To be shocked a hospital did this?

[Honeyroar]

My 77 yr old mother went for a pre op today. When they took her heart rate it was 150, so very high. She has had a history of ridiculously high heart rates in the last year, and has been admitted twice. The nurse doing the pre op had her taken to A&E in a wheelchair to be checked over. A&E was at the opposite end of the hospital and down a huge hill. She sat in A&E for two hours and by the time she was seen her heart rate had calmed again. They said they would write to her doctor and that she could go home. They then left her to walk back up the huge hill on her own. She was at a hospital that she didn't know, she didn't know where the car park she'd left her car in was, and was breathless and stressed when she rang me. Am I unreasonable to think that they ought to have wheeled her back up again rather than risk her heart rate going crazy again? They also told her they'd tried to ring me (next of kin) but I'd not answered, however I have no missed calls on my phone.

Thankfully she drove home safely and is fine.

They shoved my dad in a taxi after he had a mini stroke he has a blood clot in his leg which makes walking difficult no one checked he actually had the funds to get home he had 20 on him the taxi took him as far as £20 would take him and dropped him at the side of the road he was still a town away from his home fortunately he knew someone who could take him in for the night in that town bloody unforgivable our nhs is sometimes

See when they closed down our local hospital they said this would not happen people would never be chucked out in the early hours to get home from the middle of nowhere but it does every day

Very standard. My baby son was bluelighted to hospital last year in the middle of the night, in December - I had a small bag that I’d grabbed on the way out of the house, but no cash, we didn’t have our coats (he had query anaphylaxis, there wasn’t time), and none of my family were answering their phones (4am when we were finally discharged).

I’m a lone parent and have no car at present. All of this was known to staff- who were utterly unhelpful. Couldn’t even suggest somewhere for us to rest while I waited for morning and family to wake up.

Thank god the local taxi company agreed to take us home and let me go into the house to get cash (travelled with my baby strapped to me in his ergo carrier and me in the seatbelt- I dread to think what would have happened in an accident) and the gorgeous driver drove like he was in an RAC “best practice” video.

The NHS are struggling, and many practitioners are amazing amazing- but they are so worn down, that in my experience (both as a patient and working in front line medical environments) there is a general exhaustion that is killing compassion and any sense of holistic patient care.

No she wasn't asked. She asked how to get back.

I agree with LRD. A 77 year old is potentially vulnerable. Somebody should have asked if she was OK to get home or if she wanted anyone to be called. It also isn't clear whether she was finished in the pre-op unit and I would have expected them to check with the nurse who brought her. I know lots of elderly people who couldn't manage a steep hill but who are medically fit to drive by the way.

I think it's called kindness. I've seen many HCP's not bother to be kind and sometimes they haven't been particularly busy, or busy at all.

YANBU. I think too often there’s a distinct lack of joined up thinking and decent communication in the NHS.

We had something similar when my mother had a mild stroke. She was due to be transferred to another hospital closer to home, and suddenly one evening they decided at virtually no notice that she should leave that night. It was sheer good luck that I was there, because she couldn’t possibly have packed her stuff, was confused about what was happening and really anxious about it. Then it took ages for transport to arrive and it was really hard work keeping her reassured - there was no way the nurses could have kept her on an even keel.

When transport arrived it turned out to be a people carrier mini cab: the hospital knew she had a back problem and she would never be able to cope with the step up into the cab, but clearly no-one had thought about that when organising transport. It was around 9.30 pm, so difficult to find someone to help, and I had to make a major fuss before we could drum up any assistance. Then the cab driver was trying to programme his satnav as he drove and had no idea how to find the entrance to the new hospital, and there was another pantomime finding someone to help when we arrived. By the time she was settled it was really late, I was utterly exhausted and public transport wasn’t running. But I was so glad I was there, because I really shudder to think what would have happened if I hadn’t been. And it was all totally avoidable with a bit of effort, planning and communication.

Really OP? The NHS is on its knees and they do not have the capacity to ferry patients from A to B unless pre-booked services such as ambulance transport.

Your mother can drive. The health professionals weren't concerned about her heart rate. 2 hours wait in a&e is not a long wait. She'll have been triaged and obviously wasn't classed 'urgent'.

On admission she should have been asked her details such as home address, NOK details.

Come on, we take enough stick as it is without people slating us for things that shouldn't be on the NHS such as a taxi service for driving patients or out of date details for NOK.

