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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Why do Christmas if you don't believe?

137 replies

Mrspotter12 · 12/11/2018 15:59

Really not wanting to start a bun fight, but it you aren't religious and don't believe in Father Christmas - to the point of not wanting to "lie" to your DC and so asking what to tell them, then why do it? Why have Christmas at all?

OP posts:
BloobCurdling · 12/11/2018 17:05

I do think people who dismiss religious people as believers in 'flying spaghetti monsters' but celebrate Christmas are hypocrites. And you can squeak about culture/Yule as much you like, they're still hypocrites.

No they're not. It's natural, and traditional, to celebrate changes in the year and that goes back to prehistoric times. Christmas was pinned onto the traditional winter solstice celebration, and Ester onto the spring one - to make them acceptable to those who the church wanted to convert. As a human I have a natural inclination to have a brightly lit party in the middle of winter, so I will thanks, even as an atheist.

Most of what happens at Christmas is related to the old traditions - feasting, lights, singing and dancing, the tree, decorations. The Christ association is purely a cynical hijack and in fact I find Christ's birth story one of the least Christmassy things about Christmas. Not least because it didn't happen then, it happened somewhere warm and so the imagery is not winter-festival-ish, and because it doesn't really go with the rest of it, unsurprisingly.

As for Father Christmas, that's just another complicated and culturally morphed tradition. The whole thing about people thinking children have to believe it and "the magic of Christmas" annoys me, because you can still have plenty of fun without actually believing it, but I played along until the kids saw through it because it's what all their peers are doing and it would be mean not to.

UpstartCrow · 12/11/2018 17:06

MamaLovesMango Well spotted Grin

TheWiseWomansFear · 12/11/2018 17:07

@LilQueenie yes date wise, but Halloween is nothing like Samhain and Most believe that Guy Fawkes became the new Samhain because people still wanted bonfires...

CiderBrains · 12/11/2018 17:07

Dondraper things such as Yule logs, Yule trees (decorated too), holly, ivy, mistletoe, certain colour candles are all Wiccan/pagan traditions. If you search for Wiccan.com and search under "Yule" festival it's all there.

00100001 · 12/11/2018 17:08

same reason we do Easter.

and hallowe'en

and pancake day

Confused
MrsTerryPratcett · 12/11/2018 17:13

@OutrageousFlavourLikeFreesias I love that TM video. I annually post this link. T'is the season...

Gaspodethetalkingdog · 12/11/2018 17:14

In the past winter was a very dark time, everywhere was not lit up like now. People mostly worked in farming which goes quiet in winter with short cold days. Pigs were slaughtered and used as food over the winter.

Yule - Saxon name, Saturnalia - Roman festivals were taken into the new religion. It was a time of feasting awaiting the new year when the days became longer and farming could begin again.

EvaReady · 12/11/2018 17:17

It's bloody hard to avoid!

TantieTowie · 12/11/2018 17:19

There was a perfectly good pagan winter festival before the Christians arrived - days after the winter solstice, the days start to get longer again, why wouldn't we celebrate? Eating, drinking, merriment through the darkest days of the year - sounds good to me, Christmas or no Christmas.

www.livescience.com/25779-christmas-traditions-history-paganism.html

TantieTowie · 12/11/2018 17:19

Sorry, didn't RTFT...!

cushioncuddle · 12/11/2018 17:25

Because it's a lovely excuse for everyone - apart from the odd mizog- to enjoy themselves.
So nice to be sat eating a meal together, playing games and enjoying each other's company.

mostdays · 12/11/2018 17:28

There was a midwinter festival long before Christianity and there will be one long after it. I like it. Winter is cold and dark and wet and bleak. A splash of colour and joy and feasting and gifting in the middle of it all does us no harm whatsoever :)

Tadda · 12/11/2018 17:29

….There's no Father Christmas...…!!!!????!!! :(

BoneyBackJefferson · 12/11/2018 17:29

Godowneasy

What are these 'flying spaghetti monsters' you speak of?

www.pastafarian.co.uk/

The Pasta Lord's Prayer
Our pasta, who art in a colander, draining be your noodles.

Thy noodle come, Thy sauce be yum, on top some grated Parmesan.

