To stop him seeing them? Please help!

[Melon6412]

Hello all, I need some urgent and fast advice, for this reason I am posting in AIBU.
And I apologise in advance, please, please do not attack me for the length of this, I am so lost with how to tackle this situation and I want to give all relevant information.

For background:

I am currently going through a divorce with my ex after a lengthy marriage and 3 children, all daughters, together. The divorce is not an issue, all decisions regarding assets and financials have been made, agreed and committed to.
He is in his early 40’s and I am in my late 30’s. We split up because he admitted he was having an affair with a married woman, was in love with her and wanted to get divorced to build a life with her.
There was NO argument from, marriage was over there and then. Fast forward and she is still with her husband and they are no longer together. At the time of the split, our children were 7, 3 and 1.

They are now 11, 6 and 5.
I have never had to argue with him regarding his financial commitments to our children. The only thing we have ever clashed about since the split is his lack of effort with our children.
When he left he promised he would see them every weekend. As time went on this went down to once a month at his insistence.
He has never had them overnight or for any holiday period which is ok with me but the eldest 2 have increasingly felt annoyed about this as time as gone on.

My eldest and him were very close before the split. After the split my eldest took it very hard, the middle one has only this year started to connect the dots regarding the split and the youngest is just happy go lucky and thankfully doesn’t seem too bothered by it all.
Over the last 18 months, my eldest has become increasingly distressed about his lack of effort in terms of seeing them:

He never, ever attends anything at school, does not matter how important or how much notice he is given, he simply won’t attend.
He is never, ever on time when he is supposed to be seeing our children even though it’s only once a month. He is always late and my eldest gets really irate about this.

He has always insisted on seeing our children at my house. When he sees them, he never has any structured activities or quality time planned with them. He will sit around my house with them and they will sort of entertain themselves and he will then take them out to get some food. For context we live in a lovely little village which is full of parks and greenery, I mean there 3 about 5 minutes walk from our front door. He will not voluntarily take them out on their bikes or do a puzzle with them, my children will happily bake and cook, he won’t initiate anything like that with them, he just does nothing of any substance
He is short and snappy with them, sometimes telling them to ‘shut up’ or calling my eldest an ‘idiot.’
When they are with him he will ALWAYS call me to tell me child x is crying and then I’ll have to talk to and soothe said child over the phone
He will go weeks without speaking to them over the phone, I have suggested so many times that he even Facetime them or something, it is always flat out refused.
My eldest gets anxious a lot where he is concerned, she worries about him. We do not know where he lives, he won’t tell us, and sometimes she’ll wonder if he’s even warm or not.
He has no involvement in any issue regarding their health. Does not celebrate their achievements in any way. Is very, very dismissive of them and of me.
Because our children have no structure with him, my eldest is always in an agitated state where her Dad is concerned and has a lot of pain, anger, issues with rejection and extreme frustrations with him. Sadly she is also desperate to have a relationship with him and be loved and understood by him and so she is not willing to give up on him or let him go.

Now here is the issue:
Since the split to the present day, he has let our children down numerous times when it comes to doing something he has said he is going to do. My eldest especially has been massively affected by this trait of his. I am not making reference to small things like ‘you promised you would read with me’ or ‘you promised we would watch a movie’ but huge things like making plans to spend some one on one time with her, letting her build up her excitement all week and then cancelling the day before, literally the day before and it crushes her every single time he does it. I would like to add that for me, if you use the words ‘I promise’ with a child, you had better damn follow it through.
He has also just gone quiet with communication with our children for no reason. For example, he will ignore my eldest child’s pleas over text, voice note and phone calls when she has begged and begged him to just least just get in touch and let her know he is ok, BECAUSE he is being so quiet. The ticks go blue, he reads the messages etc and then ignores her but then on the other hand will tell her that he loves her. I have warned him and warned him to either follow through on his word or not agree to it in the first place.

