To move DD at the end of year 2 because of friend issues

[Oopupsideyourhead]

My DD who is 6 has had loads of friend issues in school- when she started in reception, a lot of the kids had gone to nursery together & were in groups. I thought it would even out but it never has- she’s just not really found her feet despite me trying play dates etc. They rarely get reciprocated. I have talked to the teacher & she hasn’t seen many issues in school but DD is regularly upset, feels left out & a bit sad.
She started brownies recently which was my attempt to widen her circle but it’s early days there.
It’s a small 2 form entry school so I don’t feel like it’s going to change- it’s like everyone is stuck in groups & the parents in cliques & she can’t seem to break in.
I have thought about moving her for a fresh start at the end of this year - I just feel like her school life will be stuck in these groups. She gets invited to parties but not play dates & I feel like I have tried everything.
Aibu?

I wouldn't, children have friendship issues throughout school. It's so frustrating as a parent and not nice to see but I think it helps build resilience and helps them learn that sometimes things don't go their way. Be there to support them and help them through the rough patch.

Don't involve the governors or head as monty suggests. Not their role at all.
Is it worth waiting to see how brownies goes? She may bond with others from different schools, or you may make more friends yourself, which might help.

and just doesn’t seem to be able to break into the long standing groups. It could be the same at a new school but my older child never had these issues

Op. Read this statement again. Why do you think she will be able to break into even longer standing groups at the new school? It could be a lot worse for her, a lot. In addition it doesn't matter about your older child. Children are all different, one can make friends easily the other not so.

In addition it simply can't be all long standing groups who ostracise her, so possibly there is something else going on. Maybe she wants to be part of what she sees as the "popular" girls group, and isn't so interested in thr others. And there will be others.

I'm not saying don't move her, but I am saying don't compare your kids like this, they aren't the same people, and do think of what you will do if it's worse for her at the new school. Kids are the same the world over.

I agree with bluntness. what you're saying here doesn't make sense.

so she 6? so she's only half a term into year 1?

and how many girls are in her class? and how many girls are in the year? say 60 children normally half /half split = 30 girls.
let's say 20 girls in the whole year.

there must be one girl that your DD can be friends with. Even if it's the one that currently appears to be the little mouse and not very popular!!

The play dates? who is that with? THE group of 'most popular' girls?

There has to be more to this. this just can't be true.

Hmmm. I'm in the fence with this.

Both my dcs went to a 2 form entry school. Lots of groups of parents very 'local' - in that they went to school together, are related to each other and now their children go to the same school etc.

I had. Few friends but never properly 'broke in' to a group. I didn't mind really.

When my dd was in Y3, she had a few friends but was never part of a 'group'. She was always a little bit of an outsider. To be honest it wasn't until Y5/6 when she hit her stride, felt confident in the class. By that time she was very friendly with 2 girls she wasn't friendly with in Y3.
It all changed again in Y7 when we chose a school none of her primary friends went too!

My ds has friends and was a part of a group but never hugely involved outside of school.

I would quietly look around at other schools to see what's available. If you feel your dd's self esteem is being damaged then yes, of course have a serious think.

I never did play dates massively. I hated them and my dcs were never that fussed. They used being at home to chill out. We had the odd sleep over for birthdays but nothing regular.
I wouldn't use playdates as a measure of popularity.

Sorry I just read she's just in Y1. Yes, I'd say this was really early days still. Talk to the teacher about your concerns.

Don't involve the governors or head as monty suggests. Not their role at all.
Is it worth waiting to see how brownies goes? She may bond with others from different schools, or you may make more friends yourself, which might help.

I did think this was a bit OTT akin to log it with 111

Mention it to the teacher and she will help with play buddies I'm sure.

Moving her, unless something more serious is going on, is an over reaction. If this was secondary I would agree but in KS1 friendships are usually quite fluid .

Talk to the teacher. See what she says.

I find this very strange. I have 2 girls - y1 and Y2. 2 form entry school is not tiny - nationally I suspect it is average.

