To sack someone due to 'bad cultural fit'

[aveleila]

So I work in a field that is notoriously difficult to recruit. So I was delighted to find someone who seemed perfect for the job and had excellent qualifications.
All started well, she settled into the team with effortless ease. Within a month or two she started gossiping that the team had too much work and that she had been given too much work. She struggled with the pace of the job ( lots of concrete examples).

She seemed to work it out after about 4 months but her presence has simply disrupted what has always been a friendly, professional team who work well with each other.

On the same floor she has made friends with people from a different department and seems to have fitted in great with them.

She never speaks to me, not even to say hello or goodbye. If she wants authorisation for something it is always through email. She makes all decisions without speaking to me and if she needs advice it's always the medical team not me she goes to.

I have had to bring up with her errors she has made on a pretty much daily basis. To begin with I put it down to her being new. However now I know she is competent and capable but just lazy and doesn't feel the need for very high standards of work.

I overheard her gossiping about me to colleagues saying 'I literally come in each day wondering what I will get told off for today. If she does not stop I am leaving and good job trying to recruit for my position when I have gone'.

She is passing me off as a bully when all I have done is challenge lazy behaviour.

The final straw is now she is lying about completing tasks she hasn't done. Claiming she has checked equipment she couldn't have as they were locked in a different building.

She has depression and I am worried about being accused of being heartless but she is disrupting the office environment. A few team members have complained about her work ethic and I don't feel like I can trust her due to previous false claims from her.

I'm now at the stage where I can't even stand to give her a friendly smile and I really don't want to end up accused of bullying.

Sorry for ranting on, but this is the first time I have ever been in this situation. Would the things I have mentioned here be enough for her to fail her 6 months probation?

Her 5 month review is coming up and I know I have to give her a chance to improve but I really just want her out of the company at this point.

You know what actrally I was on a 12 month probation period and they just told me they wouldn't be keeping me on but would be happy to give me a good reference that was the end of that your job ain't secure until you pass the probation period. You should remind her that

I've been here. I'd end her employment now, and not wait until the end of her probation.

If she's talking about you behind your back and accusing you of bullying you will also likely be questioned by HR if not worse.

I've been here. She sounds like a trouble maker and she will.cause you much bigger headaches in the future.

I've been told by HR they are as dishonesty is against the job policy. However I don't fully trust them.

Surely the fact you don't trust your HR department to the point that you'd rather seek advice from randommers MN is a bigger issue than this woman?

And ignore all the "you're clearly a terrible manager" crowd who have obviously never had the misfortune to come across someone who is a useless employee and colleague. There are plenty of them around.

I’ve had to sack quite a few people in my time, for a variety of reasons. There are plenty out there.

Just because the employee sounds poor (though the person’s other supervisor disagrees) doesn’t mean that the management by the OP isn’t also poor. As described, any managers on my team who were approaching management like that would find themselves getting some pretty remedial interventions, and if no improvement be on performance measures themselves.

There are definitely plenty of useless employees but a good skilled manager is a rare thing indeed too, easy to manage people who don;t need managing but when someone does need it - funny how many managers, rather than try to resolve a problem just think about sacking someone - even when replacing them is incredibly tricky - OP I think you could do with some people management training!

I would not want someone like the person the OP describes. HR opinion should be sought though.

Not having the courtesy to say hello when arriving is bad in my book for starters.

My advice to managers at work is if you are unsure during probation and have given a chance to improve then cut your losses sooner rather than later. You don’t have employment rights until 2 years so can’t claim unfair dismissal etc. However you can raise a claim if you feel you have been discriminated against due to a protected characteristic.

Hasn’t read the full post when I answered. It does sound like this hasn’t been handled that well. Maybe sit down and explain your concerns and give her some time to improve. Discussions should be face to face and not via email.

Is there a problem, or are you the problem?

Why are you posting on MN? Hardly appropriate for an employer.

probation should be used to build skills and behaviours
This is probably one of the best posts.
You have admitted yourself that she hasn’t been trained properly in your opinion. She has depression, has allies (who write glowing feedback for her? ), she has been there a few months only. You do sound like you are micromanaging. I have seen a least twice bad managers in my career so far. Both of them thought everyone seemed to like them. Both ended up wasting the time and money of their companies and their team members. Nearly all of their ‘bad’ employees are at excellent places now. They left and joined elsewhere.

If you don’t dismiss someone in the first three months of their probation, they are most probably worth putting the time and effort in for training and managing by them properly. She also has depression which is a clinically disorder and a killer of performance generally. I think you should come up with a plan. Plenty of people have given a lot of good advice. In life sciences generally, there is a terrible lack of managerial training. Anyone and everyone with ten years of work experience under their belt starts to think they can manage juniors/others now. This serious lack ofr formal training wastes so much talent.

Never write anything negative in an email.
Needs must sometimes.
It's a way to ensure there is a clear trail so that those who are liable to be poor at work and shit stir can't claim nobody told them (and other such lies and games they play around more senior people).

The OP clearly needs to think about how they manage people they aren't friends with as it's a different skill (and probably more useful than only managing people who you like), but I still think I'd be wanting to cut my losses and get rid if someone was showing signs of lying and stirring during their probation whilst brown nosing those higher up.

Like other posters, I've also worked with toxic hires and once they've got their feet under the table they can do a lot of damage to an organisation and are difficult to get rid of (often because their default view is that everyone is out to get them, just like everyone at their last job had a personal issue etc).