To be shocked a hospital did this? (31 Posts)
Add message | Report | Message poster Honeyroar Tue 30-Oct-18 21:26:39
My 77 yr old mother went for a pre op today. When they took her heart rate it was 150, so very high. She has had a history of ridiculously high heart rates in the last year, and has been admitted twice. The nurse doing the pre op had her taken to A&E in a wheelchair to be checked over. A&E was at the opposite end of the hospital and down a huge hill. She sat in A&E for two hours and by the time she was seen her heart rate had calmed again. They said they would write to her doctor and that she could go home. They then left her to walk back up the huge hill on her own. She was at a hospital that she didn't know, she didn't know where the car park she'd left her car in was, and was breathless and stressed when she rang me. Am I unreasonable to think that they ought to have wheeled her back up again rather than risk her heart rate going crazy again? They also told her they'd tried to ring me (next of kin) but I'd not answered, however I have no missed calls on my phone.

Thankfully she drove home safely and is fine.

No, it’s pretty standard unfortunately.

My dm was due to have an op, but was stopped due to irregularities in her heart beat, so sent her home. 6 months later was given a heart monitor for 24hours, and as soon as she presented her results was told she wasn’t leaving the hospital and was admitted ASAP. A few days later she was taken to Harefield hospital and had a double heart bypass 🤔

Work that one out...

YANBU op

Yabu. She was wheeled there because her heart rate was up already. No need to wheel her back once it had returned to normal. If it became elevated while she was waiting for her pre-op it doesn’t appear to have even been exercise related.
If she wasn’t sure where she was going she could have asked someone.

For all those saying you should suck it up OP. Call them up and check they have the right phone number for you (you might have to write and take in a copy of your passport, a letter of permission from your mother and possibly her passport too due to GDPR). If it turns out they have the correct number and you have no record of any calls in spite of them saying they tried to call a couple of times write to the CEO because actually they have lied and that is disrespectful and wrong on so many levels. So much is wrong and so much is being made more difficult for patients to find out the truth of what went on and what went wrong.

OhTheRoses Tue 30-Oct-18 23:10:09
For all those saying you should suck it up OP. Call them up and check they have the right phone number for you (you might have to write and take in a copy of your passport, a letter of permission from your mother and possibly her passport too due to GDPR). If it turns out they have the correct number and you have no record of any calls in spite of them saying they tried to call a couple of times write to the CEO because actually they have lied and that is disrespectful and wrong on so many levels. So much is wrong and so much is being made more difficult for patients to find out the truth of what went on and what went wrong.

I disagree with this OP, albeit I disagree you have a complaint, as a medical secretary in an hospital I'd advise you to contact PALS with any concerns. You absolutely don't have to send a copy of anything bar a SAR request to medical records with the consent of your mam saying she consents to her information being shared. There may be a charge for this.

Call logs are recorded in my trust. If they have rang with appointment details, it will be on a log sheet. Happy to trash the utter rubbish roses is claiming and if I can be of any more help please message me

Ah so this is the thread.

I suspect that if she told the hospital (or indicated to them) that she wasn't able to walk up the hill; they would not have been able to let her drive home. and you weren't worried about her driving home but you are annoyed she walked up a hill? WTF? Since when does difficulty walking mean you shouldn't drive? That's precisely why tens of thousands of elderly people use cars, because they can't walk far!!! Also, why do disabled and ill people have cars and blue badges? Because they can't walk far, duh!!! And since when has it become acceptable to take a nearly 80 year old to a different unit then just dump her there without any regard to how she'll get back? OP, YADNBU. It's disgusting!!

In my opinion, if hospital staff were trained properly to make more sensible use of resources we wouldn't be in this mess. Twice recently, I've been in for pre ops. Both times an hour of questions and filling in forms (of information which they already have because I'm there regularly) and preparing a care plan because I'm disabled and need assistance. Arrive at hospital to find staff have absolutely no idea what assistance I need!! Two hours of prep completely wasted!

This is what should have happened: the nurse tells staff in A&E that OP's mum is nearly 80 and has been brought down the hill from another department. To let the nurse know when she's ready to be collected and taken back up. Common sense seems to be lost nowadays.

the nurse tells staff in A&E that OP's mum is nearly 80 and has been brought down the hill from another department. To let the nurse know when she's ready to be collected and taken back up.

1. how do you know the first nurse will still be on shift?

2. If the nurse is on shift do they have time to get a wheelchair and fetch the patient

3. will the origional department even be open?

4. What happend when the nurse and patient get back to that department, if it is open and the nurse is still on shift?

Common sense seems to be lost nowadays.

Doesn't it?

OP

I have mobility difficulties so I often need help to get between departments, and I have to park where the parking is not where I'm going. Hospital staff will call either a porter or the league of friends who do a voluntary service with a sort of double buggy, when they do not have someone they are taking they drive around with a sign saying, "stop me if you need a lift"

I do have to ask. But I do always get help.