Older child has a very boy heavy class and is not very girly and quite happy in her own company. She has never had a special friend but mostly gets on ok. She sometimes says that she doesn't know who to play with and we chat about it and cosm up with a plan.

Younger dd is very gregarious and friendly. She doesn't have a special friend. They are all her special friends. She is just 5.

I think that both children are perfectly normal and that there is no special requirement for best friends for children who are youngschoolchildren.

It might make a difference that dh and I and our friends are all happy in our own company too - what are you like op? Is this about you?

BTW governors would bat it back to the school to deal with. It is not a big issue.

DD is in year 2- she’s nearly 7 - the issues have been going on for 2.5 years & is very unhappy.

And what will you do if the exact same thing happens in the next school? Move her again? And again and again?

Some kids, same as some adults, don't make lots of friends. Perhaps she is unhappy because you expect her to be like her sibling and be a popular child?

I think sometimes you can be unlucky with a cliquey/unfriendly class. My elder dd's class had a few unpleasant, domineering kids of both sexes and their parents' weren't great, although there were some nice kids. She fared much better when she moved to secondary as her class were nicer. One of the teachers even commented that there were a lot of nice girls in the class. (Mixed comp.)
Younger dd's primary class were nicer. I'd maybe consider moving as it does sound as if you've been unlucky with the class. I don't think it's a general rule that girls are nasty/bitchy/cliquey as a pp said. There are plenty of nice girls around, but you may need to move her to get lucky with a nicer class!

Why not ask the teacher for a playdate recommendation? Maybe your dd is trying too hard with children who aren't interested in being friends. The teacher may know which child is the ideal one to approach. Agree re switch classes too. You have a pool of approx 60 kids in this school, she just hasn't met the right kid yet

Are you sure your DD has good social skills? I have seen this from the outside before - yr2 girl really struggling to ‘break in’, mum very vocal about not understanding why her DD isn’t being accepted.

Objectively, her DD wasn’t playing very nicely- always wanting to control play, shouting and getting angry when things weren’t going her way. On play dates could be difficult and not very kind to the host child. The kids and ultimately parents ended up giving her a wide berth.

The mum’s attitude was always that ‘that’s just kids!’ but the other girls weren’t playing like that, and crucially weren’t allowed to behave like that by their parents. The little girl wasn’t being socialised to play nicely. Her mum saw no problem, was completely blind to how the behaviour might affect other kids, and expected everyone to look on it with the same indulgence. Three years in to school, no one would...

I agree with those saying it might not simply be due to the class or school. If your DD can literally find no one to play with then she may need some help with confidence and social skills (as my DS probably will).

However if she's keen to change schools I would try it anyway. Perhaps a new start will solve the problem, or if the same issues arise it will at least be clearer what is going on.

I mean this as kindly as possible but before you move her you need to understand the cause of these friendship issues.

It's not my saying, and I'm paraphrasing but basically "if you have a problem with one person they are the problem, if you have a problem with everyone then you are the problem."

I realise that that comes across as very brutal where children are concerned, and clearly doesn't apply to out and out bullying but I still think that it should be borne in mind.

"No one will play with me" often means "No one will play the games that I want to play and I don't want to join in theirs." or "I don't want to play with the people who want to play with me."

I'm not saying don't move her, but you need to find out what's going on first or she could be just as unhappy at a new school.

Of course, everyone's advice is based on their own experience, so you are getting a variety of views. It sounds like Trampire had the same issue as me - locals not wanting to socialise with 'incomers'. TansyViolet makes a good point about some classes / years being nicer than others (teacher here, so I know it's a real thing).

OP, your DD is only little to be so unhappy, so I really think you should investigate other schools with a view to moving her ASAP.

I agree with others that moving might be the right thing, but it might also just move the problem to a different location.

