Please explain the anti antibiotic campaign...

[gottastopeatingchocolate]

I am probably being a bit dense, but the campaign telling us not to take antibiotics without the Doctor's advice is driving me up the wall!

I understand the issue, but why are they telling us -14 times a day- when you can't get antibiotics without a doctor prescribing them?

Am I missing something?

I see GPs inappropriately prescribing antibiotics all the time. I've even tried to speak to them about it, but they weren't interested. I don't think it's the public to blame in many cases.

Patients wasting their GPs time by harassing them for antibiotics is a big problem. When I phone my doctor's surgery, there is no waiting music on the line anymore. Just messages telling you their GPS will not prescribe anitbiotics for conditions that get better in their own.

You as a person don't become resistant to the antibiotics the bacteria become resistant.
I have a family member who has a life limiting illness which requires antibiotics to manage it.
He is sensitive (intolerant)to several antibiotics due to long term use. And is colonised with several bacteria which are resistant to several antibiotics. I know how terrifying it is to watch someone with a raging infection be sensitive or the infection resistant to antibiotics and have the doctors and microbiologists working tirelessly to find an Antibiotic that will work and not cause a reaction because of sensitivity.
The above situation is going to be the reality for the general public very soon.
Don't take antibiotics unless completely necessary.

Lots of patients harass their GPs for a/bs - it’s a huge problem.

I’m one of those people some posters have alluded to who never take them - and my kids have never had them either (they’re 11 and 9). You absolutely don’t need them for the vast majority of illnesses and I’ve never been in hospital for any kind of illness that requires antibiotics. It’s not the same as refusing vaccines at all!!

That's really interesting Harry, about plasmid transfer between bacterial species.

Do you happen to know if the more common types of resistant bacteria here in the UK- MRSA, for example- come from transmission between people or are they more likely to arise de novo in the commensals of an individual who has received antibiotics previously?

Online (private) services seem very quick to cave to the patients' demands for antibiotics too.

I remember a poster from Norway I believe said they have an on the spot bacterial/ viral test so the doctor knows for sure what's needed.

Also, I get why people embellish when they go to the GP as it's sometimes so difficult to get an appointment and having to coordinate with work as well that whilst it's obviously both pointless and damaging, people still do it as a lot of them don't have a clue.

I remember a poster from Norway I believe said they have an on the spot bacterial/ viral test so the doctor knows for sure what's needed.

I think you’re probably talking about a CRP assay, where they take a bit of blood from your finger and look for CRP, which is a marker of inflammation. It’s non-specific, but generally a lot higher if someone has a bacterial infection, compared to a viral infection. Again though there’s a grey area where it’s raised but it’s not high enough to say that it’s definitely bacterial. Obviously things like that can be very helpful, but I don’t know how widely that’s used in GP surgeries here.

Because people are stupid and think they can cure a cold VIRUS with something that kills bacteria. These people build up a resistance to anti biotics, so when they get an actual infection, say a kidney infection, they are more likely to die.

Whenever I go to the GP I make a point of saying I don't want antibiotics unless they're necessary!

These people build up a resistance to anti biotics, so when they get an actual infection, say a kidney infection, they are more likely to die.
People don't build up a resistance to antibiotics. Bacteria do.

My daughter requires iv antibiotics a lot ( think over 40 times ) and She is 4 this is because every time she spikes a fever of any sort she needs to be started on iv antibitocs until 48 blood culture is clear ( this is due to substantial health issues ) however 3 years ago at the age of nearly 2 she came down with a super bug, because the original antibiotics she didn’t respond to she went in to septic shock and nearly died and was in icu and took 6 months to learn to do everything again.
She had to be put a very strong antibiotic because the resistance is the bacteria it nicked her whole system up.
I agree with the campaign.

I remember a poster from Norway I believe said they have an on the spot bacterial/ viral test so the doctor knows for sure what's needed.

I'm in France and have had an on-the-spot swab for a throat infection about 10 years ago. I only went because my tonsils were actually touching and I could barely swallow water. No antibiotics given but I did get a steroid throat spray to help reduce the inflammation.

