to hope that MNetters can help

[macmama73]

PLEASE READ THIS

inhumane treatment at detention centre ,

I am new here on MN, so I hope I am not committing a cardinal sin here but I have noticed that the AIBU threads are the ones that get commented on most often. So perhaps there are some of you who have not noticed this thread.

I am so angry that people are treated like dirt in this country.
That a mother can be separated from her children, one of whom a newborn that she was still breastfeeding.
That she would be denied access to a breast pump and a shower.
That, when her children were returned to her, she was not allowed to give her daughter medication to treat eczema, unless she needed it during "office hours".

That, even now she has is unsure if she can stay in this country. She could be deported at anytime.

Please read the thread then email your MP, the PM, anyone you can think of. Why is this such a nonstory, that none of the papers are reporting it, except the initial article in the Guardian. Please help!

I am utterly ashamed to live in this country.

whilst it is unfortunate that this woman has been through all you have described it is essential to the stability of this country that ANY immigrant who arrives at th countires borders without prior paperwork being filed properly is detained until full checks can be made.

I am sure that she feels it unpleasant but if she is genuinly fleeing persecution then discomfort whilst knowing you are safe must be preferable.

i also do not feel this same topic of discussion needs to be plastered all over the forum. place it in a particular topic and it will be seen by those who choose to view it. it is not on to force this issue down people's necks

There's already a separate thread on this. Why post links all over MN?
It's really annoying.

This is not about the fact that she is in a detention centre, it is about the conditions in the detention centre.

And I don't agree that being thrown out of your temporary housing when heavily pregnant is a definiton of "safe".

I am not plastering it all over MN, it was a bit of unfortunate xposting that I posted this just after someone else had the same idea.

FGS!

to be honest i feel that she is an adult who will nto be being beaten/raped/murdered whilst living in the UK. even if her children were placed in social care then they too wouild have been cared for in a much greater way than they may possibly have had in their native country.

she is alive. if her own country was so terrible that she had to bring a newborn baby in a truck for however many hours to a country she had no legal right to be in and after travelling through various other "safe" countries then i would imagine she is pretty gratefull to be here.

im sorry but i have no regret over the way immigrants are treated, if their stories of abuse and torture are true then a Uk detention centre would be heavan by comparison.

so, it doesn't bother you that she wasn't allowed to express milk for her baby?
that she was given one sanitary towel a day for post-partum bleeding?

I don't know the ins and outs of the case. I'm less concerned about the woman though (terrible though it sounds) than I am about the children, particularly the baby. If that woman's breastmilk supply has been badly affected by the separation then she has effectively been forced into a situation where she will have to buy formula in her home country. Which as we all know costs an absolute fortune for those poor people. That baby could die of malnutrition thanks to our Government. Unless, of course, they plan on sending the woman back and keeping the children here?

i am not saying that her treatment is ideal. i also agree that there is a lot that can be done to improve the facilities in such centres...BUT in her own country she would probably have gone without even that.

maybe if the message gets back to the middle eastern countries that the UK is not such a soft touch we wouldn't have so many ilegal entrants, meaning there would be a larger pot for those who are genuine asylum seekers to borrow from.

What about the baby though?

Mamazon, she'd been living in this country since the age of 14. She wasn't detained trying to enter the country. She was detained prior to deportation after her asylum claim was rejected. The ins and outs of that are not for me to judge but whether you agree with the deportation or not it could have been carried out in a more humane manner.

The conditions in prisons dont seem to put enough people off offending (given the current prison population).

I have heard it said that you could judge a society by how it treats it's prisoners. I think that is a valid point. We are talking about human beings here.

And more to the point she hasn't broken any criminal law - she is just a detainee. We should treat such people with dignity and humanity a the very least.

Her child is surely even more of an innocent.

I could rant.

I will not

Mamazon, where do you get your information from re Middle Eastern countries?

^Africa and Asia between them host over 70% of the world?s refugees while 41 per cent of all applications in 2005 were from African nationals, 27 per cent
were from Asian nationals, 22 per cent were from nationals of the Middle East and 7 per
cent were from European nationals.^(www.homeoffice.gov.uk/rds/pdfs06/hosb1406.pdf)

also,

The UK is home to just 3% of nearly 9.2 million refugees world-wide. Two thirds of the world?s refugees are living in developing countries, often in refugee camps. Europe looks after just 22%. In 2005, the UK ranked 14th in the league table of EU countries for the number of asylum applications per head of population.(refugee council).

Having said that I do agree about the way this post has been 'posted'. Whoever initially posted it has not done the victim or asylum seekers any favours as the 'in your face' method has actually irritated ignorant 'DAILY M**L readers' who have no idea of the who,why and wheres of GENUINE asylum seekers.

i dont think i meant middle eastern -I actually wondered whether i had typed that last night in bed, i had hoped i hadn't. it was late and i had a toothache so brain was not fully fundtional.

I do not read the daily mail, have worked with countless asylum seekers, illegal entrants and young girls who have been bought over legally purely to be told they are illegal so that they can be forced into the sex industry.

i am not ignorant (though i was tired) and i do hate the assumption that anyone who feels the country has very lax immigration policies and that asylum seekers (genuine or not) pass through many other "safe" countries i order to get to the uk simply because we are a well documented soft touch prove this, end up being called ignorant or racist.

I am sure i could visit the governments immigration website and do some copy and paste as well, but frankly i can't be bothered. i gave my opinion if it does not match your then hey ho, thats life.

My understanding is that the children were born here. This woman has been in the UK since she was 14. Her asylum claim took a long time to process and was rejected several years later. This does not mean that it wasn't genuine - there is plenty of evidence of what Amnesty International has called 'a culture of disbelief' in the immigration service. I have a good friend who was initially denied asylum despite strong evidence of abuse and only granted leave to remain on appeal because she was lucky enough to meet someone who got her a good lawyer.

Once asylum is refused asylum seekers are denied any state support. At this point the woman in this case was evicted and denied any support for her and her children. She was found wondering and upset and taken into police custody - seperate from her children before being transfered to a detention centre.

Even if you believe this woman should have been detained there is absolutely no excuse for the conditions in detention centres in the UK. Refusing to give a breast feeding woman a breast pump when she was seperated from her baby (even when one was brought in for her), only giving her one sanitary towel a day when she was still bleeding post birth, refusing to allow her to feed her older child outside set mealtimes is pointlessly cruel. Frankly if I had been raped and fled my home and family only to be seperated from my children I wouldn't think 'oh well things could be worse at least I'm not still being raped'

Our treatment of asylum seekers in this country makes me deeply ashamed.

I've just breezed on to this thread, but I occasionally read the Daily Mail, which makes me an ignorant bastard, so I'll just breeze off again.

Cut and paste wasn't all directed at you Mamazon, just the middle eastern bit.

Yes we can all cut and paste, similarly we are all entitled to an opinion. However why not base our opinion on fact?

Desiderata, I don't recall calling Daily Mail readers bastards! Ignorant, yes, as I was when I used to read it (still do sometimes) until my job brought me into contact with genuine asylum seekers and I got hold of government and local council statistics.

At the same time I also have come across illegal/fake asylum seekers who have made my blood boil with their cheek. These are the people newspapers write about and that is why very few of us know or understand what genuine a/seekers have had to endure.

Again, because of what I've said I feel the original OP has not helped her cause as much as she would have liked.