no mobile phones
no international phone calls without using the operator
no debit cards
no internet
women sacked from work when they got married
and a few other things that have changed since the early 1970's

*I'm sure they existed before we joined the EU. Two if my aunt's were au pairs in France and Germany

It'll just need the same easy to complete paperwork it used to need. Like many other things people seem to want to scaremonger about*

Nope. Pre-EU there was a specific visa for au pairs. When I was a kid our au pairs came into the UK on one. That doesn't exist any more AFAIK - it changed and now there is the youth mobility tier 5 visa scheme which is open to young people from citizen of Australia, Canada, Hong Kong, Japan, Monaco, New Zealand, the Republic of Korea or Taiwan. And...that's it. The assumption became that European young people would just come here through freedom of movement.

The government would need to expand the tier 5 youth mobility scheme or come up with new legislation which won't happen automatically. I imagine they will do in time, but in the short term, yeah, there will probably be a significant shortage of au pairs. And while I get a lot of people are sneering at the middle class mummies, for a lot of parents an au pair is about the only way they can get to work.

So even those single mothers using au pairs quoted here were obviously on very good salaries (and with a spare room in their home) to be able to afford an au pair in the first place

Not on a good salary - less than average. Have space for an au pair if I push my children in together. Single parent. Used an au pair to deal with a short term travel issue caused by scheduled road works. No other options came in nearly as cost effective. She simply had my children for an hour and took them to school every morning. Cost me £100 a week and food. Childminder wanted £25 per child, per day. She had the full day free, she learnt loads and i brushed up my French. Without her, I would have lost my job. But I guess that would be OK, eh?

Au pairs are not "cheap labour".

I was one. It's an invaluable experience for the aupair. You get to go and experience an actual life in another country. The actual culture and learn the language in a safe environment of someone's home. You get fed, get pocket money and many families pay for English courses etc.
All that for 15hours of childcare and light housework.

Should aupairs be on minimum wage, hence changing the status of it to work, many would never go because dealing with foreign system in language you can't understand to is really a daunting prospect. And so it would really take this, for many the only, chance to experience other country away.

You don't get that experience if you go for english course and live in special student accommodation.

Yes, there are families who abuse this and treat aupairs badly, and that shouldn't be happening, but trust me that unless aupair goes into horrible family it's a positive lifechanging experience in exchange for very little.

Agree with PP, that we do have bigger problems when it comes to Brexit though....

You can't really compare an au pair to a childminder. Childminders don't live with you. Most ordinary British families don't have the space for live in childcare. Plus I can't see many au pairs wanting to live in my sleepy, northern village where a car is essential and we get snowed in a few times a year.

I could just about understand the 'fuck you m/c snobs' attitude, if Brexit was going to help the WC.

But the fact that Brexitteers still don't recognise that they've been conned by multi-millionaire elites to fuck over the WC is just mind-blowing.

I bet they'll be having fun in Sunderland the next few years, brexitteers. Won't even be a chance for the young to escape overseas. And that's thanks to you, brexitteers.

so basically your real issue with the scheme is that you can't find an au-pair CostanzaG?

I agree with you Helmet, except that the situation cam about because "posh" people who are unaffected by it refused to listen to their concerns about immigration and overloaded infrastructure. I think they were wrong but I understand why they voted the way they did.

I made this comment on the other thread. I have always believed that , although it can work well, the aupair system is open to abuse and it often not advantageous to both sides. The au pair is often treated as a servant, without the required wage, doing more than minimum housework. Why would anyone want a person with no child care qualifications unless you wanted child care on the cheap

Wow, some 'interesting' attitudes about au pairs here. I was an au pair myself in the 1980s. Fantastic opportunity to learn a language, learn some practical skills, and broaden cultural horizons. An absolutely life changing experience for me. Yes, it was a low wage, but you had enough to go out and have fun, and could live comfortably enough. Not so attractive to do that in your own country, obviously, as you're not learning a new language or broadening horizons. My daughter is hoping to be one in a year's time, in France. She'll be gutted if the opportunity is no longer available.

Why would anyone want a person with no child care qualifications unless you wanted child care on the cheap

I've often wondered this. I wouldn't even leave mine with a child care worker or nursery let alone some stranger.
Don't people care how their kids are raised.
Maybe the luxuries are too important.

