AIBU to think we over-pathologise very nomal human behaviour?

[Breakawaygirl]

Other threads have got me thinking about this....

We all know that diagnosis of anxiety, depression, autism and other emotional/mental health/neurological conditions are on the rise.

My question is, is it true that we are just paying more attention to conditions that were swept under the rug, or are we over-diagnosing very natural human behaviour.

I've often thought depression, anxiety and other conditions are very natural reactions to our modern world.

Many people wake up early only to be overworked, fed bad food, underpaid, come home to more work, unable to foster connections with loved ones and children, feel lonely, cut off (no community), big uncertainty in the future, pollution, overpopulation, extinction of animals, little nature in some animals and a very aggressive media that seems to have an agenda - surely to feel bad is NORMAL in these circumstances.

I often think the diagnosis is a way of saying it's the PERSON who has the problem rather than the way we conduct our society/culture as a whole.

That is not to minimise that many conditions are the result of neurology and genetics, but a huge component is nurture and lifestyle.

I've often felt that we live in human zoos and are behaviour and neurosis stems from that.

For instance exercise is a natural anti-depressant but most of us don't get enough.

Anxiety is proven to be exaggerated by social media and the idea that everyone is doing better.

Is it that people individually are sicker, or is society sicker?

Curious for people's thoughts.

MarieKondo is right. In poorer countries people with considerably less manage to get on with things better than us.
I don’t know what the difference is but some relatives lived in absolute poverty and yet psychologically managed better.
I wonder if it is religion that helps them.
They just keep going on regardless - in their case working on the land in all conditions. One with a severely twisted spine and walking miles every day.

The level of ignorance about mental illness and depression being shown on this thread is astounding.

Depression is a worldwide problem. The reason it's diagnosed less frequently in developing countries isn't because it doesn't exist, it's because most people don't have access to the medical care needed to receive a diagnosis and treatment. Undiagnosed doesn't mean it doesn't exist.

WHO report on depression:

www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/depression

Some of the attitudes being displayed here perfectly illustrate why there is still such a stigma around mental health.

But is assuming that all human unhappiness is down to mental illness the right way to go?

Haven’t read the full thread but I completely agree OP. Recently had a very stressful time in my life, my DF and DB were very unwell. When I reached out to two of my friends to tell them they both said ‘you should make an appointment at the doctors’. What for? ‘You can talk about your depression and anxiety and they could give you tablets.’ I’m very unhappy and stressed over something that is currently happening in my life. This does not automatically equate to depression and anxiety.

Re. Depression etc
Are we just all a bit less resilient now? If so, why?
Modern life isn’t very pressured but surely less ‘hard’ than in past times?

Is it connected to there being less of a sense of community as we can buy stuff from our homes, or go anonymously to a huge supermarket, stay inside watching TV etc rather than mixing more?

I feel like a lot of people’s reactions to somebody being unhappy these days is ‘maybe you should see your GP.’ And whilst for many people I completely agree that that is really what they need, other people might just be looking for a quick chat with a friend about being down!

Sorry meant *modern life IS very pressured

@Breakawaygirl i completely agree, i think we over diagnose completely normal emotions, such as anxiety. Feeling anxious is a normal emotion. I feel anxious at times, doesn't mean i have anxiety, just a speciifc situation caused me to feel anxious

This is a very interesting thread. The answer, I think, is complex. Regarding depression, my mum died in very tragic circumstances, and it took years to learn to live alongside the pain and sadness. I would not call that depression. On the other hand, I went through a time when I felt detached from life, whilst still going through the motions of living normally. Like when you have a cold and everything is dulled. Then there would be deep misery. Wishing not to be here. That is depression, not sadness IMO. There seems no particular reason. Like when you get bad pmt or post natal depression. I do think we over diagnose and our society is now more likely to cause mental and emotional health issues.

No one is saying it doesn’t exist in poorer countries. My point is that some groups of people are considerably more resilient than ‘us’ and I include myself in that. I have been anxious before and wonder what the difference is. We have a safety net here that just doesn’t exist in the same way in (for example) Greece. However in Greece there is considerably more responsibility taken by the family and also religion. Perhaps that is the difference.

I completely agree with you OP. Life is hard at times & we have to dig deep to find resiliance to cope with it. At times that is harder than others, but feeling happy, sad, excited, angry, anxious etc etc are all natural responses and through my own struggles with a lifelong disability I have learnt that I am responsible for doing everything I can to improve it. If after a period of time any emotion becomes an issue then help should be sought, but I try to get across to my children that this is all part of normal, until you really can't fix it & it affects your life for a long period of time or you need help coping. I fully appreciate everyone has their own stories but could not agree more with the Op's first post.

