Good state v private! Don't want to start a fight but...

[Miladymilord]

I know this is an impossible dilemma as you don't know me or dd but...

dd is currently in year 8 at a good state comprehensive. She's very sporty, popular, middling academically. Last year she had a bad patch socially as she fell out with a friend, there was no sport to speak of and she had a month or so of feeling really miserable and not enjoying school. In a sort of mad flush, I went to see an independent school locally about the possibitliy of dd doing a sports scholarship. They were impressed with her sports cv ( I don't normally carry that around with me but they asked to see one) and have written to say that they have looked through our financial records and her cv and we tick boxes for various pots of bursary money and a sports scholarship. We have entered her for the scholarship in Jan.

Now she's started back at her state school and is loving it. She has a group of really good boy and girl friends, she's had a great few days.

So of course now I am thinking - what's the point in moving her?

Is independent school really worth it? I know it totally depends on the child and the school...

Dh is non-committal which doesn't help - although he is very laid back, thinks we should do the scholarship and see what happens.

Because its completly dependent on the discount, I can't really probe dd to see what she wants to do - in case she decides she desperately wants the scholarship and then she either doesnt get one, or does but the amount is too small.

We've given the bursar some idea of what we can afford (very little!) and that didn't seem to put her off.

The independent seems lovely, nice grounds, confident polite girls, happy, busy etc etc although I know they are good at marketing...

aargh.

It may be tempting to think you'd drop her off and she'd come home having done lots of sport but ime there is just as much ferrying around for independent school's sports' teams. Plus early morning practices or after-school training, weekend fixtures. Parents at our school are constantly complaining about how demanding it all is and how much it eats into both family time and the parents' time.

Also do seriously consider how 'holistic' the independent school is. Our school has a brilliant reputation for sports but tbh it comes at the expense of other areas and although your DD loves sports, you need to consider how important it is to you that she has a rounded experience.

Speaking from experience (though it was many years ago and I’m sure, very different now) I got a scholarship to go to ballet school aged 10. It was wonderful from the point of view that I loved the work but the boarding situation and the hothouse mentality was very very tough. Very competitive atmosphere (we weren’t playing at it!) and I did miss the “doing” it for pleasure aspect. I had years of assessments, being poked and prodded and weighed and measured and nearly lost my place when I had a health condition which set me back 12 months....

Think carefully. It it’s was your dd wants then .... maybe!

Do you have to decide now? Things may well become clearer over the months ahead.

There’s no harm in taking the scholarship paper in Jan - she hasn’t committed to anything at that stage. You don’t have enough information to decide until you know if it’s even feasible.

My girls are at a private school and do 2 hours of sports training everyday after school and absolutely love it. They are 17 & 15. They are in a mixed school however.

Involvement in athletics/sport has been shown to protect girls against eating and anxiety disorders and build their self esteem. So something to take seriously and not just as an add-on.

With the disclaimer that I went to independent schools, loved them and appreciate everything they gave me -

The state school congratulated 14 students on getting 8 x 7's and over in the GCSEs - thats out of a cohort of about 350 - that didn't seem amazing? Whereas the indie got 50% A and A* equivalent (think they do some IGSCES)

• sport is a no-brainer surely?

ime there is just as much ferrying around for independent school's sports' teams. Plus early morning practices or after-school training, weekend fixtures. Parents at our school are constantly complaining about how demanding it all is and how much it eats into both family time and the parents' time

the parents aren't involved at all! Its a boarding school although dd would be day.

So yes I'd have to pick her up late sometimes - but never expected to get involved at all in the sport - a lot of parents don't ever even watch the matches and aren't expected to (which I know seems mean but - hurrah!)

Not the biggest fan of private schools so my opinion may be clouded by that. I don’t know anyone who has attended one and come away with anything better than I did after attending a truly shit state school.

Your DD is happy where she is and you have mentioned she gets along with both sexes, why switch her to single sex? I would keep her where she is.

Your DD is happy where she is and you have mentioned she gets along with both sexes, why switch her to single sex?

Because there’s more to school than boys and girls - such as good results and good sports tuition and facilities.

She’s got all her existing friends anyway.

I think private schools tend to get the best out of the middling academic. The top set would probably do well anywhere, the bottom set would struggle anywhere.

