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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

Any universal credit experts on here?

30 replies

Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 02:09

Have a question as friend has called me in tears and we can’t find an answer online.

OP posts:
VanillaBeans · 30/08/2018 02:35

No expert but I’ve been reading a lot about it since becoming a single mum! Luckily I am in one of the last transition areas.. what’s the question?

Original poster
Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 02:41

So

“Susan” ( the only name I can think of)

So yeah Susan lives with bob, Susan moved from the south to the north to live with bob a few weeks ago and this isn’t on his tenancy agreement, no bills in her name so she’s technically just staying there.

Susan wants to work but in the meantime wants to apply for universal credit,

Now does she have to say she lives with him even though she doesn’t pay any bills, no tenancy in her name and doesn’t want to apply for anything to do with help for rent. Just the universal credit.

Is this possible or will he also have to go to a universal credit interview etc?

OP posts:
Shootfirstaskquestionslater · 30/08/2018 02:48

Is she in a relationship with him or are they just roommates.

HelenaDove · 30/08/2018 02:48

why doesnt he want to put her on the tenancy agreement?

Original poster
Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 02:52

They are in a relationship , have been together long distance for around two years.

And upon asking her this Susan’s response is that he doesn’t want his rent to go up ( I’m not presuming the landlord doesn’t know she’s moved in etc)

OP posts:
HelenaDove · 30/08/2018 02:54

and i bet he doesnt want to lose his 25% discount on his council tax either Im really not liking the sound of "Bob"

Original poster
Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 02:57

If I was the landlord I would want to know personally but I feel saying that I’d sound unreasonable

OP posts:
VanillaBeans · 30/08/2018 02:58

The problem is if she is no longer renting down south then I’m not sure if this is possible as she needs to provide an address. It might be possible to claim just her own money’s worth (IYSWIM) if there is an option to say she is not a tenant or homeowner of any kind, as in if one of the options when filling out the housing circumstances part of the form is “Living with friends and family” or similar.

However, it then gets complicated and I wouldn’t advise it or think it was appropriate to do that because if he also has a UC claim and they are using the same address, well then there are 2 working able adults living in the house, and it would not be right to claim separately. It’s definitely something an advisor would need to be consulted on as I’m not sure what they’d do in her housing circumstances if she isn’t on the tenancy.

Honestly though? I think she is leaving herself incredibly vulnerable. Does she have her own home in the south? She’s not on any tenancy agreement with him, if she doesn’t own her own place or still pay rent she’s left her own property willingly (so no chance of being considered unintentionally homeless) and she doesn’t have her own income. There are so many things that could go wrong in this situation that would result in her being without a stable home. Is she planning to go on the tenancy?

They also make you job search full time now so it would be much better for her to just work. That way at least she wouldn’t have to rely on benefits which are paid circumstanially and capped. She’d be better off making a small contribution to the rent and bills (with the promise of equal or fair contribution once it’s jointly her home) and bullding some of her own savings.

Just based on her circumstances I’m rather getting the impression that things aren’t stable or guaranteed with this new relationship - is that accurate? Why has she made such an upheaval of her life to move up there with no income and no stable home, was she financially struggling when she lived down south?

FoldyRoll · 30/08/2018 03:00

She'd be better off just trying to get a job ASAP. UC is a world of pain. Bob would have to apply with her, it would take months and be handled incompetently at every step.
It sounds like Bob won't want to help, so she'll be stuck. If Bob did help, his earnings would probably mean she wouldn't qualify and be stuck. Kafka himself couldn't have dreamed up UC.

VanillaBeans · 30/08/2018 03:01

Sorry cross posted. He sounds dodgy I don’t like Bob either. Sounds like he’s having his cake and eating it massively and “Susan” is being incredibly naive. On a whim he could tell her to leave and never come back and be fully within his rights to. And she would have nowhere to live, no income, and very likely not eligible for social housing :(

Original poster
Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 03:03

When she told me she was moving I’d assumed ( she is a woman of 31) that she would have a job up there or would be starting one quite soon.

She was renting down south near Vauxhall which she said she hated as it was too far away from him.