The latest incident happened a very short while ago. My eldest has a low self esteem and is highly self critical of all she does even though she is an accomplished student, lovely and kind child, a wonderful big sister (bar their usual sibling bickering) and has good friends around her. I try and try to build her up but she believes her Dad left because she wasn’t good enough and then I remind her that it was because of someone else and she will say ‘well then AFTER he left he has made no effort with me so clearly I am not good enough.’
5 months ago she signed up for an event with the consent of her Dad being there to see her perform and then drive her home afterwards. The event was due to end around 9.30pm and was about 90 minutes from where we live. She asked him if would a) attend and b) bring her home afterwards. He told her yes, emphatically, ‘yes, yes, yes!’ I kept asking him, are you sure? Are you sure? And he kept telling me the same thing. So, we purchased a ticket, my daughter attended practice every single week after school and really threw herself into the entire process. A week before the event I asked him what do you want to do about your ticket? I have it here, if it is difficult for you to get there for any reason, just tell me and I will go instead. He insisted he was going and to post the ticket to his parent’s house from where he would collect it. So I did.
2 days before the event he texted me out of the blue and said ‘put her pyjamas in her bag, I may be booking into a hotel.’ That is all he text. I asked him for some background as to why he couldn’t bring her back home?
Over the next 2 days he jumped between I will bring her back to it will be hard for me and make it easier if I don’t have to. I the end I spoke with her school who are fully aware and her wonderfully kind and trusted teachers offered to drive her home after the event. Once this was confirmed, we are now the evening before the event, I told him he didn’t need to bring her back now, all he had to do was be there to see her. Nothing else.
The day of the event, he called me 2 hours before he was due to be there to say he can’t make it because of work. I was devastated but decided there and then that he is not going to see them anymore, ever. I have given him over 3 years to rectify his approach to them, there is so much more I could add to this post but it’s already massively long.
During the conversation when he cancelled he said ‘fine, I’ll leave work now and go!” And I told him no, under no circumstances are you to go there now. He then said ‘well now I’m saying I’ll go and YOU’RE stopping me from doing so.’
I told him he is not seeing them anymore. I then text and said I had spoken to the school and they knew not to expect him.
He then texted me straight after regarding our finances and how he will do whatever necessary to make sure I feel secure in our financial arrangement.

Today I have asked that we speak over the phone to iron out the finer details regarding him not seeing them. He has agreed and is calling me after the children go to bed.
I absolutely will not be changing my mind, he has emotionally abused and neglected them always with the promise to improve but never has and our daughters, especially the eldest have been desperate to see him. I feel so completely worn out, I would not allow anyone else to do this to them, so why is it ok for him? Because he is their Dad? No. I am done and will not be moving from my position.

My questions are:
How do I tackle this with my children? My eldest is due to start secondary, is well on her way into puberty, is finding her own little identity and then this. She still doesn’t know he didn’t attend even though the first thing she asked when she got home was, ‘where was Dad, I looked and looked but couldn’t see him anywhere.’ I deflected.
My middle one is fiercely independent on the surface, she will not show any vulnerability to anyone but is very insecure and emotional when she talks to me. She internalises a lot. She is only 6.
The youngest is blissfully unaware as she doesn’t remember it any other way.
How do I help them?
Is it better coming from him? (He is a coward so I don’t even know if he would tell them himself.)
Do I tell them he is going away? If so do they chat on the phone?
How much will it screw them up by telling them the truth? How much pain will it inflict in terms of their future selves? Will they look for father figures in messed up relationships when older? Does anyone please have any experience of this?
How do I mitigate the effects of his utter selfishness?
What practical questions do I ask him?
Does he give up his PR? Just any advice at all please. I am utterly heartbroken for my children but relieved that he will be going away and just want it finalised and done so I can get on with helping them to deal with it all and hopefully to heal.

Thank you.

Note:
None of our children are SEN or have any medical conditions so he cannot use that as an excuse in terms of he can’t handle them.
They were all planned so he wasn’t tricked or forced into becoming a Dad.
He has never reneged in any way on his financial responsibility towards them.

I have no advice in afraid but you sound so so lovely. Your children may have a shite for a father but they are very lucky to have you. Good luck

I don't believe it's always better for children to see both parents. Regardless of whether he has mental health issues or is simply an arse hole, his behaviour is damaging your children. I wouldn't keep exposing mine to his emotional abuse. Best to stop physical contact imo. I don't think your children will blame you, but even if they did (temporarily, until they grow up and develop a better understanding of your reasons), that's better than allowing this to continue.
I like the idea of telling them that at 16 they can try again if do inclined.

If he does have ASD please remember that this is hereditary and your eldest daughter is sounding like she may have some traits.
Can I suggest a dr appointment for you all to see if you can get some help for you all .

Hi, you have received lots of really good advice from other posters so I just want to offer support. You sound like an absolutely brilliant mum and very strong. Whatever the outcome from this, your daughters will get through this because they have YOU x

What an awful situation, your poor children
I second what previous posters have said, don't stop him but don't initiate either. By the sounds of it he has given up anyway so he's the one that has made that decision already. Very sad and what an absolute nasty selfish beasturd.

Just remember your kids have you, a lovely, grounded mother. They are better off without him in their lifes when he let's them down all the time.