But CanIleavenowplease £100 per week would be totally unaffordable for a lot of single parents
If you could afford to pay an au pair without tax credits then you are in a different league

Confusedbeetle: Why might you want someone with no childcare qualifications? Yes, partly because it's affordable, but also because you might genuinely believe in cultural exchanges benefiting everyone concerned, including your own children.

"Sure, some people may be prepared to work for room and board, but that would be the thin end of the wedge to exploitation and modern slavery! Workers rights and minimum wage exist for a reason."

So if that's wrong, and people are already paying their au pairs the minimum wage (ideally living wage) why should there be a sudden pay cut just because their next one might be a different nationality?

How on earth did we manage before?

As Dalia1989 has pointed out, we had a visa scheme which doesn't exist any more and which isn't going to be set up in the next seven weeks.

I've always wondered about the way that Brexiteers seem to to stick their fingers in their ears, close their eyes tight shut and keep shouting "Project Fear" whenever anyone suggested that Brexit might pose one or two problems. I couldn't understand the mindset involved or how they thought those problems were going to be avoided. So this thread is a real eye-opener about that mindset: if you really believe that, come March 30th, we will just pop back to 1972 and carry on regardless, I guess you really can make yourself believe that there won't be any problems because, well, it all worked before, right? But I do wonder how they're going to cope on March 30th when they wake up and find themselves still in 2019.

marchcrocuses some people seem to think they're experts on everything, and tend not to like actual experts pointing out that they're not.

There's lots of posters contradicting themselves on this thread. Suggesting that the role an au pair performs is marvellous for Europeans, with many advantages, and yet utterly dire for an English person, with no advantages. Which is it?
(Yes, I get the former learn a language but that's the only difference).

arethereanyleftatall
I have been an au-pair. What was worth if for being in another country would not have worked at all in my home, it's not that difficult to understand.

Why would anyone want a person with no child care qualifications unless you wanted child care on the cheap
of course it's about being cheap, otherwise people would take a nanny! It's not about raising your kids, I can do that myself thanks, it's more like employing a teenage babysitter to keep them safe until you arrive home.

You normally don't employ an au-pair for a baby or a toddler, but it works well if you are home as well.

How did you reach that conclusion from my post biscuit?
I was simply pointing out that having an au pair is not something an average British family can accommodate. For a number of reasons.

Incidentally, we could both afford and accommodate an au pair but it's not something we would want for our family. I much prefer a regulated nursery setting plus I wouldn't want a stranger living with us.

I've often wondered this. I wouldn't even leave mine with a child care worker or nursery let alone some stranger. Don't people care how their kids are raised.

Right. So you're just judging working mothers. Gotcha.

How on earth did we manage before?

The other thing worth remembering is that back before the EU, a lot of women just didn't work. I remember when I had an au pair back in the early 1980s, I was the only kid being picked up from school by an au pair and not a mum (or no one). My stepmum was a nurse and had to quit her job when she had kids because there were just no other options. Other parents, who had to work, just let their kids look after themselves - the 1980s was the age of the latch key kid, which I don't think we as a society are nearly so accepting of these days.

That might be true in your case biscuits, but it wouldn't be true for everyone. I'm now thinking I missed a trick in my twenties, I could have gone to London, taken an au pair role, enjoyed the city and set about getting a decent job. (Rather than applying from home for jobs, taken the first one that came up as I couldn't be arsed travelling 3 hours for an interview constantly). I think it probably isn't in the current mind set of British teenagers, but I can definitely understand there's advantages.

As to the poster who sneered at the fact people would be forced to move from areas of low employment, to areas of high employment?!? Wtf? That's a good thing!

It’s a god thing forcing people to move away from their support network to the other end of the country for a low paid job they wouldn’t have taken if they had any choice? Yeah, you brexiteers have a wonderful vision of the future.

Au pairs aren't really intended for nursery age children. They're for school age children.
I have heard of people like nurses who are single parents having an au pair so they have someone there overnight when they have to work nights. Some people share a room with their child to give the au pair a room.
Is a single parent working as a nurse and living in a 2 bed flat rich? But these are the sort of people who use au pairs in London especially.