If she is complaining about the work load go "fine we are going to make you redundant and create two different roles from this one. You are welcome to apply for other roles but they will be different because of x, y and z. Thank you for your work and wish you the best of luck"

And hr emails about everything. Also encourage others who see her behaviour and find out an issue to highlight their concerns with hr - this will make it a team highlighting it rather than an individual issue.

Email everything that is an issue to her when it arises and bcc in hr each time. Set up a weekly meeting as the consultant says to lay out the pros and cons of her work. Make sure you do minutes that you email between you with next steps etc for her development.

Her declining training is no longer an option - tell her in those meetings "you will be doing x training - it will be at x on y/when it's best for you, Tuesday or Thursday?"

You are her manager and not needing to be her friend. Be open about your expectations and how she needs to achieve them. Set milestones with her and when they are not hit, she will go down the route of losing her job

Need to create a paper trail then discuss issues and agree objectives face to face - confirm discussions by email. Having discussions via email is a crap cop out.

We are in Aus so different employment laws but I would say if you can do it and stay within the law do it. One person at our work was let go on the last day of her probation and was told “not a good cultural fit”. She wasn’t but leaving it until the last minute when she didn’t understand what she had done wrong was hard to watch. Another person was kept on after probation even though everyone knew she was the wrong person in the role, mainly because one of the senior people who had hired her wouldn’t admit they had got it wrong. She stayed for another year at which point she was miserable as she was being performance managed as everyone was complaining about her work. Much kinder to do it fast (and much better for you!). Nobody needs a toxic colleague.

Speak to HR

We had someone like this and it took months to get rid . Ugh 😑

EvaReady
I agree that discussions come first.

Email has it's place though. If surprised me that anyone would say nothing negative should go in an email.

I would say talk to your HR team and confirm that okay to dismiss (within 2 year period). Check that no obvious protected characteristics risk.

Also I'd suggest being wary of a bullying complaint against you (particularly if she has the Consultant onside). Again - best to talk to HR now and ensure you follow proper process.

You are complaining that she is lying about not completing tasks and she is complaining that she and the team have too much work. Sounds like you need to sit down and discuss the issue, as an employee will lie if they do not have time to do everything. If she did not have enough training like you said, that would be your fault, why she is not up to the job and it is up to you to fix it.
'On the same floor she has made friends with people from a different department and seems to have fitted in great with them.' Maybe you just do not get on with her and she has taken a dislike to you because she is overwhelmed, not trained enough and receives you complaints.
You sound condescending and clueless, academic ability would mean being able to work independently and not having to be part of a team. Do not cut her any slack for being depressed but are you sure that some of is not your fault? Or that you are not a bully, as it has to be bad if she goes to other people for advice. If you never give a friendly smile and just complain, any employee will avoid you like the plague, only send emails and be scared to speak to you.

As for gossip, you must realise that most people hate their sad low waged jobs but have to do them.

I think you need to discuss it with her at her next review. I think you need to extend her probation period for a further 3 months and explain why. I think you should put a performance management schedule in place until the end of her probation. Explain the negativity you’re aware of. Give her a chance for her sude. You need to make her aware of the consequences if she doesn’t improve over the extended period. Explain it’s been impacting on the team. Ask her how she feels allow her to put issues forward too. That’s the right and decent way to do it. People should always be given a chance in my opinion. Good luck.

The two year period isn’t relevant if she’s still on probation. She can’t be sacked but you need to give her a chance to improve first.

Sorry that was meant to say she CAN be sacked but ....

You must get advice from HR. IME problems like these are best nipped in the bud. Stand firm and state your case with clarity and a professional manner. She sounds like the type to throw her weight around and has already disrupted the department. No-one needs that. Difficulty in recruiting is no excuse to keep a sorry excuse of a worker. Best of British.

Hi. Just looking for advice after this latest update.

So this woman has now had her 4 month probation review.

The consultant completed her 3 month review.

I completed her two month review and at the time I was positive as I hadn't realised the full extent of the issues with her and I gave her a bit more leeway to start with.

She has a chance to comment on my latest probation report and my line manager has emailed her saying that she is available to help her respond to any comments On her probation report and urged her to ensure she does respond 'especially since there is such a difference between the 2 month review and the 5 month review'. She cc me in to the email she sent this work colleague.

What does my line manager mean? What difference does it make if the report 8 weeks ago was much more positive? A lot can change in 8 weeks!

It sounds like (rightly) they are giving her a chance to respond to the shift in situation.

There's a big difference (for example) between:

1. I made a good start and things were going really well. I agree things have been a bit rocky the last few weeks and cracks are showing. I think I'm good at A B C but recently I've been doing D E F with limited training so I'm sort of muddling through really. With some training and direction I'm confident I could get where I need to be and would be happy for a longer probation to prove that

And

1. It all went well until 8 weeks when for no reason at all my manager started being horrible to me. They never speak to me other than to tell me what I've done wrong. They send arsey emails. The whole team has turned on me. My manager seems more bothered about being friends in the workplace. I have to spend all my time doing who knows what because I'm a big victim in all of this and will refuse to acknowledge my role in anything

And

1. Things started well but without training I found X Y Z really difficult. I was expecting training but none as forthcoming. I think there's been a bit of a breakdown in communication caused by lack of clarity regarding my experience. I'm really happy to work with manager and do the appropriate training but feel there needs to be some give and take. Sometimes it feels like I'm on the edge professionally because I have clearer boundaries between colleagues and friends and I wonder if that means I'm being viewed negatively. I think it can be resolved though.