Aibu to ask how to deal with letting agent asking for money

[Greatnessbe]

Nc'd and posting for traffic.
I unexpectedly lost my job in August affective immediately and moved to my parents house. Don't have much money to my name and am struggling to find another job and not get it anymore debt.

When I lost job (8th August) I messaged my letting agent to let them know id be moving out at the end of the month. I was expecting them to say to pay a little extra in sept to cover a four weeks notice period which was on the tenancy agreement I signed ... which I was prepared to do.
They didn't bother getting back to me until the 13th August and said I'd have to pay up until 13th October .

The original lease I signed was a two months notice but when I signed a new lease when my ex partner moved out I explained I wanted that changed and they agreed so I changed it to a solo lease with just my name and the new notice of four weeks.

After this they continued to include my ex in emails despite them knowing he no longer lived there and I was in a lease alone which I thought was odd and told them about a few times.

So anyway when they told me to pay up til 13th October I asked them to send me a copy of the current lease. They replied days later that they couldn't find it as they had misplaced it and were going off the joint lease we had signed two years earlier.

I moved out and just didn't respond which is definitely wrong of me now I understand it's just so hard to argue with them when they take days sometimes weeks to respond.

They emailed me today saying I owe them £829 kn rent arrears for September and October and I absolutely cannot afford that , will they take me to court for this ?

Probably not relevant but they have been absolutely useless as agents, my heating was broken for six months.

I am absolutely kicking myself for now requesting a copy of the lease I signed I just went to their office and signed and said bye ! So stupid of me

Another side note is that my ex and I got a dog and requested permission etc have emails to prove and they said yes fine as long as you come and sign a pet friendly lease which we did immediately. A few months before moving out they did an inspection and said that my lease didn't include pets which was very confusing so it seems they have lost two leases and only have the very original I had signed two years before

I explained I wanted that changed and they agreed so I changed it to a solo lease with just my name and the new notice of four weeks.

Do you have the new lease with their signature on it? If so send it to them, it supersedes the old lease.

Did you have any email correspondence about it at the time? Anything to indicate that you did negotiate new terms with them, even if you don't have a copy of the contract? As they have the tenancy you originally signed, If they take you to court you'll need some evidence something to back up your defence, and correspondence about the changes might be enough. Did your ex get anything to confirm he was no longer on the contract? Did you two have any email correspondence about it at the time perhaps?

Otherwise you're a bit stuck really. It's easy to say but, as you know, you should have made sure you got a copy of the new contract. Lesson learned for next time I suppose.

No I never got a copy which was so stupid of me. I used to go to their office sign the paper work and leave I assumed they'd keep it safe at the office cos I'm an idiot clearly

@isleepinahedgefund
Yes I do actually my ex messaged to say he had moved. And they messaged me to confirm and I said yes they also asked if I could come in an sign a new lease I have all these in emails however the details of the notice change were all done when I was in the office. But I do have indications that a new lease should be signed twice actually once with the pet lease and with the solo lease

Do you have any emails proving anything? I should think the lease will turn up if you threaten legal action.

They should have given you a copy of the lease for your records.

How long was the original lease for? If just 6 or 12 months and you didnt sign a new one, it should have gone to a rolling contract.of 1 months notice from you to terminate.

Have a look at the original, check the length and the date you signed then check it's expired. So if it was a 6 month term, after 6 months, providing you didnt sign another 6 month contract it goes to a rolling or month to month contract. Which means you can give 1 months notice, usually a day before your rent payment due date.

They didn't give me a copy of the lease and my last letting agents would email me the copy after I had gone to sign anything so I didn't really think anything of it when they didn't hand me a copy at the agents , I should have chased this up but just didn't really think at the time

@frouby was a 12 month lease which went to rolling with two month notice. Which is what they are going off despite me signing the two newer leases

Go back to them with those emails which indicate that it was at least arranged for a new lease to be signed. You don't necessarily need to prove what you're saying, rather shed doubt on what they're saying.

