Help - driving licence revoked with immediate effect

[LadyRussell]

Posting for traffic - help!

DH was diagnosed with sleep apnea a few months ago and informed the DVLA as instructed.

He now has an oxygen mask he wears at night which has improved his sleep dramatically.

He is currently driving his kids home from a trip to the other side of the country and I have received a letter from the DVLA saying his licence has been revoked as of immidiate effect from yesterday - WTAF?

He has NEVER fallen asleep while driving and he lives 150 miles away from us in the week so driving is essential.

He has to prove certain things to get his licence back but this is going to take time.

How the hell can they do this - no warning nothing.

Does anyone know if we can appeal?

So your DH has a problem with his jaw which affects his air entry when sleeping? Is this a new injury or is it a genetic problem? Because unless the problem with his jaw is rectifiable I'm not sure the DVLA will view a sleep apnea machine as sufficient treatment, and if it's a condition he has had since he was born he's obviously been driving with it for years, why is why the DVLA May have revoked his license pending investigation.

"FFS - my DH is totally safe - HE IS USING A CPAP MACHINE!!!

He is doing nothing dangerous."

Doesn't sound like you really care about what anyone else says or thinks. Hes probably driven 25 miles since you started this thread anyway so lets all just hope you are right and you don't have a policeman knocking on your door to inform you that the worse has happened.

I think he should come home and then go straight to his GP. They will assume that it takes two days to get the letter so he doesn't have to stop driving immediately.
Sorry if you have already stated this but when he was told to contact the DVLA, was he also told that it was safe to drive? Has he completed a questionnaire from the DVLA stating that he is using a CPAP machine? Does his doctor know this? Has he only just informed the DVLA resulting in them revoking the license while making enquiries or have the already made them?

The whole business of whether someone is fit to drive or not is a grey area - alarmingly so.
Clearly, there are obvious conditions that mean driving is off the table - and surely the OP's dh must know that Sleep Apnoea must be one of them. How can you drive safely when you could fall asleep at the wheel at any moment? So, even before the DVLA was informed, he really should have made a sensible decision himself on that one.

But people don't. We've had something similar with my elderly dad. Fortunately, finally, at 87 years old, he's agreed to give up driving and sold his car this week. He was adamant prior to this that he was OK to continue. I know there are plenty of people on here who would have said they'd take his keys away or shop him to the DVLA and so forth, but we didn't have the authority to do this. He is compos mentis and totally in charge of his own affairs. We tried to get the GP on board and even she said she couldn't prohibit him, but that it was his decision. When I broke my leg, neither the Orthopaedic Surgeon or my insurance company would tell me if I was ready to drive again. Both said it was up to me to decide when I was fit and could manage an emergency stop.
It's a crazy system.

The letter process used here is ridiculous - assuming someone has received a letter - dvla should def review this process as it is so totally flawed! Eg lost or missing post etc for something that creates legal obligations

This would be ridiculous if it was the first thing the OP knew about the license revocation, but as others have said, the medical professional who informed the DVLA would also have informed her husband to stop driving immediately. The letter is just confirmation of this, surely?

Posters are posting giving incorrect information.

That's not the way the DVLA work. Everything takes ages with them.

If OP's Dh had been savvy and in the know he'd had informed them, got the forms, got them filled out.

But if you don't know how the system works, don't know how to 'play the game' you get caught out.

Because you don't know. Then you get the thunder bolt of a letter saying you can't drive.

And it takes normal people months of dealing with the DVLA and their archaic ways, to get their licence back.

I got my mum's back in 2 days.
Because I NOW know how to play the system. Having lost mine twice, because of DVLA errors. Yes. Theirs not mine.

This would be ridiculous if it was the first thing the OP knew about the license revocation, but as others have said, the medical professional who informed the DVLA would also have informed her husband to stop driving immediately. The letter is just confirmation of this, surely?

I thought OP's DH rather than a medical professional informed the DVLA. Whether or not he would expect his license would be revoked following this would depend on whether or not the medical professional told him to stop driving. Normally if they say you can drive, you can continue while the DVLA investigate.

If OP's Dh had been savvy and in the know he'd had informed them, got the forms, got them filled out.

He did do that didn't he?

"Sleep Apnoea must be one of them."

Not necessarily-"

Mild, moderate or severe Obstructive Sleep Apnoea (OSA) without excessive sleepiness:
You may continue to drive as normal and you do not need to notify the DVLA."

Most others though it says not to drive until under control.

"Mild Obstructive Sleep Apnoea Syndrome (OSAS), i.e. Obstructive Sleep Apnoea with the symptom of excessive sleepiness:
You must NOT drive until the excessive sleepiness symptom has been satisfactorily controlled. However, you must inform the DVLA if the symptoms cannot be controlled within three months.

Moderate or severe Obstructive Sleep Apnoea Syndrome (OSAS) i.e. Obstructive Sleep Apnoea with the symptom of excessive sleepiness:
You must NOT drive and must notify the DVLA. You will continue to be licensed to drive, or can apply for your driving license to be restored if previously revoked, once your OSAS is under control, your sleepiness has improved, and you are adhering to CPAP treatment. The DVLA will require medical confirmation of this.

Excessive sleepiness due to suspected Obstructive Sleep Apnoea Syndrome (OSAS):
You must NOT drive until the symptom is satisfactorily controlled but need only notify the DVLA if the suspected diagnosis is confirmed as mild OSAS and the symptoms cannot be controlled within three months. If the diagnosis is that the OSAS is moderate or severe, the notification requirements in the previous paragraph apply."