Oh my goodness, he's an arsehole! I recommend counselling for the kids, for sure, but also, I recommend making sure that Dad time happens outside of your house from now on. This is taking too much of your space as well. Him being fixated on you is clear. He might very well be there only to invade your space and mark his territory. It sounds like his "lounging around" in your house is what he would have been doing if he lived there, and he is fulfilling his fantasy of what life would be like if you and he were still together. This has got to stop. You making clearer boundaries about you two being completely over might make him cut ties with the kids by himself anyway.

Absolutely agree - set boundaries and leave him to maintain the relationships with his DCs. He will be the father he is going to be.

He is lazy, and you are allowing him to lounge around in your home. Surely before such drastic action of not allowing your DCs to see their dad, this is the first sensible step? Re-reading your OP it strikes me that withdrawing your support will be as effective as saying it outloud.

We are very much in the same boat. I am really worried for my DCs, and particularly my DDs, for their relationships later on.

I had to have a really difficult conversation with my 11yo because her DF agreed to pay for something (that she doesn’t need) but in the next breath told her she must visit him. So now we have had to talk about how loving relationships work. Doing so without telling her her dad is wrong to do this and shouldn’t put conditions on his love is impossible.

I had some counselling and I would really recommend it. It helped me reinforce my boundaries (both physical and emotional) and reiterated that I have an impact, that the DCs will benefit from MY love and MY values. The counsellor I saw suspected XH has a personality disorder which made a lot of sense to me. Obviously it wasn’t a diagnosis and she never met him, but by understanding his behaviour I could make some sense of it and that helped me.

I think focus on your own parenting (you may, like me, over-compensate and I think that brings its own difficulties), maybe look at some support for you and remember, your relationship, your values and your influence is greater than his. He isn’t the father you want for them, but you sound like you are a fantastic mother.

Good morning and again, thank you for all of the advice, ideas, praise (I wonder sometimes if I'm doing a good job with them!) and for giving me perspectives that I had never considered.

I allow him to see them at my place because as I have mentioned he will not tell me where he lives. Family as a go between is not an option for him.
He gets very irate with them very fast. Something as silly as them bickering in his car and he'll lose his temper and scream at them and all 3 end up in floods of tears. My middle daughter doesn't want to leave the house to be with him if that makes sense, she says she doesn't feel comfortable but also wants to see him and spend time with him but at home. My eldest is very much of the opinion that she wants to see him and not cut contact.

I'm actually on my way to qualifying to be a Solicitor and I am surrounded by people who practice in that profession, I have a very good understanding of family court and know that while we would have to go through the process of access through the Courts, (should he pursue that avenue) in the end with the evidence that I have he would initially be denied access and told to attend a parenting course(s). I don't believe he would follow through with it and would drag the girls and I through the system to merely prove that he can. Furthermore, I have seen first hand what impact this process has on the children, and for what? For him to prove a point but not actually improve anything or take anything positive from the process.

I have spoken to my eldest this morning and she is so angry with him, always angry! But she doesn't want to stop seeing him and tells me that I've taught her to be kind and understanding and perhaps he just needs our help. deep sigh

So it seems, as people here have pointed out, cutting contact altogether is not the way to go, irrelevant of how I feel and regardless of his poor conduct.

@0F4S, how do you tackle the emotions that your 11 year old goes through? I'm sure you're doing a fantastic job!
I worry so much that he's just messing my eldest up, irreparable damage that she'll carry through to adulthood. It is beyond hard and I completely empathise with your position.

I Have 1 child who sees her dad every weekend and the other who will not (same father)
Although I always knew DD2 was unhappy until she was 13 I made her have the contact. DD1 cannot bear to hear any reasons why DF is not a good father and is too very enmeshed in worrying about him (but not me!) and point blank refuses to accept DD2’s personal reasons for refusing contact

So I am not in the same situation but I really really feel for you and the DC. Watching my DD2 so unhappy was awful. I kept hoping it would get better but it never did and eventually she chose herself. He can’t take us to court as she is deemed old enough to make her own mind up. She does text him and visits once a month for about 1 hour whereas DD1 goes for days on end.

If you stop the contact you unfortunately have to deal with the fall out. If you don’t you also have to deal with the fall out. Counselling is what you need to do ASAP for your DC urgently

Explain to DD that the contact method is going to change for a while. Let her be in control and allow emails, phone calls and videos but stop the visits to your house. They aren’t appropriate anyway. So you are allowing contact but on a different playing field

@PookieDoo, I am so sorry that you've all been through so much. It's so sad, selfish adults make selfish choices and the children suffer as a result.
How is your DD2 now? Does she talk about her reasons? And has she given you any indication that she may change her mind? It's the damage to their self esteem which worries me.

A huge hug for you and yours. I genuinely feel for you all.

