To think parking charges are killing the high street?

[menztoray]

Lots more people are shopping online now including myself. But if you do want to shop in traditional high streets, parking charges are often fairly high. I think this stops people shopping in high streets, especially if they just want to buy a few low value things. I understand that local councils need to make money, but I do think this is contributing to killing the high street.

How often do you buy large electrical goods? If you are only going to town once every few years to buy a fridge, I doubt your shopping is enough to sustain the high street.

The majority of high street shopping - clothes, books, ‘top up’ food - can be carried if you plan for it (take a rucksack and shopper bag).

You don't have to drive! Cars are killing the high street, not parking. The best way to get people to use shops again is get people to arrive by foot, cycle or public transport.

So it's £3 in parking or £6 in bus fare. Or walk/c cycle and don't buy much.
Yeah, online shopping it is..

Its a contribution for sure, but its just a natural evolution, the department store taking out the local independents, the out of town shopping centers all contributed as well. Add onto that some business owners thinking they had had a captive market so big name brands refused to accept the new trend instead of looking at short term core profits.

Its a natural progression that won't be put back in the bag, even the huge Sears in the US has recently closed. People have rose tinted glasses about the old high street, but its for the high street to appeal to the consumer, not the consumer to carry on subsidising a model that has been on a downward trend for quite a while, the internet may have exasperated that problem, but there is a reason why it's successful .

We were rather outraged the other day to discover parking in town costs more on a Sunday.

Obviously the days of free parking on a Sunday are long gone, but we didn't think we'd be stung for more than the usual rate!

We have a massive free for 3 hours supermarket right next door to our £1.50 an hour cheapest town parking.

When there's only 2 shops in town it's not worth the money.
We've just had a huge retail park open up too. Only 2 shops have opened there and 1 is a coffee shop. Why!?

I used to live in a small town with lots of lovely independent shops on the high street - shoes, clothes, hardware, haberdashery, newsagents, cafes etc. All parking was free. It started to die when they built a large supermarket at the edge of the town - the kind you can buy everything in.

I agree that awkward and expensive parking has killed the high street but I also think the expansion of what you can pick up when doing your food shop has contributed too. Theres no need to pop to the high street when you can pick up socks, tshirts, diy equipment, kitchenware etc at the supermarket that you're visiting anyway.

Should add that in the other small town 15 miles away, parking was time restricted (but still free) and the high street there is still busy and thriving.

The supermarkets in that town are still mainly just for food and basics, with a few very limited lines such as having school uniform available but only at the start of term. Independant businesses thrive in that town, as do chain names that have long disappeared from other high streets nearby.

@PinkFizzz

I would imagine that;s a pretty captive market, especially if there are shops open that are not in nearby towns, there are some high streets doing surviving, the general trend is downwards though. It isn't for the consumer to prop it up with some faux nostalgia (I'm not suggesting you are saying that)

Parking charges don't have to be the downfall if the atmosphere of the shopping area is nice. I live on the continent and in my city (and nearby ones) all the main shopping areas are big pedestrianised streets (no cars other than police between 10am and 6pm). Always always busy and full of people. I still do a lot of online shopping simply because I'm time pressed but for my own clothes shopping I do browse on the high street because its, well, pleasant!

On the weekends loads of people drive in to the city and park in the underground parking to go shopping.

So if you have a nice shopping atmosphere, people will come. The city council is also very active in putting on lots of events in the city centre.

Witney is the town other towns should look at. It is busy with decent shops and free multi-storey parking.

I go out of my way to go there. It’s brilliant.

Parking charges don't have to be the downfall if the atmosphere of the shopping area is nice

That's not 100% true though for the UK, it is somewhat true in tourist/destination cities (although they are still seeing a downfall), it's been in slow decline for decades with everyone wanting a more convenient shopping model hence the rise of department stores and supermarkets that sell everything under one roof, even the majority of independents that people now woo over are bulked up with identikit items from wholesalers.

From what I know of the continent they didn't go full on with wishing that a Starbucks, restaurant chain etc opened up on their high street like everyone did in the UK. It depends where you are on the continent to try and make the comparison with, but the "death of the highstreet" is a western issue, its the fact it's now hitting some of the middle income levels areas and starting to show an impact onto the more tourist/destination areas that it's starting to gain some traction.

YANBU

no one would go into the high street to buy a fridge, and if you did (john lewis maybe? cant think of many shops on the high street where you buy large electricals, all currys and argos seem to be in retail parks)you would be going into choose and then getting it delivered surely even if you had a car with you?
I prefer to get the train or bus, it's cheap and handy for where I live, I rarely go into town however because I always have kids with me, either my own or childminded kids, and small kids and buggies are not fun in shops, so I prefer online shopping

It's also high business rates and rents. The town I live in is quickly dying because business just can't afford to stay.

The town centre now has so few shops there is little pint in going there. I go for the hairdressers, dentist, doctors and library. There's no point in trying to get any sports wear it school shoes or fresh fish. They're just bit for sale in a once thriving market town. I think once a week the meat van is in the market.

It's sad, and could have been avoided if so many out of town shops hadn't been built. There ms room for them all in the town centre, but it's cheaper for them to be out if town, and the free carpark is always full.

20 minutes free parking at door of the shops, with lots of 90 minutes free parking 3 minutes walk away (multiple locations). £2 for 4 hours parking also available.

Our small town high street is on its knees, dying. Parking availability is irrelevant.