My worry is that it all seems a bit seedy,

She’s genuinely upset at the thought of having no money and this all seems to have been rushed. -.-

I said that she should declare that they live together , get on the tenancy agreement and then show universal credit this and see if they can help etc

Seems to have fallen on deaf ears as I don’t “understand”

( I’m married, we have a house etc so I’m not fully aware of renting situations )

OP posts:
HelenaDove · 30/08/2018 03:06

I agree with Vanilla He sounds like a user and financial abuser.

VanillaBeans · 30/08/2018 03:08

You “don’t understand” what?! Your advice is literally what she should be doing; that and looking for a job.

His unwillingness to offer her security with him after 2 years and presumably planning for her to give up her own place and move down there is incredibly disconcerting. She sounds like a complete sucker for him and he seems to be on an entirely different page to her :(

VanillaBeans · 30/08/2018 03:13

Helena completely agreed he sounds like a leechy irresponsible twat at best, financially abusive and controlling at worst.

Original poster
Losingthewill1 · 30/08/2018 03:14

Will be screen shotting the replies and sending these to her :) thank you everyone

OP posts:
stressedtiredbuthappy · 30/08/2018 03:25

Poor Susan, imagine being so desperate for a man, that you'd put yourself in such a vulnerable position.

Birdsgottafly · 30/08/2018 04:51

She will be assessed as having a Partner and as such, his income will have to be taken into account when calculating if she is entitled to anything.

She has put herself in a vulnerable position and it would be better to to a "Entitled to" calculation, then decide what to do.

Mc180768 · 30/08/2018 05:45

Bob should be informing his landlord whom then should issue a new tenancy agreement with Susan as a joint tenant.

As for UC, Susan would be able to make a claim and depending on his circs would need to declare him on her claim as they live together as if they were married.

Tell Susan to go to entitled to website and then benefit calculator. She can find out what she can get from there. It's likely she'll be a job seeker if she's of working age & fit and healthy.

As for him being an abuser, it's somewhat hard to make a judgement on him from a few posts.

WrongKindOfFace · 30/08/2018 06:17

She needs to declare she lives with her partner. Anything else would be fraudulent. However, she may not be entitled to any money from universal credit if he’s working, and maybe also because she voluntarily left a job?

WrongKindOfFace · 30/08/2018 06:19

I wouldn’t rush to get on his tenancy. He sounds like a bit of a dick.

MsHopey · 30/08/2018 06:27

She needs to just be honest. Tell them she lives with her partner but doesn't pay any rent and isn't on the tenancy agreement.
BIL and his wife and child all live in MIL HA home, they're not on the tenancy agreement and they don't pay rent, and that's exactly what they put on the application (they get a lot of money for people that essentially have no bills tbh, even when you take off the rent element). If her new partner won't put her on the tenancy agreement that's completely separate to the universal credit issue. I know they normally contact LLs to verify the rent you're asking for, but if she's not asking for any I doubt they'll need to.

lornathewizzard · 30/08/2018 07:04

The simple answer is she's living with someone and it's fraudulent to tell UC otherwise.
We had to take our tenancy agreement and proof of rent payment with us to the UC interview.
I'm also a little confused as to where she will say she's living?

MorseandLewis · 30/08/2018 07:46

Well if she couldn’t get a job living in Vauxhall it is likely to be harder elsewhere

Has she ever worked? In London you can pretty much get a same day job in fast food or hotel etc

JovialNickname · 30/08/2018 07:47

To the best of my understanding (and I don't work in the field) it's not possible just to claim certain elements of Universal Credit. I.e it's no longer broken up into a housing benefit bit, a living cost bit etc - the name Universal Credit refers to the fact that it is one lump sum. Therefore I don't think she can say never mind about my address/rental situation, can I just have the living costs element please.

If they are living together his income will need to be taken into account for the purpose of the UC assessment. Living together means household income will be taken into account when calculating benefits - this is what Bob signed up to when he agreed to co habit.

JovialNickname · 30/08/2018 07:51

Re. Mshopeys post above - I think that situation is slightly different as it's the mother's house and her income would not be taken into account when assessing her adult son. However the income of a partner should be

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