Please tell me I am not the only oldish person without a pension plan

[QuentinLettsisAbitofAtool]

Not a TAAT well it is a bit but sod it

I'm having a bit of a panic attack brought on by the MN survey about pensions. I don't have one, have a big mortgage, not due any parental inheritances and am in my 50s.

Please tell me I'm not alone as that might make me feel less dumb!

Oh and I put "oldish" in the thread title because I mean old in terms of a pension. Twenty somethings who don't have a pension don't fit my criteria!

Craft what happens if the value of the home drops in your example? So the house goes down to £150k. Don't the pensioners need to repay £25k of the money they have borrowed? They can't earn, so where do they get that money from?

There's a safety clause so the loan can never exceed their house value, so they don't have to pay anything. Worst case scenario is their next of kin get nothing, but it was never theirs to start with.

As for "sell the house".....THEY DON'T WANT TO SELL THE HOUSE. If they did, they wouldn't need an ER scheme.

They are elderly, they love the house. been there 40 years maybe. Selling it would make them miserable.

Invest the proceeds and get a 5% return
Link please to such an account

They move to a 55+ HA property
Which are not being built in ANYWHERE near enough numbers to meet demand ...... ten year waiting lists in Hampshire ........ MUCH longer than that is Greater London

HB can help with the cost of rent.
Only up to the cap

And we are in Brexit Britain, not New Jersey so the outlook is rather glummer than you lay out.

@Craft1905 Please name one of these fabulous firms who only have the interests of the elderly at heart.

Are you hard of reading? Have a look at the penultimate paragraph of my post. The deal is good for the ER company. No one is denying it. They aren't a charity, ffs!

These firms are commercial enterprises - they need to make a profit, and anyone expecting anything else is extremely naive. I doubt there are many of us who would work for nothing!

However, rules are in place, and advisors should always work in the best interests of their client.

I would be more than happy to pass on the details of the person we used, if anyone wants to message me. I was impressed with what she did, for the money she made.

Talkin They aren't being built in enough numbers because they don't have people on waitlists. In the NW there is no shortage. Ok so there is in the SW, so get on the list as soon as you can. By the time you are 70 your turn should come up.

As for a 5% return, most trackers have been averaging that for years. No high risk ones either.

I'm 48 and an NHS employee - I have a fantastic pension. I've worked 40+ years in the NHS and thankfully my employer contributed as well as myself

hamblehumpty have you been working for NHS since you were 8 years old?!

They aren't being built in enough numbers because they don't have people on waitlists.
Sorry but that is utter piffle.

My work involves looking at UK planning policy and documents.

HAs are VERY limited on what they can provide in the way of social or affordable housing and anywhere south East of Birmingham has critical shortages of housing within the reach of anybody on median or below incomes (50% of the population).

Why should somebody from London move to Bolton to get an HA house ?

As for a 5% return, most trackers have been averaging that for years. No high risk ones either.
Name a UK based one .... that is Brexit proof

Best way to extract value from a house is to fill it with lodgers and earn that £9000 a year tax free

Apart from the fact that the actual figure is £7,500 ( before expenses) this is a very good point. My daughter has just bought her first flat and with two lodgers contributing her mortgage is less than her monthly rent would have been.

But this scheme works for older people as well, as long you have a spare room and your house is in reasonable condition.

hamblehumpty - have you been working for NHS since you were 8 years old?!

Yes she has and before that she used to be sent up chimneys

@Craft1905 I beg your pardon? How dare you? You know nothing!!!!!! My mum wouldn't do that! She was in tears for months over it! She DID pay into it! I just don't know the details of how they 'diddled' her out of it. My mum is NOT a liar. What a bitch troll you are!

Nat West / RBS do not diddle longstanding employees out of their pension. You say she paid in for years but got made redundant a few weeks before she retired, so they diddled her out of decades of contributions. THAT NEVER HAPPENED.

Here's the 3 options of what happened.

1. She never joined the scheme. Perhaps she thought she had as is to embarrassed to say.
2. She's misunderstood what she was told, and her pension is sitting with RBS waiting for her to claim it.
3. She's getting it, and likes to make out she is poorer than she is.

She was not robbed of her decades of pension contributions by being made redundant a few weeks before retirement. It didn't happen.

But she won't talk about it!

Actually, I'll correct myself. I do know someone who made it to 60 before actively choosing to retire - a GP.

I know lots of people late 50s/ early-mid 60s who are working. Some because they want to, others because they need to. I'll be one of them. I can't afford to retire but don't want to as I don't fancy gardening, going to NT properties, holidays to kill time, U3A.

Just have to hope my health holds out!

I'm going to be made redundant next year. I will struggle to find another job (field of work is disappearing due to artificial intelligence). DH was made redundant this year. Couldn't get another job and is eking things out doing some self-employed work here and there. I am thinking of retraining and becoming a teacher, if it's not too late!

She DID pay into it! I just don't know the details of how they 'diddled' her out of it

Before 1988 many schemes required 5 years of membership before you could leave with a pension entitlement. If you add to that joining conditions such as a waiting period for membership or restrictions to full time workers only it’s easy to see how someone could have missed out on pension. I agree though that she is highly unlikely to have been diddled out of her entitlement. Mistakes do happen though

What she may have been "diddled out of" was any AVCs she had paid when the scheme transferred to the PPF
as the rules of the PPF only protect the pension that employers contributed to, not any additional employees voluntary
(as my Dad found out to his cost when his scheme went in)

but the PPF WILL protect her main pension

Surely nobody can afford to retire in late 50s unless very well off? You don;t get your state pension until 66 -68.

Daisypond all the teachers at my childs infant school are under 30. It's becoming a young persons game.

Want2be. Housijng associations dont normall let to people with 200k in their pocket do they!? Certainly couldnt get housing benefit...

Neither RBS nor Natwest are in the PPF

Powerless
Do you think it might be worth looking in to this - obviously with your DM's agreement - incase there has been a mistake? Only a tinpot company would 'diddle' people out of contributions, and for all their failings, I don't think RBS are that.

Totally agree. Pensions are a gamble.

Pay £100 into a pension and you get £20 back in your salary. So £100 on day 1 for £80 invested. £100 for £60 invested if you're a higher rate taxpayer. Pay £100 into a savings account and you get nothing back, and you'll be lucky to have £101.50 after a year. I'll take that gamble thank you. It's free money.

If your employer contributes too, but only if you contribute, it's even better.

I know a 40% taxpayer whose employer will match their contribution into a personal pension up to 7.5% So she pays £75 in, gets £30 back, and they pay in £75. So she gets £150 paid in to a personal pension in her own name for just £45 paid by herself, but she won't do it because "pensions are a gamble".

What a fucking idiot, She deserves to be poor in retirement!

Joyce
Fair enough.
In that case there is definitely more to it than meets the eye
and well worth Powerless checking out

Nothing, I'm self-employed. Hoping not to live long.

craft Most of us are NOT higher rate taxpayers. And many of us paying into them lost the additional state pension entitlement through being contracted out.

Craft
Bearing in mind that half of all adults earn below the 20% band
and less than 15% of taxpayers pay 40% tax
you really are well off the target with many of your comments.

Pensions are a VERY good deal for higher rate tax payers who tend to do well out of them.