It's sad, and could have been avoided if so many out of town shops hadn't been built.

Do you think that government should function to prevent new businesses from setting up in order to protect older businesses for competition?

All the stuff about how people should walk and use buses sounds like the things some of the key Councillors in my Town say. Yes there should be measures to encourage this. But given how hard it is to keep town centres functioning, it is naive to focus on this. The focus needs to be on - what can get the most people possible shopping in town centres.

Our town centre was busy with lots of chain restaurants and stores. Rents and rates were fairly high, so many of the smaller independent places that had been there for years, ended up closing or relocating. Those chains are now closing and our Town centre is not looking good.
Close by to me is a road with lots of independents that have been there for years. A butchers, greengrocers, gift shop, bakery, etc. Free short term parking outside the shops. I shop there regularly and the shops always seem to be fairly busy and doing well.

People will still shop either if it is something you can not get easily over the internet, or it is low value things with a good shopping experience. So to get as good meat as I can get from the butcher, I have to shop online with a minimum order of £35 up. The meat is better than at supermarkets. The bakers is good, but some supermarkets also do good bread. And the bakers do delicious cakes. But easy when I drive by to stop and get a lovely loaf - easier than going to the supermarket.

And many people will go out of their way to support independents if they are easy to get to. But not if they have to pay a lot to park, or take a longer time on the bus or walking.

Do you think that government should function to prevent new businesses from setting up in order to protect older businesses for competition?

It's not about preventing new business setting up, it's about the location if the new businesses. One company wanted to build a complex in the town centre with restaurants, cinema etc, but one an out of town site hit the go ahead they pulled out. If the brand new Fat Face, H&M, Nando's etc were all in the mainly empty town centre it would be so much easier to go to the post office, market, small indecent health food shop and then H&M and Nando's for lunch. As it is I end up doing a lot of driving to get what I need. Other town manage to have most of their shops in the town centre, so it can be done. Not every single high street is dying, but lots are and some councils really need to look at what is and isn't working in other towns.

The town I live in actually isn't that bad a place to live. But if you came to the town centre it looks grim. It help keeps house prices low though.

indecent health food shop

That sounds fun.

Businesses that are viable out of town often aren't viable in town: more expensive buildings, more rates, higher staff costs, most likelihood of crime. The reasons for the flight from city centres are complex; out of town parks are a symptom, not a cause.

I prefer to get the train or bus, it's cheap and handy for where I live

Which is lucky for you. For lots of people, especially outside the major cities, public transport isn't cheap nor handy and virtually non existent for some people. Yet the stupid councils still persist on alienating the car driver with pedestrianisation, traffic calming, one way systems, high parking charges, etc., when the council has done nothing to improve the dismal public transport in the town.

Not every single high street is dying, but lots are and some councils really need to look at what is and isn't working in other towns.

We were very surprised at Bath city centre - very busy and vibrant with few empty shops. But then realised there were few out of town retail stores nor retail parks and exceptionally good public transport with bus and train station right next to the shopping centre. A very well planned city centre.

Then again, same with York, but York have managed to keep their city centre alongside an outlet village, out of town superstores and a couple of retail parks. Again, a very good park and ride network that funnels people into the city centre. So that shows you can keep the city centre AND have out of town shopping areas too!

It all comes back to proper planning, decent public transport etc - that's the roll of the councils!

when the council has done nothing to improve the dismal public transport in the town.

It was taken out of councils' control by Thatcher. But not in London. Odd, that.

It was taken out of councils' control

Control - yes, indeed, but in lots of areas, the local council's do actually work to improve the public transport, provide finance, work with public transport providers re improvements, etc: Tram systems in Edinburgh, Manchester, Sheffield and even Blackpool all heavily involve their local councils. Our town's (completely pointless!) park and ride scheme is financed and managed by our local council. You really can't say the councils have no involvement with public transport. As with lots of things, some councils are better than others. Some awful councils have basically done bugger all to improve public transport whilst at the same time hammered the motorist - and their town centres suffer as a result.

My local high street is doing well enough. Parking on the street itself is free, but it switches which side you can park on at 1 and you'll get a ticket if you leave your car on the wrong side. Parking on the side streets is unrestricted.

Thinking about where else I shop. Retail parks, free parking. Another suburb, again can park on a side street or there's a reasonable pay-and-display.

I didn't go into the city centre to shop at all last year, and rarely in 2017. The parking charges aren't too bad in some of the car parks IIRC, but not too bad is still more expensive than free, and driving in the city centre sucks.

In the expensive South East, I can travel from a village nearby (I park on my friend's drive almost opposite the station for free) by train to a choice of towns, the train ticket is generally cheaper than 1-2 hours parking. However I sometimes drive to a different, more touristy town, with very few chain shops and lots of independents (the chocolate shop is well worth a visit). There the parking is free till 10am and free again after 5pm - great for a quick shop after the school run, and only 80p or so per hour thereafter, and free after 3 on Saturdays.

While I think they got the weekdays right, it's impossible to park on a Saturday afternoon the whole town is clogged with shoppers you cannot find a space or a free meter so I go to a different touristy with lots of independent shops nearby town where it's 60p or so per hour from 7am to 7pm 7 days a week, and if you park behind one of the supermarkets I think you can get a voucher off your shopping for an hour's parking. Both touristy towns are heaving any day of the week. The bigger more commercial towns are horrendous, it costs about £4-5 an hour, and the shops are pretty deserted.