Maybe then a public place, like a cafe... You set the time, you choose the time to leave. This situation is completely untenable.

Yes she talks to me. Sometimes she’s angry that I kept ‘forcing’ her to go but she is 15 this year and I have explained that when she was small he could have taken us to court and it would have been much worse than it was with 24 hours contact a week, she agrees now and sees why. I’ve always said it’s not up to me to stop contact and I tried to have some control over protecting DD2.

She hates him says she is a bully etc. He’s racist cruel and horrid. But he has a 3yo now and DD2 is now obliged to try to form some kind of relationship with that poor child hence the FaceTime and very short occasional visits

NO I think allowing DD2 some control over herself has actually helped her self esteem

DD2 was only 3 when we split up and they never really had the right bond. She is angry I think but all at him and never blames herself (to me anyway)

Honestly, it sounds like contact will fizzle out in the next few years anyway as they become teenagers. I would simply tell him they are available at X time each week for a chat or time together. Don't tell the girls, even if he agrees. Let it be a bonus if he turns up. He won't.

I echo the need for counselling with the eldest two as it sounds like their self esteem has taken a battering. If you can, also start spending time with other male family members who make much more positive role models. They will be using what they know to make choices about the sort of partner they end up with in the next decade - so emphasise there are better options than your twatty ex!

Keep working on your daughter outside what he is doing. if he is still going to be a shit and she can't heal in that part of her life then maybe you could work outside of that .so just keep doing activities ,or having a girly night , going for walks making her feel powerful in other areas .did she have any hobbies could you go on a class or starter hobby when she's around males even .men that are good role models tutors, coaches etc
have that talk with her make it open that you need her to know that whilst dad has these problems but not all men are like it and that not all people are like it and that sheu can rely on her mum and others to keep reminding her of her self-worth. do things that make her feel good bake cookies together ,does she like craft , to town and window shop or just dressing funny outfits together in all the shops .just big her up as much as you can. give her the eye, you know telling her she's doing great give her lots of hugs and attention really get the believe that she's not good enough out by putting that she is in

Melon, my 11 yo is fairly indifferent to her DF. It’s her future relationships I worry about the most.

The DCs aren’t there to meet the emotional needs of their DF. Once I stopped meeting his needs (emotional and logistical) and his relationship broke down (OW) he was on his own and switched to them. I suspect from what you said about your DD showing him understanding and kindness, your XH might play on this. I am very clear that my DCs are not here to meet my needs because I am the adult. I meet the needs of them, because they are children. I say this outloud from my point of view. I don’t (or at least try not to) talk about him. Negatively or otherwise.

My youngest DD never really had her DF when he was here so she is emotionally detached already, and I continue to over-compensate for him.

I don’t want my sons to turn out like their dad, and I don’t want my daughters to have relationships with men like their dad.

I’m hoping that being aware of this, being a strong woman and the best mother I can be, will go some way into shaping their adult relationships.

I would add that as your eldest DD can sense your Ex isn't ok mentally and wants to fix him, that you need to say that she can't do that unless he recognises the issue and wants to get better. That it isn't her responsibility to fix her dad. She is obviously worried about him.

I'll just say again, please get counselling for them (and may be yourself too?). Hearing advice and support from someone impartial may just help them accept it, because I worry if it just comes from you they may end up (wrongly) feeling you're to blame if you stop contact in their best interests. He isn't going to be the Dad you want him to be, the father your kids need, and it's like you'll need to grieve for the loss of that, with support to do so.

I can see this must be so hard for you, you sound like a wonderful mum, but it's not up to you to solve this really (maybe why your daughter feels the same, wanting to solve things for her dad?). Like other PPs say, have the kids available, but then leave it with him to step up.

Have you thought about maybe some counselling for your eldest?

It’s a good point about what to say to DD, your job is to help her feel less responsible for him. The thing is, depressed or not he is actually ok. His behaviour is the issue but it doesn’t sound like he’s not working and homeless with debilitating depression, it sounds like he’s detached. You can’t change his behaviour but you can helpDD change hers. He’s safe, well and cares enough to provide for them financially, He just is not good at relationships and is making bad choices. She needs to feel more secure about her fears for him. This is probably the point where DC realise their parents have flaws and make bad choices and this is part of developing into learning boundaries for themselves. But you need to model that. You gave him too many chances and options in your show example where you knew he wouldn’t turn up but yet you facilitated it all. Don’t.

You should facilitate her emailing him with the assurance you do not want to prevent contact but it isn’t working for any of you the way it is now.

Get DD some support as she may well begin to move away from these intense feelings as she matures and becomes focused on friends and secondary school.