Meanwhile my friend's child seemed to be given antibiotics for every sniff and cough. And my eye doctor wanted me to try a long-term antibiotic for ocular rosacea. I tried it but the side effects were awful so (with my doctor's full knowledge) I stopped them and am sticking with eye drops!

Sadly some people wont believe it until we have even more drug resistant bacteria than we have now and people die in sufficient numbers.Some still won't get it.

Overuse doesn't just affect the overuser, it affects everybody. Unfortunately.

As a nurse, I have experienced many of my colleagues incorrectly diagnosing infections in wounds, and getting the doctor to prescribe antibiotics. It isn’t just the public who are misinformed. However, many patients are very pushy regarding antibiotics, which they see as a cure-all. I have many friends who are forever on antibiotics, and have clearly exaggerated their symptoms to the doctor. Some people have no patience in allowing their body to do its work and make itself better, especially when antibiotics are totally inappropriate (although of course, they know better than the doctor!) Sorry, rant over! (Antibiotic misuse is a real bug-bear of mine)

arethereanyleft I had it the wrong way round in my head so have been naive. I haven't taken antibiotics since the 90s and thought this might help me in the long-term. But obviously, if it's the bacteria that becomes resistant, my abstinence won't matter a jot.

Terrifying.

It's fair to say that Doctors can be inconsistent about this issue.
At our surgery it would be very unusual to give abs for tonsillitis or a middle ear infection . There are other conditions eg cystitis before the result comes back, boils ( better treated by incision and drainage) and bronchitis which is usually self limiting when depending on time of day, doctors stamina and workload etc the doctor might or might not give them.
There are guidelines regarding conditions requiring them and best choices and people who have these infections shouldn't hold back.

OchAye Most modern antibiotics work really fast with a pharmokinetic level in the bloodstream within 45 minutes in some cases.

I had a friend at uni whi was studying microbiology. microbiology

If he got a sore throat, cold, general non specific illness he would up and off to the dr’s “for antibiotics”.

The first time he did this i was fairly stunned and said you do know it’s likely a virus? Yep, he understood. And you do know antibiotics don’t work on viruses? Yep, he understood, after all he was a microbiologist.

So why are you wasting yours and the dr’s time getting antibiotics, not to mention the resistance problem, which surely you are informed about, what with being a microbiologist?

“They make me feel better”. I did point out it was likely not the antibiotics but his body naturally fighting the virus off, but he had taken ab’s for every sniffle for so long, and every time had got better a few days after starting the tablets, that he was utterly convinced they helped. Plus he’d never become resistant

That and of course when he felt better he stopped taking them. He’d save the leftovers for next time so he could get started before going to the gp.

This is an intelligent bloke, educated in the field. But even a degree in bacteria couldn’t change his lifelong conviction that antibiotics worked whenever he was ill.

You can probably multiply that level of ignorance about antibiotics x100000 in the general population.

But obviously, if it's the bacteria that becomes resistant, my abstinence won't matter a jot. If enough people reduce their antibiotic use, then it will have an effect.

I didn't realise superbugs - MRSA, SARS, were caused by antibiotic resistance. I'd heard of them and I know not to misuse antibiotics but somehow I hadn't made that connection. Perhaps that needs to be the campaign?

This needs to be hammered home so that the people who think they should get an AB for every little snuffle begin to understand who damaging overuse could become. And GPs need to be more strict about their prescribing.

I mentioned this on another post recently, but I'm old enough remember, when I was a child, how fearful people where of certain childhood illnesses because some of my siblings had been small children in the days before immunization and ABs were in use.

If this abuse of ABs keeps on we might find ourselves in the same situation.

@BertieBotts
I didn't realise superbugs - MRSA, SARS, were caused by antibiotic resistance.

This habit of talking in abbreviations underlies a lot of problems. Meticillin-resistant Staphylococcus aureus (MRSA) is very obviously connected to antibiotic resistance: it says so in the name.

Severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) is caused by a virus (Coronavirus: SARS CoV) originating in bats. It has nothing to do with antibiotics in itself, although many patients would develop secondary bacterial pneumonia.