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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

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Original poster

Nursery safeguarding issue

51 replies

Hobbies22 · 19/12/2018 22:10

Nursery safeguarding issue - advice needed

So today I went to collect my 3 year old from nursery only to be ushered into the managers office to be informed of “ serious incident “
This incident happens to be that they left my little boy in his nursery room - alone ! For 30 minutes whilst the class went off to soft play in a completely separate area outside of nursery.
I was and still am in shock - they are calling me tomorrow morning to discuss in detail and will log the incident with ofsted - but what if anything can be done /should be done to prevent this happening again
They had temporary staff in today so I don’t know but I’m feeling horribly uneasy about sending him back ?

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OP posts:

Kolo · 19/12/2018 22:46

It is a requirement of registration that any serious incidents are reported to ofsted. During every inspection visit I’ve had, I’ve been questioned to check that I know when I have to report to ofsted, so it must be quite fresh in their mind.

Cranky17 · 19/12/2018 22:51

It is a legal requirement absolutely, and it comes under the area of guidance of a’serious incident’
Ofsted will take it very seriously and can and will change their inspection outcome if they deem it. They will do an investigation, and I think they will do a spot check. They won’t be impressed with temp staff taking children to soft play.
Also ask to see their risk assessment on leaving the nursery, how do they transport children, eg high vis vests, counting in and out, whether they reduce the ratios.

AmandaBuffamonteezi · 19/12/2018 22:59

I am a nursery manager but if this was at my son's nursery and they'd told me they were reporting to Ofsted I'd make sure I called them too. If this was a member of my team responsible for such a serious incident they would be suspended immediately. I'm glad he's ok and not too bothered by it

BlueJay1 · 19/12/2018 23:16

Oh poor little one. So glad he's not been upset by it though.

I have a 4yo. I didn't want to leave her in a day nursery for the exact reason - temporary staff. They don't know what they are doing a lot of the time, the get paid peanuts and are often inexperienced. It's not good enough.

I would look for an establishment who have permanent, well qualified staff. Perhaps a childminder? Until he starts school.

Imagine what could have happened, 30 mins with no supervision. It doesn't bare thinking about.

Original poster

Hobbies22 · 20/12/2018 07:05

I will wait to hear from the operations manager today - I have concerns regarding 2 things - clearly how on Earth he was missed when headcounting the room prior to them moving out to soft play , 2. How they manage to keep control of the nursery when they host an event and things are out of “norm” such a people taking children home early ect- on several occasions my OH has forgot to sign him in when handing over and has not been challenged or signed him out - and after reading some of the comments here this should be paramount. And secondly what’s the policy regarding supervision after a head injury- they followed protocol , called me and applied compress but after that how long should they be under supervision ?

OP posts:

4sausages · 20/12/2018 07:46

A child was left alone in the building at a nursery near me. Ofsted found several safeguarding issues and when the nursery didn't improve within the allotted time they were closed down.

IAmW0manHearMeRoar · 20/12/2018 07:51

If this happened to my child, there is NO WAY they'd be going back!

IAmW0manHearMeRoar · 20/12/2018 07:55

At my nursery a member of staff is responsible for standing at the door with a register to mark children as arrived.
I once had to go in the middle of the day to take my child to an appointment in the same building and they still signed in and out.
I mean. My god! What if there had been a fire and they missed your child!

ExFury · 20/12/2018 07:59

When you say there was the carol concert so parents in and out does this mean your son was potentially vulnerable to other adults entering the room?

I’d be deeply concerned that they didn’t notice at any point that they were a child short during that trip. They didn’t have an “oh shit” moment where they realised, they were completely oblivious.

I’d be calling ofsted and your local LADO to check the nursery had reported the incident. That’s a serious one and the fact they didn’t realise has huge implications for things like fire safety. Add in that your child had a head knock and it’s a very poor situation all round.

Witchend · 20/12/2018 08:18

If they'd wanted to hide it they could have glossed it over with calling you aside and saying something along the lines of.
"Just to let you know, he's saying he was left alone, but what really happened was..."
And come up with something fairly plausible about taking all the children to the toilet and him not noticing the leader sorting the soft toys and only being gone for 5 minutes.

They're taking it seriously, he thought it was a big adventure (as one of mine would have done-it would probably have been her favourite time ever!) So wouldn't be thinking of making any more fuss than asking them to let me know any outcomes of investigation.

woolduvet · 20/12/2018 08:20

It'd be interesting to see their supply staff policy too. Whether their allowed to accompany an outing or be in charge. Were they in charge of the room. Had they signed to have had sight of safeguarding policies etc. Did they sign the ch in and out.

woolduvet · 20/12/2018 08:21

*They're

Jamiefraserskilt · 20/12/2018 08:41

Bloody dreadful. Glad he is ok.
You need to know:
Confirmation backed up with cctv proof of how long he was left alone.
Confirmation the head knock was recorded in their internal records.
Action taken on the head knock
What they are going to do to stop it ever happening again
Confirmation that the incident has been reported to Ofsted with reference number if possible.
Confirmation of the actions taken internally regarding the staff responsible for your son at that time, within allowed limits for disclosure.
Formal letter of apology.
Then call Ofsted yourself to confirm the report has been made and matches the information you have been provided.
Did you receive a head knock note ?
Did the head knock happen before he was left? If so, how long before? This is relevant to the conversation you need to have with them/Ofsted.
If the only reason that you were told was because he was telling the world, that is very worrying. However, you wont really know. Also, What ifs can we more worrying than the actual event. Try not to dissolve in what ifs. As parents we do this automatically which creates anxiety around something that didn't happen. Try and focus on what did, why and what they will do to prevent it happening again.
Then decide whether the actions taken mean you are happy for him to stay in their care.