Give us this day our garlic bread, and forgive us our trespasses, as we forgive those who trample on our lawns.

And lead us not into vegetarianism, but deliver us some pizza, for thine is the meatball, the noodle, and the sauce, forever and ever.

R'Amen.

NotAnotherParkingFine · 12/11/2018 17:32

Because it was never a religious festival, it was a pagan winter solstice festival, heralding the start of shorter nights. The church latched on to it as a way of converting pagans to Christianity. You do know most academics agree Christ wasn't born on Christmas day don't you?

littlemisscomper · 12/11/2018 17:34

England has always been a Christian country

Veering off topic slightly, Christianity is only 2000 years old. Humans have lived in the UK with any number of beliefs and varying spiritual rituals for over 30,000 years.

Anyway, the darkest and bleakest time of the year is a sensible point to bring light and everygreens into the home and focus on positivity and hope, whether you 'believe' in anything or not!

TheWiseWomansFear · 12/11/2018 17:37

@BoneyBackJefferson R'Amen 😂

GETTINGLIKEMYMOTHER · 12/11/2018 17:41

Because we need something to brighten up winter!

A lot of the traditions have pre Christian roots anyway - evergreens (the holly and the Ivy) the old Yule log is a pagan leftover AFAIK - they still call Christmas Jul (Yule) in Sweden.

Pre Christian Northern Europe had their Midwinter Festival to cheer up the cold, darkest days, and a lot of that was just absorbed into Christmas.

saltymofo · 12/11/2018 17:45

It's a pagan midwinter celebration. A festival of light in the darkest time of year.

bigKiteFlying · 12/11/2018 17:45

www.whychristmas.com/customs/fatherchristmas.shtml

St Nick, Father Christmas and Santa - mixed is a bit confusing but the above seems to cover most of what I'd heard about how they all became mixed up.

We didn't do Santa - preferring to just put presents from us but Santa has been pushed by school and DGP quite heavily.

I think my DC know it's not real (assume OP does know this) - though oddly tooth fairy which we did do was longest belived.

witchy89 · 12/11/2018 17:45

I'd say it was more of a cultural tradition, other religions celebrate Yule, it's not purely a Christian tradition. We celebrate it presumably because our (Christian) ancestors did and it just got passed on as a tradition within the family. It's lovely to have a reason to relax, see family, catch up with old friends. It's also a public holiday so hard for people to avoid it really!

Purpleartichoke · 12/11/2018 17:49

A winter solstice celebration is universal. The day is cold and dark and a community celebration focused warmth and light makes people feel better.

I happen to live in a country where this celebration is dressed up as Christmas. It really doesn’t matter what trappings a culture wants to add or what story is used as an explanation, all those people are really just celebrating the solstice anyway.

LewisMam · 12/11/2018 17:50

It’s enjoyable to have a celebration in the middle of winter with nice food, presents and decorations. I’m not Christian but I still do Christmas. We also have pancakes on Shrove Tuesday, fish on Good Friday and lamb on Easter Sunday. I’m not American but we have Thanksgiving Dinner and a 4th July bbq purely because the food is yummy. I’m not Chinese but we cook Chinese food for Chinese New Year and give the kids little gifts. I’m not Jewish but we have brisket and latkes at Hanukkah. We eat pumpkins at Halloween, toffee apples and hot dogs on Bonfire Night. When the cherry blossom tree in our garden comes into bloom we hang lanterns and have a Japanese style Hanami picnic. Imo it’s good to be multicultural and respectfully enjoy the rich heritage of different peoples, and it’s fun for the kids to learn about and experience different traditions.

Mightybanhammer · 12/11/2018 17:59

I'm child free so I don't. Absolutely hate it, especially as the whole thing starts earlier and earlier. I am not a Christian, have no family and dislike the excessive consumerism, so why should I?

Amallamard · 12/11/2018 18:01

Because Christmas trees, Father Christmas, mince pies, cake, pudding, turkey, stockings, fairy lights etc. don't actually have anything to do with Christianity. At least I'm fairly confident these things are not mentioned in the Bible, please feel free to correct me if I'm wrong. They're just nice cultural traditions that I enjoy with my family. It's a good excuse to get together with family, enjoy each others company, and express our love with presents and food.

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