Do they own the property? Usually they'd have to communicate with the landlord to agree things like a reduced notice period.

It's perfectly possible they did lose whatever you signed, it happens.

They've admitted they have lost the most recent lease. If you have emails/letters or even voicemails asking you to come in and sign your new lease then they're buggered.

I highly doubt they could take you to court when they have lost vital paperwork. I'm pretty sure any judge would laugh them out of there to be honest as it's highly unprofessional.

It's irrelevant that the contract stated 2 months, the law overrides it.

What is the date you signed the original agreement, the one they are trying to hold you to?

Even if they defer to the old lease, if it was on a rolling contract then surely the statutory notice period of 2 months applies?

You could try ringing shelter for advice.

@isleepinahedgefund they don't own the property I just explained that I wanted a shorter notice and she said ok I'll get that changed for you I think she was new there or possibly like training ? Which I thought she'd have to ask landlord too, however they were very keen to get me sign another 6months so I thought they were just happy I was signing
I understand they may have lost it but to lose two leases is just a bit odd and I'm annoyed I'm looking like the bad guy through partially my fault to be fair

@frouby I signed the original lease 12months then rolling contract with two months required June 2016.
Is it Scottish law that you are only required to give one month notice ?

I have rented in Scotland. It doesn’t matter what the lease said the law states one months notice and that overrides any contract. They can put anything they want in a contract it doesn’t make it legal.
You do need some advice on this with how to proceed. I’d give shelter a call.

Yes I agree with pp that if they want to rely on the original lease and you were out of the fixed term, the original agreement had rolled over into a periodic tenancy and one months notice was due, so at the most you'd owe 3 days rent.

Tenancy terms are implied by law, they can't change them because they feel like two months' notices. Either the original agreement stands, in which case it has expired and it's now a periodic tenancy, or you did sign another lease and the notice period on you signed up for is applicable.

Under a periodic tenancy you have to give one month's notice, the landlord has to give you two.

When did your last contract end?

If you are out of fixed term then you have moved to statutory Periodic which legally has a 1 month notice period. There is some confusion and whether the 2 month in the contract would still stand as you are now in a new contract which runs monthly.

Based on the last available contract being 2 years old, you can argue you are in SPT so one month applies.

Is your deposit protected? Have you had it returned yet? When did you surrender the property to the agent? How did you do that? Did they do a check out? What proof do you have ?

All of these questions will impact on tour next approach to them - you need to be ready to dispute the deposit with your paper trail of contact. If there is no protected deposit then you are laughing! Oooh, did the deposit get moved to your name only when you resigned the contract?

Sorry just seen a few others posted whilst I was typing mine - my questions at the bottom are still relevant but bit at the top is already answered I think

@spinn the deposit was protected and was told to me today that they kept the whole thing for rent arrears and cleaning

Contact the landlord direct to explain that the stupid agents have lost two leases, did not give you copies (as they are legally required to do) when you signed and are withholding your deposit. Tell them that you want to leave on good terms and not drag the landlord into court to recover the deposit.

Dispute the deductions with the deposit scheme. Ask the letting agents for their complaint handling procedure, raise a formal complaint and if they insist raise it with the ombudsman.

Dispute the deductions. It is up to the agent to prove that you owe it.

Is the deposit in both names or just yours? This would prove a new contract took place.

Have you got proof that you handed keys back? Deposit must be returned within 10days so they are clearly working that the tenancy only just ended but if you returned keys and emails prove it was earlier you gave a much stronger case.

Hi Hun, sorry to hear that you’re going through a hard time. I imagine that the burden of proof here lies with them. If they claim to have lost the agreement and are going off the outdated agreement then surely you could claim that after the initial 12 months from when it was signed that it became a rolling contract anyway? I highly recommend calling shelter for some advice on where you stand. If you’re in England their number is 0808 800 4444 :) good luck with it all, agents can be real sh**s sometimes x

When did you sign the most recent contract? What period was it for?