I live in one of the most beautiful cities in the world surrounded by the ocean and mountains, averaging 25 degree weather majority of the year. I bodyboard in the sea a few times a week, go to the gym, have a fit athletic body and my own home. I also have a horse and spend a lot of time riding him in the Winelands.

I earn well working from home, so no commute. I had a brilliant childhood and I have the most amazing family support and parents.

On paper I should be an anti depressant myself!

In reality, I struggle daily, day after day my disorders let me down, make me feel hopeless, disorganized, a chaotic mess of a beast like a black curse was out on my head.

I have - Bipolar 2, ADHD & GAD.

I'm a walking pharmacy, everyday is a constant struggle, when I do succeed, one of my disorders will sabotage me yet again.

So OP, there is something in your theory, however, those like me, who suffer relentlessly day after day, we could only wish it was our lifestyle, as that would at least give us some hope that one day, it may all change and we'd finally be able to live in peace!

Agree, agree, agree Breakaway - this over-analysing of everyday experiences and most of the general sh*t that life throws at us on a daily basis has proved extremely lucrative for a lot of self-styled therapists pedalling all manner of quackery (the amazing avalanche of self-help books and the likes of Gwyneth Paltrow enthusing over crackpot mood-inducing therapy candles, herb pillows, egg-shaped chunks of 'spitual' marble, quirky foods to enhance mindfulness, etc, etc, etc).......but gosh, there are plenty of insecure and over-anxious types out there who are prepared to throw money at this kind of stuff.

How did we get from just accepting "it's one of those days" or "that's just life" all the way to demanding that we must have a fancy label and an even more fancy therapy to deal with it?

I wonder if a dare say that the words "attention-seeking" often spring to mind?

@Winnie I think that’s a bit strong... No one is saying that mental illness isn’t very real.

Some of us are saying that ‘modern life’ has made us less resilient. We are pandered to and I think we are deceived into thinking that life is always roses and at the first sign of going through a shit time you need therapy or medication. Sometimes life is hard, sometimes we get ill, sometimes people die but we need to work out ways of coping with unhappiness and disappointment rather than expecting the system to help us.

The WHO did an interesting study comparing the recovery rates of people diagnosed with schizophrenia in developing world vs developed world. People is countries like India recovered far quicker. They think it may be because of the strong support network (larger families) and shared care in the family.

I absolutely think we over pathologise behaviour which is on the boundary of normal. Jon Ronson's The Psychopath Test is an excellent read on the subject. I also have personal experience of some very, very severe depression which ended up being a symptom of physical ailments like anaemia and vit D deficiency. I also have an auto-immune illness which results in lower endorphin production and means I'm far more vulnerable to depression if I don't have enough physical activity. But none of the above are mental illness, they are symptoms of treatable physical illnesses. When the physical illness is treated, my mental health symptoms disappear completely.

jayfee I agree. I have experienced clinical depression and very deep sadness from tough things happening. They are different. But both times the GP said I was suffering from depression and offered anti depressants.
The deep sadness was not about lifestyle, but about being bereaved in pretty tragic circumstances. But I think my reaction and feelings were normal given what happened. The issue is that society expects us largely to behave normally even when life is very tough.
So work is set up so that you can not deliver less for a few years because you are having a very tough time. You might get away with a week or two under performance, but no more.

Timmy That sounds tough. But I do wonder if you are being too hard on yourself? It sounds like you manage to achieve and do much more than I or many others would be capable of doing.

Autism is a neurological condition not a mental illness. So you're wring about that.

@Breakawaygirl I suggest you look at some actual scientific studies on obesity, weight gain and metabolism before making sweeping statements about lifestyle. The Dutch famine studies are fascinating. They show at least two generations of genetic effects from famine when in utero.

The autism comments are intriguing me here. It is a spectrum and the majority of people here are commenting on traits which are like extreme normal behaviour, weird or badly behaved. Some of you people need to try working in a ASD unit or visiting one and you would see this is clearly not over diagnosing of normal behaviour. I suspect I work with the children who would have been institutionalised in the past and kept away from society. These children are non verbal, have the cognitive capacity of a toddler in many instances. Slight breaking of a routine can cause a reaction to the extent where the room they are in can be trashed, staff can be physically hurt if they don’t respond quick enough. Some of the children cannot feed themselves. Many also have additional diagnosed conditions such as pica (eating anything they have access to, food or non food), or ADHD. Many have epilepsy. Lots have physical impairments too as well as visual of hearing. Many of these children cannot dress themselves or take care of their personal needs. These children grow into autistic adults. This end of the spectrum is hugely different to the Asperger/HFA end of the spectrum. From the outside it looks like nothing can be done but working with these children shows there are ways to communicate and teach them.