My dd1 is 7yo and in y3. She is lovely but perhaps doesn't have brilliant social skills, and I know I can struggle socially a bit too. I have made a really huge effort to support her in having friends, mainly by having endless playdates whether or not they are reciprocated as she did better 1:1, making sure I did a birthday party where everyone in the class plus siblings could come, offering to help out other families with childcare when stuck, taking dd1 to any popular activities happening outside school, and making sure she could participate in all the little fads they have at school by buying her a couple if lol dolls or whatever. We also roleplayed with toys how to act in some situations and read books about being a good friend and standing up for yourself. And on the occasion I felt things at school were becoming bullying (when another more popular girl had told the class not to play with her and she was being widely excluded) I kicked up a huge fuss at school and didn't accept being fobbed off. Also I volunteered lots at the school and PTA and tried hard to make friends with the other parents. This is something I find hard, but has paid dividends for dd1.

And it has worked. She now has a lovely best friend (previously the class was paired up, often based on which parents were friends, when dd1 being the one without a friend, but over time she has found a girl with similar interests and they get on great) and has a nice group of girls to fall back on. She is no longer left out at playtime. She seems happy.

So moving might be the answer, but there might be some other ways forward to.

I moved my DC. She was in a school where she was doing ok. She had friends, and was doing well in school, all her teachers liked her. But it was an immensely cliquey school, both parents & kids. And the headmaster was useless. There were issues with certain kids not being dealt with, and her year were notorious for being a very difficult year, with some really not very nice kids.

We moved house - actually closer to her school than we had been, by miles (we lived very rurally). But even closer still to another school. It seemed insane to be getting in our car and driving a couple of miles to the other school, driving past all the other parents either walking to the school round the corner, or driving to it. But I was worried about moving my DC. So my DH and I agreed with her that we'd just go & look at the other school. We went and had a look around, met the head and the deputy head, the potential form tutors & viewed the school. The school was the same size. We were all agreed that we loved the school, the head, the deputy & the general feel of the school - it couldn't have been more different in feel to the school she was in. We talked it over as a family, and made the decision to move. And it was the best decision for her, for definite. She made better friends, did even better at school, really blossomed.

Unfortunately she's now at secondary, with kids from both schools. And a lot of the previous issues have resurfaced with the unpleasant kids. She is still doing well at school, but has just a few good friends - we've definitely had some settling issues.

Of course, everyone's advice is based on their own experience

No it isn't.

The problem is moving in year 2 groups will already be made elsewhere.

I would wait a bit longer, my DS has changed his friends a bit in year 3. As they get older the children drive the friendships more.

Our year is also a bit cliquey so I do sympathise but I'm not sure a new school might be all that much better.

Does the school shuffle classes around at the end of Y2? Dc's school does - in part to balance out needs and abilities, but it can also ease friendship issues. Is she friendly with dc in the other class?

Parents stil engineer a lot of friendships at this age which I find a nightmare

Of course you do. Parents of happy children that have friends always do. It is the parents of unhappy children who are sad and lonely and don't have friends that try to engineer friendships in desperation. Spare them your exasperated annoyance.

Op please move her. I wish I had. Every year I thought things would get better. They didn't.

Parents of happy children that have friends always do. It is the parents of unhappy children who are sad and lonely and don't have friends that try to engineer friendships in desperation. Spare them your exasperated annoyance

@bunnyup

Bit of a sweeping assumption you’ve made there.

I’ve been on both sides - one dc who’s popular and one who isn’t. Having parents who engineer friendships such that my unpopular dc doesn’t get invited to play dates is a bloody nightmare. Even though he’s friends with the children in question.

Wind your neck in.

I’ve been on both sides - one dc who’s popular and one who isn’t. Having parents who engineer friendships such that my unpopular dc doesn’t get invited to play dates is a bloody nightmare. Even though he’s friends with the children in question

I'm in the same situation. My eldest has always been very popular and the mums of the children in his class are a varied and open bunch.

My youngest struggles more with friendships. This is made worse by very cliquey mums who only invite the DC of the clique mums to playdates. It's a strange situation. They are either besties with you or they blank you...there's no middle ground of saying hi and having a brief chat.

Its dreadful.