Proof that he wasn't in the house - by the fact that he is over 150 miles away.. would just about seem to fit the picture for 'unless the contrary is proved' !!!

Try reading the thread. "unless the contrary is proved" refers to proving the letter was not posted. Once it has been there is an assumption under UK law that the recipient has received it within two working days if posted 1st class where the sending or posting of such notices is covered by Act of Parliament.

It makes sense that this is the case, otherwise everyone and their dog would be claiming they 'didn't receive the letter' as a form of defence.

I really believe that the majority of people saying that op should phone him immediately so that he can abandon his car and make his way home by public transport, would not do so if they were in that position.

OP knows that her dp does not suffer from sleepyness while driving, that his treatment is working, that he is no more likely to fall asleep than someone who was kept awake all night by a party or a noisy baby. She knows there is no way he would risk driving his own dc if he was worried in any way.

Yes he will have to stop driving until this can be confirmed by a specialist and acknowledged by the DVLA, but for goodness sake just let him get home and stop the doomsday scenarios.

He's probably home by now anyway.

And he wasn't necessarily told not to drive by his specialist. Certain types of apnea do not preclude driving. He may have just been told to advise DVLA, which he did, unaware of their decision until today.

What does not telling him before he gets home achieve? Surely as an adult he deserves to be told this important information and make his own mind up on what to do for the remainder of the journey.

The OP has tried to say its dangerous to call but why can't a message be left either voice or text. Surely someone with SA and kids in the car wouldn't be driving that distance without any breaks if they are a safe driver.

"What does not telling him before he gets home achieve?"

What would telling him achieve? OP knows he would continue the journey but probably also stressed and anxious about (1) how he's going to return his dc on Monday, and (2) his job.

It may also make him culpable if he has a minor 50/50 fender bender that is unrelated to his condition, if he has been made aware of DVLAs decision.

His consultant told him to tell the DVLA which he did.

I am unaware of what else was said as I wasn’t there but I feel safe in the knowledge that if he thought this was a possibility he would have mentioned it seeing as it will have massive implications for us all.

Surely someone with SA and kids in the car wouldn't be driving that distance without any breaks if they are a safe driver

Not someone who is managing and treating their sleep apnea and is getting a great nights sleep every night for the first time in years

"Not someone who is managing and treating their sleep apnea and is getting a great nights sleep every night for the first time in years "

But presumably that wasn't the case when he informed DVLA & they acted on the information given them?

My DH hasn’t actually done anything wrong here and we are know unexpectedly in a pretty shit situation.

Thanks to all the posters with the useful advice.

*now

@RainySeptember - Telling him would allow him to make an informed decision as to whether to risk driving with his kids in a car which might not be insured or to drive slightly safer by slowing down or taking more breaks since it is a long drive.

@LadyRussell - Your saying he would of mentioned it as it has a massive implication but you haven't informed him of the letter which could have a massive implication if anything happened which required use of his car insurance

"Not someone who is managing and treating their sleep apnea and is getting a great nights sleep every night for the first time in years "

Even someone without SA should be taking a break if driving that distance

Why do people assume that just because he informed the DVla he should have immediately stopped driving?

I have a family member who had condition and DVLA had to be informed and they came back with a license with restrictions - they can't drive buses, lorries or vans above a certain size. So I wouldn't assume no driving unless a HCP actually said that to me.

150 miles away from us in the week

Well I'd be looking if it was at all commutable via public transport - talking to whoever he stops with mid week to see if they could accomodate few weekends till you get sorted - as it sounds like it could be sometime to sort it out.

As for today I'm not sure what I'd do - though I would be worried about invalid insurance on trip back.

OP, this sounds like a nightmare. We have been having similar delights with the DVLA. I don’t think the police would charge someone who didn’t know their licence had been revoked because the post hadn’t arrived yet. Under law it would be deemed to have arrived tomorrow, by which point he will have stopped driving.

Clearly there are some insurance issues here and these will have to be resolved as soon as he gets home. For now, I would sit tight and wait til he gets back (whether or not that’s legally the right thing to do).

I think some posters may be getting muddled between sleep apnea and narcolepsy. The former is a closing of the airways while sleeping, resulting in poor quality sleep and thus excessive tiredness. Note that excessive tiredness will end once the person’s airways are not closing. This makes them no more at risk of falling asleep while driving than say someone who has young children and has thus had interrupted sleep even before they are treated. Not ideal in any way, but also not narcolepsy where the sufferer may fall asleep without notice.

I spoke with my partner at lunchtime and said "did you know you were meant to tell the DVLA if you have sleep apnea". He said they didn't mention anything to him.

He goes to see them about every 6 months and apparently the data from his sleeping is a load better than it was. Similarly as a PP said, when he first went to get checked he was stopping breathing loads during the night and was having awful headaches.

Now he has had a CPAP machine though he has improved every time he has been to the clinic that he is almost "normal".

I really believe that the majority of people saying that op should phone him immediately so that he can abandon his car and make his way home by public transport, would not do so if they were in that position

Of course they wouldn't. Just like the people who say they'd cancel their holiday and take the financial hit (regardless of travel insurance, you'll lose £££) if their child had been sick in the 48 hours before but were now feeling ok to travel. Yeah right.