Thanks again for the more sensible comments. Unfortunately there are some muppets answering, and some even seem to be in health care, which is worrying!

Of course I know the NHS is on its knees. I've had to rush my mother to A&E three times this year and my husband four times. Out of those times, three have been in ambulances due to discharges being too soon (my husband actually had sepsis and it wasn't noticed). All three ambulances could have been avoided and the money saved if there had been more thought and awareness by the hcp involved. THAT is a stupid waste of money and there was another risk of it happening again by sending an OAP off up a hill unsupervised. It wasn't someone nervous about a pre op, her heart rate was up because she had had to walk around trying to find the dept. This is a person with obvious existing, recent issues..

She is fine to drive if her heart rate is down. The driving home wasn't the worry, it was issues on the way back up.

I'm not slating the NHS. I've had a lot of good care this last year for relatives, but I've also seen some scary and stupid errors.

Off to work now.

I’m sorry but you’re being a bit precious. Seventy seven isn’t that old - most people in their eighties are fit and well, walking, swimming, looking after grandchildren, dancing.
Atrial Fibrillation is common. Very common. Most don’t need to rush to hospital when they have an episode. Most are given beta blockers by their GP once diagnosis is confirmed. Most AF settles itself. I suspect your mother has been told this. A pulse of 150 really isn’t that high - most people want to get to that rate when exercising.
They discharged a well women with no persistent symptoms and didn’t push her in a wheelchair. Why would she need a wheelchair because she’d felt a bit unwell earlier? Surely better she gets on with life as normal? Walking to her car on the site isn’t a huge issue unless you think there should be a shuttle bus provided around single site hospitals?
My MIL has AF and a touch of heart failure, is 85 but wouldn’t dream of being pushed in a chair anywhere. She gets a bit short of breath and tired but just plods slowly. It’s not dangerous, it’s not a failing on society thatbshe walks - it’s good to retain independence.

I suggest you tell your mother to go back to GP and get proper advice about management of episodes of AF. They are likely to tell her to have a cup of tea and ride it out rather than go,to the emergency department for a pre existing condition. You might feel more comfortable knowing when further advice is necessary and the degree of urgency.

Sounds like the raised pulse was exercise related - that’s normal but she might want to do a bit more exercise to build tolerance. If she’s got COPD she could try pulmonary rehabilitation classes with exercise supervised by a physio.

I am sorry you have had a horrific year and the medical issues are till on going for your mum. It is normal that you are looking to vent but perhaps you should focus on the more important issues.

Can you help coordinate your mother’s care to get an answer to what is going on with her heart problems? Maybe it’s worth going with her to her GP with details of all the A&E visits and pushing for a referral to someone who can help out.

I think she needs to stop driving immediately. She has undiagnosed heart problems, she can’t take the risk that she will cause an accident and hurt herself and other people.

I am not surprised at all, but I say that after last week I was diagnosed with a post natal infection and nearly collapsed en route to maternity. My blood pressure was very low and I told them I couldn't walk back (to the children's hospital where my DD was) and asked for a wheelchair. I was told no and offered painkillers for my pain. They said they were too busy and no one to help. The NHS is well and truly on its knees. I was told to write to pals so that more support can be given in future. I was told to write to pals by 2 separate wards/departments over the last week for different issues.

most people in their eighties are fit and well, walking, swimming, looking after grandchildren, dancing.

WTAF?! What planet are you on?

OP YANBU at all.

If you want to see what is going on with your Mums heart, dont buy a fitbit, buy a Kardia (on amazon). It connects to an ap on your phone and can do an ECG. You can then email the tracing to your doctor, or show it shen you go for an appointment. Its a fabulous bit of kit because heart rythmn problems are never helpful enough to happen when you are at the hospital hooked up to the machine.

CherryPavlova - have a cup of tea and ride it out! Have you ever been in fast AF? The caffeine in the tea can make things worse. That is reasonable advice if she is anti-coagulated and feeling not too bad - but I can vouch for the fact that sometimes it can make you feel very unwell indeed. And the risks of blood clots arise at the point when the AF stops - so monitoring of someone of that age is advisable.

A&E should have made sure that she was feeling well enough to return to her pre-op assessment under her own steam.

A&Es across the country are struggling. On one of the occasions when I was taken in, it was my DD who made sure I was hydrated.

They didn't know where her car was parked, or that she had come in by car. If she's asked for help and been refused, if understand. But in this case you are being unreasonable as she never requested any assistance.