Anotjer condition I work with is foetal alcohol spectrum disorder. A totally avoidable yet increasingly present condition. Physical signs can make a diagnosis easier however it’s another spectrum and some physical signs are not obvious. Again this is a neurological condition causing learning difficulties further down the line. New knowledge means more diagnoses

Attachment disorder. Children who have been badly treated or neglected from birth and put into the care system will often have this. Again not always diagnosed from the start. Presents in a variety of ways. Again, more recent research into this has lead to more children being diagnosed.

These kinds of “mental health” disorders are on the increase but likely due to increased research and understanding of how they present and not that they are being over diagnosed.

Having a child of my own going through an ASD assessment (been going on for years) these labels are not given lightly. We were refused a diagnosis and discharged but re referred back a few years later to seek a reassessment for diagnosis. My child has issues which have not been resolved and no one knows what to do. They are “mental health” issues which look like they may form part of an ASD diagnosis. They told me that a lot of the HF/Aspergers diagnoses are given later/older as many children appear to manage without a diagnosis or their Behavior is borderline and could be seen as developmental up until a certain age. The correct diagnosis will make a difference to the type of approach that will or will not work when trying to combat some of the issues. The onset of puberty (getting earlier) often exasperates behaviours and children get labelled as anti social/disruptive etc. Without being armed with the knowledge then many families don’t seek out a diagnosis where as some do. The increased access to the internet and social media as well as mental health awareness campaigns means that more people are able to see off a diagnosis route is needed.

Looking into family history is part of the diagnosis process and it is very interesting to be able to identify the undiagnosed members of the family. I have a parent with OCD who hasn’t worked because of it since his 50s. I strongly believe he also has Aspergers. I believe this as I have studied this alot as a special needs teacher and student of psychology so know what I’m looking at. When he was diagnosed with OCD 20 years ago after a complete nervous breakdown there was less understanding of the AUtism spectrum. A diagnosis back then may have meant strategies could have been put in place to keep him employed. Without this he was retired early on ill health and deemed unemployable. He lives alone and manages his daily life to an extent however he has become socially removed from most of the family. He is very intelligent and appears extremely sociable however his social interactions are not always appropriate. He doesn’t seek a diagnosis now as he’s almost 70 and it wouldn’t help him. I think there are a lot of people from that generation undiagnosed who have managed their best in life but have actually struggled.

I personally don’t think there’s an increase in mental health problems. There are probably just as many as there has been but an increased education around mental health and new ways to help support different conditions means that more people seek a diagnosis. The increase in social media and people sharing their story online also means we see more of these. Many years ago people didn’t talk about their mental health conditions and definitely didn’t publicise them. Now my Facebook feed is full of parents sharing their child’s mental health issues (I don’t share my child’s and don’t agree with the over sharing a lot of the time). But even anonymous forums such as these where I may tell my story means it’s one more story out there for someone to read.

Hope that all makes sense.

Oh and I also believe things like obesity are genetic. One side of my family all take on a certain shape. They are all overweight to different extents. I realised this when I attended a family funeral for the first time many years ago. The other side of my family are all very slim. I have two children of my own and one has definitely inherited the bigger shaped side of the family genes and the other child the slimmer genes. What this means is that o can acknowledge this and keep strategies in place to make sure my child doesn’t get obese. It’s not an excuse to let her get obese. I do know that it is very hard though as she eats less that her slimmer sibling. They both do the same physical activity classes/clubs too but the bigger child needs more motivation and will happily sit around when the slimmer child never stops moving all day.

I agree with the OP. As a teacher I saw with dismay that children were being diagnosed and medicated for behaviours which in the old days would have been called the now unacceptable terms of slower, idle, boisterous, poorly behaved and so on. Once they would have reacted to discipline or grown out of it. Now they are on hard drugs with goodness knows what damage.

For clarity OP Autism is not a mental health condition and to include it in your list is extremely naive and bloody stupid.

Tbh anything that causes anyone pain is awful no matter how trivial. You are being massively unreasonable op.
Sometimes something supposedly tiny can push someone over the edgae whilst something else might have no effect.

@Teacher22 or, those children were under diagnosed in the past. Adhd is also a neurological condition. Many children who would now be diagnosed dyslexic or dyspraxic, left school very early because they struggled.

Behaviour is communication. As a teacher I once went on a training course where the leader managed to get a room full of teachers to misbehave. Because we were given a task we thought was pointless and asked to do it in a way that was really difficult. Chikdren with SEN often display the behaviour you describe because they can't access the work, they are anxious, it is easier to be the clown than admit you can't read the work.

....the now unacceptable terms of slower, idle, boisterous, poorly behaved and so on.

Jeez not sure where go go with that comment....and, slower...really?! Fucking hell.