BifsWif · 20/12/2018 08:46

Log it with OFSTED yourself.

As other posters have suggested, request the CCTV timings and ask for confirmation of everything in writing.

I would be furious, and very shaken. I hope you’re ok.

Malbecfan · 20/12/2018 08:59

As someone else has said, Local Authority Designated Safeguarding Officer. Very young children are a priority.

Sorry this has happened and hopefully your little boy will continue to think of it as an adventure (doesn't help your "what ifs" though).

I took a group of year 7s and 8s out on Tuesday and yesterday. I ticked them off on my list, head-counted them on the coach (about 25 metres away from the school door) and re-checked them in the church that they walked to crocodile-fashion with adults at each end When we got back on the coach afterwards, my Head was ushering them onto the bus in the rain. I asked if he was counting them on and he looked very sheepish and said he hadn't done it so wandered up the bus to confirm we had them all. They are 11, 12 & 13, almost all of them have mobile phones and can speak up for themselves. Your little boy is 3. The adults in both situations had the same responsibilities - we don't always get it right but in your position, I would request urgent re-training and review of all policies.

Asmallrole · 20/12/2018 09:11

What is really worrying about this is that it happened on a day when people were wandering in and out. Why on earth take them out on a day like that when it's even more important to be vigilant ? If an adult had taken your child would anyone have even noticed ? This could have been a tragedy and there is no way he would be going back.

mortifiedmama · 20/12/2018 10:07

Question : is it a legal requirement to log such a breach with ofsted ? Or if I hadn’t mentioned it would they not ?

It is, but whether they would? I'm not sure. I'd do it myself personally.

Do you have any other niggles or concerns about the nursery? I'm not one to fly off the handle and mistakes happen BUT I'd be finding it difficult to place him back there.

I'd also worry that DS wouldn't feel secure there any more. He must have been so confused.

Huggybear16 · 20/12/2018 10:17

What is really worrying about this is that it happened on a day when people were wandering in and out

This jumped out at me too. You have every right to be angry. I really don't know what I would do in this situation, the thought of my little boy all alone would make me see red!

Sounds like you're doing the right things. Make sure it is escalated and everything is written down. I feel for you OP, this is awful!

KittyVonCatsington · 20/12/2018 10:18

Oh gosh, I think I know what nursery this is (one in Woolwich, perhaps?) due to the softplay being in the same building. You are doing everything correct but I would also follow up with an email or letter, detailing your conversations so far and what you would like going forward.
So sorry this has happened to you and your little boy.

Thehop · 20/12/2018 13:28

How did you get on OP?

Original poster

Hobbies22 · 20/12/2018 15:26

Thank you everyone for your excellent information . Spent a long time with the ops manager over the phone where I got what I believe was an honest assessment of the situation
Summary below :

The failings happened because the sign in sign out sheet was done upon ARRIVAL at the soft play area hence the reason the key missed him - no check before leaving and potentially he was in the toilet / hiding away
The most concerning thing is that it was the permanent staff involved and not the temps are previously thought - and it was the deputy manager of the nursery was the lady who did this ( who also happens to be room leader of my sons room )
The manager was offsite so she was effectively in charge
The deputy manager has been suspended pending inquiry
It has been reported to ofsted and I have the reference number and will be calling myself also

The operations manager basically held her hands up and said it was indefensible ( it is !) and that’s why the suspension happened
My concern is if management can and do behave with flouting the processes and polices of course the staff will follow !
Utterly concerning - I have asked for communication to be passed to all parents regarding this which they agreed to

OP posts:

SDTGisAnEvilWolefGenius · 20/12/2018 15:38

I would have thought that the swift action that the Manager has taken, as well as the general shock of realising what happened, and the fact that the member of staff responsible has been suspended, will guarantee that this won’t happen again.

I’m glad it has been taken so seriously - and more glad that nothing bad happened while your son was alone - and I can understand why you are worried.

Original poster

Hobbies22 · 20/12/2018 17:09

Sorry I hadn’t made it clear - the sign out sheet was completed outside of the nursery area - which wasn’t cross checked with the register in the nursery room prior to leaving - so of course when they checked the headcount they “believed “ all children were present and correct . Which of course means in the event of a fire or anything else serious regarding an evacuation they would of assumed all children were present in front of them .
I do believe the swift suspension means they are taking it seriously - I haven’t as yet spoke to the LOCA as suggested but ofsted couldn’t confirm what the nursery had reported so it’s hard to see what their version of evens to ofsted is - any suggestions or advice to verify what nursery have reported ?

OP posts:

Huggybear16 · 20/12/2018 18:20

I guess you could write your own email/letter to OFSTED? They may not divulge to you what the nursery have said, but they will surely investigate any discrepancies?

What they have told you is bad enough. If they were going to lie, you'd think they'd do a better job. It sounds as if they have been honest and, with the suspension and reporting, are taking it seriously.

SquirrelsTyrells · 20/12/2018 20:23

Quote-

I hope they don’t go down the route of it being his fault. A similar thing happened to my daughter actually. In a playgroup setting. She’d wandered off. I’d even told them she is an escape artist. Anyway, they said bag she is to tell them that she wants to go elsewhere, it’s her responsibility and in a tone that made me feel unreasonable tbh. I wish I’d have asserted myself more.

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