To ask how you would pronounce this name?

[Notss]

Hi all,

Sorry if this is the wrong place:

My little sister is expecting her first child and if it is a girl wants to call her “Sian”.

She sent it to me in a text and I replied “What - like See-Ann?” And she told me I was being daft.

So how would you pronounce such a name?

@Padparadscha

Have a look at the way phonics are taught in schools. There's an example up thread. There's a whole generation out there right now learning the sound "ar". Which is the same sound as a and al and au and ear (banana, heart, car, calm, laugh all have the same sound in them, a long a). Ar is simply the most common way to suggest it, as evidenced by this thread. So people are practically and theoretically understanding phonetics according to their education and experience.

”It doesn’t have that sound (or the actual letter ‘r’ in it, so have no idea why people need to add it in regardless).”

It absolutely does have that sound, for millions and millions of non-rhotic English speaking people. Not everyone speaks like you, believe it or not.

And I have never in my life heard anyone pronounce it Shan-to-rhyme-with-can.

Think of it this way. There's no h in Sian either but the easiest way to express the sound at the beginning of Sian is "sh". For lots of people, the same is true of "ar". It perfectly suggests the sound aaaaaaaa.

Jesus fucking Christ on a bike - round and round and round we go!!

Shan = rhymes with can, Dan, fan.

Non-rhotic speakers (and if you've "never heard of it" then Google is your friend - look it up!) do NOT pronounce the "r" in car, barn, arm, or Sharn.

But we do make a long aaa sound when we see the digraph "ar".

So when we are trying to demonstrate how we would say a long aaa sound, we will write "ar".

RHOTIC speakers pronounce the R wherever they see one. But they also seem to be unable to comprehend that the sound "an" will be a short a, as in can, as, man, fan. So writing "Shan" will not produce the correct pronunciation in anyone who speaks non-rhotically.

Hope THAT helps.

Every time I see someone post Shan, I remember this father I once saw supporting his child's reading by encouraging him to sound out street signs phonetically. And then the bus stopped at Thames Street. Poor man only realised after he'd started that the word Thames is not pronounced phonetically at all.

I don't do the faux confusion bit, but as a rhotic speaking American, I will admit to some confusion the first time I saw the "r" thing on MN. And I have lived in the UK, although it was Scotland so I was around mostly rhotic speakers. Also we rhotic speakers have to shift our accents into unfamiliar territory to sound out the pronunciation with that "r" that isn't pronounced. I feel as though I am channeling Princess Margaret.

@ethel Er, I pronounce arse with an r because there's a bloody r in it.

To confuse matters further, I was taught that the "long" sound of "a" is as in "cake," the short sound is " cat. " The non-rhotic "ar" sound I call a broad "a."

There were six Sians in my year at school, so not exactly unusual. All pronounced Shahn (or sharn, all rhyming with Khan)

Sharn. I went to school with a Sian.

But they also seem to be unable to comprehend that the sound "an" will be a short a, as in can, as, man, fan.

You seem to be unable to comprehend that there are many rhotic speakers who have said no such thing.

No idea why the others have, it’s quite clear the R is there to elongate the A.

Right, I've got some beginners' Welsh sources out to see what they suggest as examples of short- and long a-sounds.

First one suggests to compare cat and car. The second suggests that a short a-sound is treated like the vowels in Japan, and that a long a-sound, as in Siân, should be pronounced as in t- a -rt. It helpfully prints the a in tart in bold, presumably to avoid exactly the same confusion we have here over pronouncing our R's.

Girl from school was called (Sian) Sharn

Ah YeTalkShiteHen - I apologise - I should have been more focused in that remark, as I know not all rhotic speakers are having the difficulty in comprehension. I was just a bit riled by the "HTH" post a few previous to mine.

ThumbWitchesAbroad I get it, posts rile me too sometimes more than I should let them

I felt the need to defend my fellow rhotic speakers who hadn’t argued about the R I suppose.

Arse emphasis on the AR like a pirate

Are you a pirate? Or a country bumpkin?

I say ahhhh-S.

Sian has a ^ above the a which signifies the a is extended. So Sian is pronounced Shaan. No R sound in Sian.

I would say Sharn and Shaan exactly the same. Which is what many people are saying.

My cousin is called that and it's Shan though my granny thought it was sai ann

Sharn.

Oh god, it's the Frances thread all over again.

My friend has that name, same spelling and she is ‘Shan’ in pronounciation.

I knew a Sian and she pronounced it See-Ann!

*EthelThePiratesDaughter

I would say Sharn and Shaan exactly the same. Which is what many people are saying*

Shaan has a softer sound than Sharn. My name is Sian (I was the only Sian in primary school as we lived in a small village. Nobody named their child the same name as anyone they knew). By the time I attended Comprehensive school there were 7 of us in my class, and plenty more in other classes within my year - and other years.

In Wales we roll our R's so if someone suggested Sian is pronounced as Sharn we would pronounce the R. I think those from the West Country would too.

Shaan has a softer sound than Sharn.

Maybe in your accent, but in mine they sound identical.