Can you ever have full freedom of speech?

[Jorginho5]

I think it is not possible.

One of my favourite quotes: "freedom of speech does not mean your actions do not have consequences."

If Boris had said he doesn't agree with the Niqab fine that is freedom of speech. But to use terms he did just was harsh and uncalled for.

Unfortunately many right wing believe they can say what they want. Tommy Robinson is a good example he nearly ruined a court trial because of his illegal reporting.

You need to protect minorities whether they be: women, ethnic minorities, gays, Muslims, Jews etc...

Is it right to say a women at work "go make me a coffee" "is it your time of month" of course it isn't. This is where freedom of speech must be limited.

But unfortunately many who allow hateful speech and say "it's my freedom of speech" tend to have racist views.

"it's not racist to not want refugees"
"immigrants should go home"
"I am not racist I have a black boyfriend"

The excuses people make you get shocked

It is 2018 and still people need to say lines like "I'm not racist but" (something racist comes out)

The black friend, boyfriend one is the worst though

I think you are talking about two things. Boris Johnson can say what he wants about the niqab, providing he doesn't break laws about racial hatred/incitement. The fact that I believe he is a twat does not curtail his freedom of speech.

But we do not have total freedom of speech in this country. There are laws that prevent us from using our words to bully or discriminate against others.

We have freedom of expression in the UK. Not freedom of speech. There are also hate speech laws.

I thought, until very recently, we had a culture of politeness and acceptance too. Apparently not.

THOSE that bang on about racism are the same ones that’s ok for making deograty remarks against people with red hair.

Most people who bemoan freedom of speach being denied don't have a clue what they're talking about. There is no such thing in the UK as an absolute freedom of speach, either morally or legally, nor should there be.

Really, benandholly?

I've never heard someone of colour being derogatory towards redheads. :/

We can never have freedom of speech when there's a race to be offended on behalf of others. For example, person of colour seems to be the expression du jour. I remember when 'coloured' was acceptable, then it wasn't, now a slightly altered version is what we're supposed to use.

I think it's a shame that people have become so thin skinned and unable to understand the difference between words and their meaning.

Boris Johnson made a mediocre joke with a good visual simile. Nothing to apologise about.

Johnson was playing to a certain audience at a time when there is great division in this country and race hate crimes rising. Politicians should be uniting the country not dividing it for political gain.

I think that people who bang on about freedom of speech really mean that they want to be hateful without anyone challenging them.
"You can't say anything these days without being called racist". Err, yeah you can, but be prepared for people to disagree with you. Freedom of speech works both ways.

I think that people who bang on about freedom of speech really mean that they want to be hateful without anyone challenging them
I agree. It's a convenient get out of jail free card.
See also 'it's political correctness gone mad'.

For those with intolerant views freedom of speech seems to mean 'I want to say whatever hateful and intolerant crap I want about whoever I want and you lot should shut up and not complain about it'.

We should have freedom of speech. We don’t.

It is perfectly possible but the corollary is that people can be offensive at will. Personally I think that is a price worth paying for private individuals. Many don’t, though.

We are going in the opposite direction, however, in some areas even moving towards Orwell’s newspeak.

@skippy67

Freedom to speak openly doesn't work both ways though. It's ironically those who see themselves as liberal who like the notion of 'deplatforming'.

Yes. It's inherent to the concept of freedom that we accept some limitations to ensure other people have their freedoms respected, too.

This is why we cannot incite or conspire to commit crimes with freedom of speech, intentionally cause injury to person or property (shouting "fire" in a crowded theatre being the usual example) and why under certain circumstances we will allow for free expression to take second priority and e.g. have the police remove someone before a riot ensues, act to prevent harassment etc.

None of these things are incompatible with free society. They are indeed law protecting everyone's freedom equally.

Arresting people for expressing or criticising ideas on e.g. Facebook absolutely is incompatible with free society, as sanctioning free speech because of other people's feelings about that topic being discussed when there is no danger to person or property.

summer interesting that you seem to be using the term "liberal" in a negative way. What's wrong with being liberal?

@skippy67

I'd say I'm very socially liberal and fiscally conservative.

Being liberal at the moment isn't liberalism as I'd describe it at all. It's actually all about control of language and thoughts. A rush to be woke.

I miss freedom of thought and the ability to question others without fear of offending them.

I'm intrigued as to how you think my use of liberal was negative.

summer
Like you I am also socially liberal. I also feel quite uncomfortable with the increasing approach of wannabe liberals no platforming speakers. It unsettles me. If rather have the view aired, debated, challenged and rebuked (as long as the view isn't inciting people to break the law). The approach on university campuses and other areas of society seems to be we want lots of debate but only within a narrow sphere that us liberal self proclaimed intellectuals have decided are the acceptable parameters for debate. If any of you disagree with us then that proves you are bigoted.

@Benandhollysmum
People of colour say derogatory things about red hair!
Really? So not true

@summerFruitPudding
Yes such a shame you can’t be openly racist like in the good old days!
Move to USA as due to Trump being racist is de rigour...

No, you cannot have total freedom of speech.

What do you think the penalty should be for someone saying "is it your time of month" then OP? Will a caution do or do you want some sort of jail sentence?

OP it may not be 'right' to ask a woman to go make you a coffee, and it can be reported to HR and disciplined accordingly, but to make it a criminal offence is a different matter.

Also 'you need to protect minorities' - women are not a minority and it comes across as condescending to suggest that women or any of the other groups you mention need protection in case they suffer the unimaginable horror of being offended.

Of course the laws re not inciting hatred are there for a reason, as are discrimination laws, but these are not based on the fact that offence might be caused - no one has the right to not be offended.

As per the famous quote 'I disagree with what you say, but I defend to the death your right to say it' we need to separate the fact that words may upset people from the fact that restricting speech has potentially far more serious consequences for society as a whole.

And to the poster who says 'what's wrong with being liberal' - nothing at all, but if you google the definition of liberal you get '.
willing to respect or accept behaviour or opinions different from one's own; open to new ideas' which is the complete opposite of someone who wants to no-platform those who have a different opinion.