AIBU to think it's crap my work doesn't confirm annual leave until May each year?

[ThreeJumpersIsNotEnough]

Started a new work place not too long ago. This is my first permanent job as I've always temped going from job to job with an agency and just taking a week's break from jobs if I wanted a holiday. ]

My new place has a holiday calendar going from April to April each year.

Every April, we have to put in our AL requests for the year and then the boss goes through these in May to approve or deny requests. Xmas holidays are not usually approved until September.

AIBU to think this is a really crap system?

On Friday, I saw a fantastic package deal for August but the deal expires in 10 days. I spoke with my boss about whether or not I could book it and she was quite snappy, told me I was informed of the process when I started and if I booked it, I may be asked to cancel if AL wasn't approved. I was told it was likely most people would want those dates off as they lie within the school holidays and there would be a lot of negotiation required within he team when it's discussed in May.

I spoke with my colleagues about what they do. Surely most people want to book way in advance to organise and pay off the holiday etc?

Most people (funnily enough, the more highly paid people) say they just don't book anything until they are confident their AL dates have been approved and then go searching for good deals in the summer (not likely to find a bargain 2 months before departure)

Other people say they put in their dates, pay the deposit for the holiday only and prepare themselves that they might have to cancel.

I don't know what to do. The deposit is £350. A lot to lose if my AL is refused. However, if i leave it until May next year to book, the holiday is likely to be back to normal price, costing maybe £1000 more than currently.

I've already made it clear to my team I'd love these dates (my daughter's birthday, taking her somewhere she would love!) and I'd be willing to work all other school holidays for that year if I could just have those ten days off.

Ultimately my boss decides though and a few members of my team have also expressed an interest in getting those dates off.

There is no system for deciding who gets it. If lots of people want the same time off, 'negotiation talks' are had by the staff members and the boss. Such a crappy system.

YANBU that's an awful system. How do people ever plan childcare for the holidays? There's a half term within weeks of the leave year starting. Can just imagine someone being told they can't go on their honeymoon or something ridiculous

It is rubbish but unfortunately you have no legal entitlement to take your leave when you want to. In theory your employer could dictate every single one of your leave days.

Yeah that’s a crap system.

At mine we have to get holiday on the planner early (like at least 6 months ahead) for resourse planning, but if you wanted a week in August and there are enough people not already booked off you can get confirmation same day.

Totally agree it’s a crappy system but I’m aftaid they can do what they like as long as you are given your holidays at some point. My previous manager refused to approve my holidays until the day before I was due on AL just incase she needed me for something. .

Leave the bastards. That's an abusive relationship, they're being controlling and unfair.

It's a crap system. Sadly it seems totally normal for employers to treat their staff like dirt

That's awful. We have to give a month's notice for any holiday and it's approved/declined the same day.

What a ridiculous system. Are they this unreasonable and disorganised in other ways?

It's a crap system - and similar to what DH operates on currently. Except its all organised in September, approved in November for Jan.
So, if you get refused Xmas (like we have 3 of the past 4 years), you cant go on holiday for new year because its next year. And 25th Dec is a working day, unless it falls at a weekend.
Bare in mind 80% of this company are on assignment, so living abroad from their extended family (and in some cases family), its an absolute shitter.
So, my choice this Xmas? Spend it with DH in one of the most anti-Christmasy countries in the world, or leave him here alone, and fly the kids to my parents for a traditional Christmas.

It's a crap system, join a union. Also be aware that some employers give preference to longer-serving employees when booking holidays. Can you find out what criteria they use to allocate leave - for example does everyone have a first choice two weeks? There is a reasonableness criteria for booking leave but it's something like allowing double the amount of time off, i.e. Two weeks notice to authorise or cancel one week off.

We have a similarly crappy system, except the manager decides herself and just accepts or declines your requests. We have to submit all requests for the year in one go. If she declines your requests, you just keep throwing more dates at her until she finally agrees something. It is such a stupid system with no transparency at all. I never ever have been given AL during any school holidays, except the summer hols, everything else is always declined. It is so unfair. If anything crops us short notice, then tough, you ain't getting it off!

I’ve never heard of a system like that. Sounds awful. I’ve worked somewhere where we’d get our leave cancelled when busy but to be fair there was a legitimate reason for it and it was the norm to reimburse or compromise where possible (eg work reimbursed lost ticket costs for me and paid for someone to fly out a day late to their holiday).

That's absolutely ridiculous! What happens if you want leave in April? At the very least, why don't they ask you to submit leave requests in February to be confirmed in March for the next leave year?

The year in one go thing is harsh. My DDad had to take unpaid leave to attend my own wedding because we only had a 10 month engagement. He works in a supermarket and apparently it's due to the rota. Even hospital doctors aren't required to arrange all their annual leave in advance.

That is as utterly ridiculous system. Have you queried with HR as to why it operates like that?

I honestly wouldn’t join a company that did this. The only thing we have to book in advance is Christmas, to ensure there is someone at least ‘on call’ on any given day. Anything else:

-1-2 days holiday: book a week in advance ideally but it’s flexible

• 2-5 days: book 2 weeks in advance
• 5+ days: book a month in advance

Which makes sense to me. It is at line manager’s discretion and the answer comes back very quickly.

But surely all these ridiculously unflexible systems are counterproductive? Sometimes you just need late notice time off. I’ve never ever had a sickie but if I worked in a system like some of you do I would!

What about when children are sick and someone has to look after them? When elderly parents go into hospital and you want to visit them before it’s too late? Surely these companies can see that there are times when you need time off?

I don't get why they take so long to approve leave requests. If I put in a leave request, I get a decision within a couple of days, so does DP.

Mind you, where DP works the answer is normally "no". They have a policy of no more than 3 people off at a time, even though only a tiny part of his work is covered by other staff (most of it is something rather technical that no-one else can do).

Most of our holidays are planned at less than a month's notice, and because all the other staff book all their leave at the start of the leave year, we get left with odd weeks that no-one else wants. They also don't have any system where staff can check when other staff are off. We agree between ourselves when we'd like to go away, both go into work and ask for the time off, then a couple of days later, he gets told he can't have those days, and we're back to square one!

At my workplace, there's a spreadsheet we can all look at, so when we ask for leave, we can be fairly sure it's going to be approved.

That's a crap system. Dh has the same system but it's September to September so we book the days off then keep an eye out for special deals. Think booking in August is way too big a risk as everybody will want time off with their kids.

Really makes me appreciate my own employer more. I could probably get next week off if I wanted and asked now. And as a manager myself, I've never once declined a holiday request.