School rules and nuts

[Bagsalot]

My daughter is 11 yesterday was her birthday. She took an asda tray bake to school with her. She wasn't allowed to share it as apparently some where on the box it says may contain nuts. This has never been an issue before. Today an email came out stating no nuts or seeds allowed in school including lunchboxes. My daughter's in year 6 has been at the school since nursery age 2, this has never been mentioned. I've asked to see the risk assessment. I feel it's an unreasonable policy but possibly I'm being unreasonable

Mistigri, I once made a light-hearted comment to our consultant allergist that it'd been tricky to pack a snack because peanut-butter sandwiches in the waiting room of an allergy clinic were obviously a bit of a no-no. He looked at me said 'It would have been perfectly fine, it's not like you were going to smear it on the chairs were you?'. This is one of the world's leading allergy consultants. If he's not worried about peanut butter sandwiches randomly becoming airborne, then I'd certainly be prepared to guess it's perhaps not such a problem as some seem to believe. I certainly get pissed off with the 'only nut-allergic children are worthy of consideration' undertone to a lot of this debate.

Frogsoup, peanut allergy is easy to manage these days. Seeds are a much bigger risk and unfortunately the Pret death didn't surprise me. It is extremely difficult for seed allergic people to buy pre-prepared lunch food safely.

@frogsoup

I honestly don't know the answer to all of this is as I think not only nuts should be considered and were does it all stop, I totally agree.

But can you understand how exhausting it is for a parent with a small child outside their home (where the parent is in control and educating the child) in a place they have no option but to spend hours every day where allergens (not only nuts) are present and in the control of other small children. It's an awful way to spend your days worrying about this stuff.

But can you understand how exhausting it is for a parent with a small child outside their home (where the parent is in control and educating the child) in a place they have no option but to spend hours every day where allergens (not only nuts) are present and in the control of other small children. It's an awful way to spend your days worrying about this stuff.

I have every sympathy, but parents of allergic kids aren't really helped by ineffective policies that are not evidence-based and that do not take into account the opinions of experts in the field.

A nut ban may stop parents worrying - in fact that may be its main objective: it's an easy way for a head teacher to get parents off their back and it does so by effectively devolving responsibility to other parents so it doesn't require any resources. But does it actually keep children safe? And the answer is that if doesn't really. At least one person on this thread has posted about a child requiring two hospital admissions due to nut exposure at a "nut free" school...

@FredMerc my daughter is anaphylactic to dairy, so yes, I'd say I understand only too well what it feels like! Nobody is suggesting banning dairy in schools, though, so this has always been our reality. It's only with peanuts that parents can choose to imagine that it's possible to engineer an allergy free space. One result is partly that people then mistakenly decide that others allergies can't possibly be as serious (someone upthread told me Dairy allergy isn't as deadly )

@frogsoup it is relatively easy for me to manage my son's peanut allergy. It's not so easy for a young child or teacher in charge of 30 children to manage so no nuts is the best idea.

When older my son will manage it himself but grateful he doesn't have to at primary. (I am sure the teachers are too!)

Right LL83. And no dairy, eggs, seeds or other allergens either, you agree? Because those are just as hard to manage in a primary classroom.

@frogsoup
You have my sympathies on dealing with that allergy as I agree it is seen as not as dangerous as nuts, which it can be.

@Mistigri

But does it actually keep children safe? And the answer is that if doesn't really. At least one **person on this thread has posted about a child requiring two hospital admissions due to nut exposure at a "nut free" school..

I agree it's not a guarantee having a ban, just one element of managing your child's allergy. Perhaps if so many schools didn't have a blanket ban in place it would be 10 parents or 100 parents with that story on this thread.

I agree it's not a guarantee having a ban, just one element of managing your child's allergy. Perhaps if so many schools didn't have a blanket ban in place it would be 10 parents or 100 parents with that story on this thread.

But you don't know. Do you think things should be banned because parents think it "might" help, or do you think schools should look at the evidence and listen to experts?

The two hospital admissions referred to down thread were due to a breach of a nut ban. A different approach focussing not on fruitless efforts to eliminate risk, but on better risk management, might have produced better results.

@frogsoup peanuts transfer more easily and anaphylactic reactions to trace amounts are more common than in other allergies.

I also think a nut ban reinforces the idea that other allergies are not as bad. I have yet to hear of a seed ban in a school. Education is key I think. Education for the school staff and students. And parents.

My DS is now at university and I worry more because the people there don't know him. His new friends won't know about his allergies (he is reluctant to share). I always felt reasonably comfortable as long as he had his EpiPen and was with friends or teachers who knew about his allergies.

