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AIBU?

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Original poster

To say no to my cleaner coming over Christmas?

347 replies

ettyz · 19/12/2018 14:17

My cleaner who works 5 days a week doing 6 hours a day for us and gets above the average wage for a cleaner, has said that she needs to work next week. I said no to working Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday as obviously it’s Christmas and no to Friday as I have people over. She’s obviously self employed and we are her only cleaning job, but I don’t really fancy someone cleaning when Me and dh not at work, all the kids are at home and we just want to relax without anyone in the home. She said it’s too much money for her to lose out and she won’t be able to afford to not work those days. she hates Christmas and doesn’t have any family to spend it with so was actually asking to do Christmas Day! It’s not my fault she hasn’t budgeted for it but we had told her when we first took her on in April that we don’t need her services over Christmas. Aibu to say no to her working those days next week, I don’t want to upset her. We are hosting Christmas at ours so no time when we won’t be at home next week for her to pop in and clean, plus I’m at home so I’ll be able to do it anyway!

OP posts:
HollowTalk · 19/12/2018 14:59

It's an interesting and thought-provoking first post, OP.

DeloresJaneUmbridge · 19/12/2018 14:59

I have a feeling that if she cleans only for you it’s not self employment

Do you generate a wage slip for her?

Is she paying tax?

Be wary as if she isn’t declaring that income then the tax office can come after YOU as well as her I think.

OopsInamechangedagain · 19/12/2018 15:01

Could she muck out your unicorn stables next week?

BettyOcean · 19/12/2018 15:03

Do you and/or partner receive paid holidays from your places of work.

How would you feel if you got told to financially go fuck yourself by an employer, to suck it up and come back in the new year to carry on working.

You have a friendly relationship with this woman who is helping your avoid having to pay HMRC certain employer fees, jeopardise that at you peril.

SpongeBobJudgeyPants · 19/12/2018 15:05

If this is really as you say it is, I suspect the Inland Revenue would claim you employ her, so you need to give her holiday pay. And never mind giving her overtime in the New Year. She needs the money Christmas week you tight person Xmas Hmm

Merryoldgoat · 19/12/2018 15:07

If you are her only job she is not self employed. You need to check your obligations to her as her employer, which you are.

safetyfreak · 19/12/2018 15:07

Omg just pay her for that week! It's Christmas. Tightfisted.

Themadcleaner · 19/12/2018 15:07

I hope this is bullshit, if it's not I feel really sorry for your cleaner! Be a decent human being and pay her holiday!

hickerydickerydockmouse · 19/12/2018 15:10

considering you are hosting a party, I would ask her to come in that day. Trust me it's so much easier when you have help at hand on parties. She can help with serving or clearing up after the party. My inlaws are comfortable and they ask their cleaner to come over to help during parties. Back home we too employ extra help for get togethers.

myrtleWilson · 19/12/2018 15:10

But you won't be able to get into the kitchen/breakfast room with all those days of breakfast mess piling up without the cleaner coming Shock

SushiMonster · 19/12/2018 15:10

If she is doing 30h a week for you, you're her only client and you dictate the days/hours it is very likely that you would fail the test for self employment anyway.

Pay her for the days you don't want her in next week. Don't be a tight fuck.

Schuyler · 19/12/2018 15:11

She’s not self employed, what a mess.

recklessruby · 19/12/2018 15:14

Firstly you must have a massive house! I used to be employed as a cleaner for a big nightclub and even over xmas/New year when it was really messy I didn't get 30 hours.
Secondly I do feel sorry for her. She'd rather work on Xmas day coz she has no family?
She sounds like a Polish girl at the club who s family were all back in Poland.
She didn't have enough spare money to go home.
Why don't you give her the week off and the money? Good cleaners are hard to find.

Worriedmummybekind · 19/12/2018 15:15

Firstly. From a legal point of view you are her employer. It’s actually not something either one of you decide, it’s what HMRC rules say.
However if you are both happy with it then these things do go under the radar so ...

Secondly, if you are willing to let her do over time in the new year then I would pay her now as an advance and make clear she then owes you the hours back. That’s probably a pragmatic approach.

However, from a legal point of view you have to pay her stat holidays since she is technically your employee.

TartedUpYard · 19/12/2018 15:15

And today, in things that didn't happen....

Mia1415 · 19/12/2018 15:16

I would check your assertion that she’s “obviously self employed” very csrefully. If she’s working 30 hours a week for you and you’re her only cleaning job she may well be your employee as a matter of law, in which case she’s entitled to paid holiday. And a pension and NICS.

THIS!!!

Worriedmummybekind · 19/12/2018 15:17

Personally, I would pay holiday because it’s the legal and morally right thing to do.

Redtartanshoes · 19/12/2018 15:19

I refute to believe you have 7 bathrooms that need cleaning so frequently. ((Misses point))))

NamedyChangedy · 19/12/2018 15:20

Have you already given her the Christmas bonus? You could treat the extra pay as a bonus of sorts if it helps you to rationalise it, but I do think it would be right and proper to pay her for the week.

Her employment status is another issue which you should consider, should the relationship turn sour - you're arguably avoiding paying tax & NICs so you wouldn't want anyone making a malicious call to HMRC. If she's working for you 5 days a week, she's absolutely your employee, regardless of what she does in her spare time. It's no different from having a full-time nanny, who does a few hours babysitting as well. Employee.

NamedyChangedy · 19/12/2018 15:22

Also, it happens a lot on here but I don't see the point in suggesting that the OP is making things up. Perhaps I'm being incredibly naive, but why would anyone take the time to post something that isn't true!? Is there some entertainment value in it that I'm missing??

LordPickle · 19/12/2018 15:22

ShockShockShock this cannot be real. It's awful.

SoyDora · 19/12/2018 15:22

Who is going to clean your antiques and 7 bathrooms next week?

fruitbrewhaha · 19/12/2018 15:22

No definitely not an employee.

I've just checked HMRC is it clearly states that these rules do not apply in fictional circumstances.

So OP you don't really need a make believe cleaner to clean your imaginary house.

cowfacemonkey · 19/12/2018 15:23

Well under normal self employed standards I wouldn't pay her. I don't pay my dog walker for example when I have time off and don't require her. I'm self employed and don't get paid when clients aren't available.
HOWEVER given that she is working a set amount of hours each week in the same location every week then technically that's a not self employed position.

HelloSunshine11 · 19/12/2018 15:23

I've paid my cleaner in lieu of her coming on boxing day which would be her usual day. Mind, she only comes three hours a week so it's more affordable.

In your shoes I would pay her for the days that would otherwise be working days (ie not Xmas Day and Boxing Day) and formalise her terms and conditions.

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