Do you skip church if you have guests?

[TheOrigFV45]

Just that - if your guests are not church goers do you still go?
We are the guests, leaving for home at 11am.
DS2 said he doesn't want to go to church and it got me wondering what people generally do.

Crafts post deserved to be removed, as did abacucat's. They were both very insulting towards Christianity.

It was insulting to the catholic church. Religions are institutions, not individuals. There are no different from the gas board, your local police force or the BBC. It's a sad day when religions can no longer be insulted. But I shouldn't be surprised. It's the way of the world, people think that because they are offended, they are right.

What weak gods you all must have, that they need protection from criticism on the internet, and people are relived when insults directed at their particular religion are removed..

And the Catholic Church is run by men. Men should never be exempt from criticism just because they have the cloak of religion.

@WhatisFreddoingnow

Not charitable enough for the institution it’s supposed to stand for. I thought Jesus stood for simplicity and the Catholic Church definitely doesn’t demonstrate that! (Although there are plenty of Christian churches like this - not necessarily catholic)

Confession above the law - yep, that’s what’s I’m talking about. And sexual abuse? It’s been covered up by the church for years and please don’t deny it. They’ve used their wealth to buy people’s silence and destroyed people’s lives.

@commonpeoplelikeme

I'm not going to repeat why the Catholic Church is rich again as feel that I partly explained it in my last post. I would just reiterate that it (and it's affiliates) are one of the (if not the) largest charitable organisations in the world. In addition, all Catholics are called to give (time/efforts or money) to help the less fortunate or their community. The wealth (in the form of artworks) of the Vatican is preserved and maintained for the future generations.The Church does not defend Her position as custodian of the great Christian treasures of the world. Would you expect the Louvre/National Gallery to sell all of their artworks to feed the hungry of Paris and London?

Yes, for Catholics, there is something above the law - God. Anon confession
with God should be open to all without a hierarchy of sin. It would be next to impossible to regulate as well. Priests face automatic excommunication for breaking the seal and many have gone to their deaths to defend it. Priests also wouldn't know who was behind the screen. All it would do is stop people from going to confession and asking for God's mercy. Also, priests usually give advice in the confessional and I don't doubt that the advice would strongly be to turn yourself into the police.

I haven't ever denied sexual abuse in the church (in fact, my last post mentioned it). It's a terrible stain on our Church and those who covered it up should be jailed. Without excusing it whatsoever, it's important to note that no one has ever said that all members of the Church are good. We're full of sinners and always have been dating back to St Peter. In recent time, the Church has been working to put very strict safeguarding proceedures in place and is finally acting to eradicate it. It was addressed again recently by the Archbishop and from my experience, I know that ordinary Parish Priests are furious about it. No one is shying away from it.

Anyway, I feel that I have probably said enough and I'm now going round in circles.

Peace be with you.

WinterfellWench -
Irony in its purest form. Spouting bile and hate and vitriol at Christians, but having a go at anyone who dares say anything even slightly negative about non-whites and immigrants.

You do realise non-whites and immigrants can also be Christian? Christianity doesn’t equal white.

Can I just say that I find posts that praise the Catholic church, given it's very well know failings, highly offensive.

Given the current trend not to offend anyone, can someone from MN Towers please remove these posts in order to protect my precious sensibilities.

I think at this stage it would be better if they pulled the whole thread and we will agree to disagree.

because there was deliberate goading

The Catholic Church is rich because it has required throughout its history, even very poor people to give money regularly and its nuns and monks to surrender any wealth and assets to the church. It also used to be common for rich parishioners to buy access to a pew near the front, leaving the poor at the back, and for people to pay for indulgences. And yes I do think it should sell its works of art and give to the poor. Keeping works of art in places where most people can not see them is NOT safeguarding art for the future. Much better to sell it to public art galleries where the public can actually see it and the money can be used to help people.
But the Catholic Church has a log history of not putting poor people first. Look at the very grand cathedrals built at times when many poor people in the area were starving to death or suffering malnutrition.
And if you are a catholic you know good works do not get you to heaven. Good works are NOT a focus of the catholic church.

In a previous job I worked with many Christian churches carrying out community work, The Catholic Church did far less than many other churches. The United Reformed Churches consistently did the most - and I have NEVER worshipped at the united reformed church, but I did admire how much they all seemed to do to actually help disadvantaged people.

And the Catholic Church did not just have men who abused children working for them. There was an institutional cover up. Just as there was an institutional selling of babies born to poor single women and sold to rich parishioners, and then an institutional covering up of what they did. The institutional adherence to anti abortion that has killed mothers and led directly to infanticide. An institutional and theoretical approach that pushes girls to see their true role as wives and mothers. Magdalene laundries, missionary outposts and their abuses, etc. The issues is NOT a few bad apples, the issue is the church as an institution. When you have an institution where children and women do not really matter except to serve the church and their husband, then these things will happen. That is why I said my earlier post which I stand by.

And I can think of NO other Christian church in Britain except the small fringe ones, that have behaved as badly as the Catholic Church.

craft I agree. But churches like the Catholic Church are in a privileged position. But seem to persist in seeing themselves as victims. It is no longer the reformation. Catholicism was under attack in this country many hundreds of years ago, those times have long gone.

@Somewhereovertheroad

Completely agree. The original question was answered and now it’s just descended into religion bashing, as is always the case on MN.

Criticism of the catholic church is not religion bashing.
And nearly every long thread on MN deviates from the original question.
But keep polishing your victim status. Even though religion is legally privileged in Britain.

You haven't engaged with the thread topic at all though Abucat just used it to criticise the Catholic Church. You should have started your own thread on the Catholic Church rather than hijacking someone else's which was more about the treatment of visitors and how much you stop the rest of your life when you have visitors than any particular religion

You are wrong. I answered the OPs question earlier in the thread.
And I made the point about the catholic church when the thread had already changed direction.
But don't let facts get in the way of your catholic church being victimised stance.

I'm now an atheist who was christened C of E and confirmed Methodist so not "my" RC church but don't let facts get in the way of your rants

Not rants. Just don't like seeing lies being posted.

The original question was answered and now it’s just descended into religion bashing, as is always the case on MN.

Yes, when are these poor, victimised, powerless religious institutions who have no influence or platform at all, going to catch a break?

eu.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2018/12/14/hullibarger-bedford-suicide-gofundme/2318551002/

So are these the actions of the Catholic church then?

No ...one rogue priest. Hardly headline news.

If one person's deeds represent the Catholic Church, then so do his.