I agree academically she will probably do well at teh state school and maybe not do that much better at the indie

I went to a shit state but I definitely know people that did better than me who went to private school!!

Well done to your DD for getting a shot at the scholarship. Both of my DC's are independent schools. I'd take her along to visit and gauge her reaction and feelings post visit. Personally I wouldn't engage her in the affordability issues....that's for you and your DP to work out" between you. I always remember years ago my parents are taking me to the local private school and telling me that they could just about afford it if my mother workeded flat out all the hours God sent.....of course I never took that option!
However, what I would point out to you from experience is that a lot of girls once they hit puberty/exam study/ the party scene can become a little less enthusiastic about sport.... and so maintaining the bursary could be a challenge for you. If this is the case you need to work out if you might qualify for an additional bursary or if you can get the fees together for her. She sounds very committed though!
Hope it works out! Good luck!

By the way....my DD's a bit of a tomboy and has enjoyed years of being a bit of slob in an all girl environment. She never cares what she looks like each day because there's no boys to impress. DS is a late developer and has enjoyed not being under the scrutiny of girls.....so single sex schools have worked very happily for us. However, in the case of the girls schools - friendship groups, tiffs etc tend to be very intense, emotional and needlessly prolonged. DD is in upper sixth and still these girls have fall outs that drag on for weeks! I never recall this at my happy state comp!

I would be very concerned at the staff turnover at your DD's current school. That is a major issue. To me the private school sounds like it gets better results and has better provision for sport so I'd definitely move her if you can afford to.

IF she is sporty then I woudl go for the Ind esp for girls in state the focus really drops off and her school does not sound great with only boys to x and matches cancelled...
my friends dd at state that have carried on with sports have required significant effort from parents to maintain both logistics and against the culture unfortnately.... whereas its is part of the fabric of the independent school.....

In your case I would say, unequivocally, stick with the state school.

The private school wants your talented daughter to boost its competitive advantage so that it can attract full fee payers. It’s a benefit they are prepared to pay for.

However there are a lot of hidden costs, from uniform to school trips, which you will have to cover.

She will also be expected to give up a lot of time to representing the school in her sport, and to prioritise this over other interests she might have. I know someone whose private school wouldn't release her from school matches to play in teams in which she represented her county.

If your DD is happy where she is she is likely to thrive and you can use the money you’ll save helping her to progress in her sport.

Can she not stay at the state school and develop her sporting interests by going to extra clubs in the local area after school?
What are the opportunities at county level?

The strongest indicator of how well children do at school is having parental involvement and interest and it sounds like your DD is doing well there.

Don't base your decision on a raw comparison of exam results. It's generally very difficult to get a meaningful comparison there since you would have to correct for the attainment of the children on entry and a host of other confounding factors (for instance, one very important factor is whether the school will be reluctant to enter kids for chancy exams if they are worried they will under-perform and drag averages down). The evidence base is simply not strong enough. It's tricky even comparing 2 state schools in the same borough, let alone a state and private school.

If your DD lives for the sport and it's something particularly well supported by the private school then I can see the appeal. Otherwise I would be tempted to stick with the state school and use the resulting extra financial flexibility to help her via clubs etc.

Changing schools in general is not risk-free. We moved one child to what, on paper, was a far better school. Although things turned out OK in the end, there were a lot of problems with bullying and poor behaviour in her year cohort, which the school really struggled to deal with. We would have done better to stay put.

[As to my own personal background, since we all have our own experience that shapes our view on this: my siblings and I all went to local comps and got good university outcomes. and I can't see a private school as having made much difference to us in that respect - but that's just one story so useless as more general evidence]

As the parent of a sporty child - I find this so depressing. OP I totally understand why you would want this for your child. For those saying do sport after school - then it takes up all the free time you get with your child! But private schools do better - and they do better because children who are running around doing games/ getting fresh air and exercise also do better at learning - all the brain research shows we have to be physically fit in order to do well in more formal/ literacy type learning.

just another shit thing about modern education....sit the kids down and make them stare at a teacher all day instead of giving them a rounded education.

she will be a happier healthier teen for doing more sport - but I hve to say the girls only thign would put me off.