That's not what the evidence suggests though. Many allergic children have severe trace and contact reactions to all sorts of foods, and likewise some peanut allergic children do not.

But frogsoup even those of us with nut-allergic children experience the weird comments. I had someone tell me “well thank goodness your ds isn’t allergic to peanuts because that can be fatal.” Literally after I’d just described his anaphylaxis after eating a cashew!

As I’ve already said, if I knew of a child with a history of anaphylaxis to a different allergen, be that dairy, sesame or whatever, I’d be absolutely fine with it being banned. Because we had a girl at ds’s nursery with a history of dairy anaphylaxis....it was banned entirely from the premises, and guess what, nobody had an issue with it and it caused literally no problems.

ladydickisathingapparently I’m just curious but how did banning dairy at nursery work? Was it pre-school only so no babies? Personally I wouldn’t have sent my child to a nursery with no dairy as she needed milk at the point she started. Bans on pretty much anything else wouldn’t have bothered me. I don’t know how parents with children with severe allergies cope. It must be so hard, particularly when you have to trust others to keep your child safe.

My DD has multiple severe allergies (of which dairy is the worst). Yet she goes to a nutfree nursery and sits next to children eating (messily) the things she's allergic to. We've had a few incidents but apparently it's impossible to ban other foods.
The emphasis on nuts I find bizarre, it seems to be based not on children's actual allergies but a kneejerk reaction. Nurseries and schools should ban things children are allergic to. Nowhere seems to ban sesame?
Having said that, I would happily avoid nuts (DDs major source of protein because bizarrely she's allergic to almost everything else!) for her if a child in her class had a nut allergy. But I'd love the same courtesy extended to us!
Our school bizarrely has more children with shellfish allergies than nuts, but shellfish are served unlabelled in the canteen (primary!) and nuts are banned entirely. The school nurse is a friend, it drives her mad!

PumpkinPie567 I agree, I have several dc and they have been through many different schools between them. Not one of them has ever had a dairy ban or shellfish ban.
It’s a poorly researched and uneducated response in my opinion.

user yes it was a kindergarten so children were 2.5 to 4+. This little girl had an anaphylactic reaction to a yoghurt spilt on a table by another child in the lunch room (previous to this other children were allowed dairy on the premises). No complaints from parents.

LL83 - does that mean it's ok in your opinion that those of us who DO have severe reactions (on a par with severe nut allergies) to none nut items are given less consideration? Or are we just meant to accept that we don't merit the same level of care?

www.theguardian.com/society/2018/oct/20/allergies-the-scourge-of-modern-living-hay-fever-ashtma-eczema-food-peanuts-dairy-eggs-penicillin?fbclid=IwAR0xDofqYu4_1_lxDplSQ5dAco9evr4QZimNzTm9v1Pl1exFpO1Zth8n6oY

This is an interesting read

@Mistigri

^^But you don't know. Do you think things should be banned because parents think it "might" help, or do you think schools should look at the evidence and listen to experts?

I consider parents of primary school children with allergies to be the experts!

My DS had a massive reaction to the first lot of vaccinations he got as a baby. Ended up in hospital. There followed the most extreme eczema (90% of his body) for about a year followed by very wide ranging allergies across 5 different food groups. I remember this fact as the consultant found it fascinating. Slowly grew out of some (cooked egg, milk, cheese) but not sesame seeds, fish, chickpeas, raw egg or banana. Most severe sesame and fish. I do think the vaccinations were some sort of a trigger perhaps with an underlying issue and this was agreed by one consultant we saw.

I consider parents of primary school children with allergies to be the experts
Reading this thresd not necessarily so.
There is no evidence that nut bans save lives or prevent children coming in contact with nuts.

I consider parents of primary school children with allergies to be the experts!

You haven't read this thread then .

I think the school are being unreasonable.

It’s mostly ok to ban actual nuts and proper nut containing products, but how on earth do they get on at lunch times if you can’t have products “that MAY contain nuts” that’s virtually banning every single pre packaged piece of food that’s not specialist but free.

As I’ve already said, if I knew of a child with a history of anaphylaxis to a different allergen, be that dairy, sesame or whatever, I’d be absolutely fine with it being banned.

How far do you take this? In an average size school you might end up having to ban eggs, milk, fish, nuts, soya, seeds. As well as the obvious things you would have to ban foods like mayonnaise (mustard), hummus (sesame), cereal bars, many biscuits, most cakes. Compliance would fall through the floor because parents would rightly see this as unreasonable or impossible.