Landlord entering property without permission - AIBU to ask for advice?

[WellAlwaysHaveParis]

I live in a rented flatshare, and my housemates and I found out that our landlord came into our flat today without any notice while we were all out at work.

The only way we found out that the landlord had been in the flat is because we have a cleaning lady who visits weekly.

The cleaning lady came to clean the flat today and texted my flatmate to see that she’d seen our landlord in the flat.

What are our rights in this situation regarding our landlord?

The LL has never given us 24 hours’ notice before when coming into our flat, even though it is in the signed contract that they gave us and it is also a legal requirement.

However, when the LL came into the flat before today, they would always let us know they were coming, even if it was never 24 hours’ notice. Today, the LL didn’t tell us they were coming, so we had no idea.

AIBU to ask for advice?

Do you each rent the rooms individually? Or is it a joint tenancy for the whole flat.

If the former then the LL can let himself into common areas whenever he likes.

If you have a tenancy for the whole flat, then no, he can’t do that. A first step would be a verbal request that he doesn’t let himself in without your permission.

We each rent a room individually 19lottie82, but even so, doesn’t the LL have to still give us 24 hours’ notice?

How many people live at the property? If 3 or more (from different families), your LL needs a HMO licence.

Even in a flats share, the LL must give notice to visit.

5 people live in the property, Welsh - we’re all unrelated and moved in at different times, and rent our rooms separately. Although some of the rooms don’t have locks on them and/or it’s not possible to lock the rooms, which is worrying.

Our LL doesn’t need an HMOlicence as, even though 5 tenants live here, the flatshare is bungalow (HMO licences only apply to rented properties that are 3 storeys or more).

Are you sure that is true about hmo licences being 3 storeys or more? I've never heard of that. House layout is irrelevant. It's about the occupants of the property, if it is 3 or more and whether they are related.

Honestly, with a LL like that you're better off finding somewhere else than fighting it. If he thinks it's okay then he thinks it's okay, you won't change his mind. And if you kick up a fuss he can simply ask you to leave at the end of your fixed-term anyway.

She's right about a HMO licence.

https://www.gov.uk/house-in-multiple-occupation-licence

Actually from 1 October the rules on HMO's are changing and he will need a licence as the number of storeys in the property will no longer be taken into account

HMO laws are changing on the 1st October for England, your household will officially be a HMO. Licence will be required, number of floors will be irrelevant as your household is made up of five people from least 2 different families.

Link to Landlords Guild
From 01/10/2018 the HMO three-storey rule is discontinued, and the new rule applies to all properties including bungalows with five or more tenants from two or more separate households.

The 24 hours notice applies to private areas, not communal ones.

If you want clarification then give Shelter a call.

It might be worth just messaging the landlord ( message I.e email so everything they say Is evidence)

And just asking “hey is there a reason you were here the other day?”

If he gets shitty about it, I’d find somewhere else to live.

If he has no actual reason and you know for 100% that he’s not supposed to be here without 24 hours notice then send him another message proving this ( I.e 24 hours notice in the tenancy agreements )

Why don’t you have locks on your doors?

Check if anything is missing etc

I and another flatmate have now separately asked the LL in writing why the LL visited the flat without giving us 24 hours’ notice, and the LL hasn’t answered the question.

The LL has also said (in writing):

‘As this is a house in multiple occupancy, you are unable to lock bedrooms as that could be a health & safety issue.’

What?! Locking our doors is a health and safety issue, even though it’s an HMO and we all rent our rooms from the LL separately?

As this is a house in multiple occupancy, you are unable to lock bedrooms as that could be a health & safety issue

absolute rubbish - my son is in his 3rd HMO (uni and now working) and he's always had a lockable door

Thanks for confirming, FullMetal. That’s what I thought too.

Re; the 24 hours’ notice that the LL has to give us before entering the flat, this is specified in our tenancy agreements.

If the LL breaks their own tenancy agreement, what are our rights in this situation?

As previous posters have said, I understand that the LL can, by law, enter communal areas of our flat without giving 24 hours’ notice, even though this is not ideal.

However, by doing this, the LL is breaking the terms of the tenancy agreements.

Put a camera in your room, he’s definitely a knicker sniffer

Put a camera in your room, he’s definitely a knicker sniffer

sorry I don't know the answer to your other question, I'll leave that for someone better informed than me

LL cannot go into private areas without AT LEAST 24 hours notice and ONLY WITH tenant agreement. Only exception is a serious emergency.

you've written (which is the right thing) and clearly your landlord is ignoring the law. You could add a lock, remove when you leave and make good damage.

sounds a bit of a shithole anyway. As someone else said, the only real way to deal with bad landlords is to stop feeding them by moving on. Especially if the new HMO regs are to be ignored too.

Definitely get a camera - I have a Smart Frog one, it has an app and alerts you to movement/sound in the area. I pay monthly but you can buy it outright.

Put it in the communal area (with agreement from your housemates). If questioned by LL say it was a communal security decision given you are not able to lock your doors (which is rubbish - of course you should be able to secure the space you are renting!)..

Depends if you have a license, rather than a tenancy, if you do not have exclusive possession of your room, you are a licensee so landlord does not technically have to give notice to access your room.. As you rent the rooms individually, you are clearly not joint tenants of the whole flat? I’m assuming, you came as individuals to the flat, paying landlord for each room, as opposed to a group of you signing an agreement to jointly take tenancy of the flat.
Now, you can have exclusive possession of your room if the agreement with the landlord is specifically for you to have that room, and the landlord provides no cleaning or other services for that room. If so, you are tenant of your room. The landlord cannot let himself/herself into room but can access common parts whenever.

Ignore the post about licenses. I had a landlord who harassed me try that trick on me.

Your landlord is being unreasonable.

I use to live in other households were individual rooms were rented out and we had no locks on our individual bedroom doors. The landlords refused to come into the houses without giving at least one of us notice including when we called them to do repairs. People were in the houses randomly due to working different hours so it was very easy to catch them out, which is how I caught the harassing landlord out.

Get the camera as a PP stated and confirm he's not going into your individual rooms. If he is give notice to move, find somewhere else and report him to the police for tenant harrassment.

NOPE NOPE NOPE

Make him respond, send him multiple emails and put a camera/ lock in your room