To avoid seeing friend with our children?

[munchcrunchbunch]

I have an old friend (20 year friendship). Her children are 6 and 4, I have a just 2 year old and another one on the way.

We have grown apart a little since I had my son, mostly because he was a really difficult baby (various medical issues) which meant we didn't get out much at all in his first year and the only time she'd really have to see me (as she works part time) was one day in the week that she was off work where she'd organise almost a kids group at her house with 4/5 other mums who I know some really well and some not. I went along to this a few times but to be honest found it completely overwhelming. There were usually around 12 children aged between babies and 7 in a small 3 bed house (just for context not being rude saying small) and it was just utter chaos. I struggled a lot with anxiety - which is very unlike me - and it was just one more thing that left me feeling stressed so I stopped going but still kept in regular touch. I invited her here at weekends/out for drinks in the evening etc but she couldn't often make it. She has literally not been to my house once since she came to meet DS when he was born.

Times moved on a bit, hers are more school aged now as are some of the older children who used to go. My son is a bit older too, so it's easier to just let him join in the playing and I go to this meet up maybe once or twice a month. It's still pretty chaotic but I'm much better than I was too so I can handle it better. It's nice to catch up with people and it's been lovely to see my friend more.

Recently as it's school holidays obviously it's gotten much busier again. Also, her children have changed. They are just wild and the eldest (6) persistently keeps trying to teach the little ones to swear - words like 'fuck' and 'dickface' not your normal 'say poobum he he he' like you'd expect and shrug off. I'm not overly precious and I know he will one day swear but DS is at the stage of repeating everything and I really don't want my two year old coming out with language like that.

They both hit, throw things, run absolutely riot (like running along backs of sofas and leaping off all the time) and pay no attention to my friend telling them no. She doesn't tell them off much, just says 'don't do that' until she then loses her rag then roars at them.

I just don't enjoy that environment and nor does DS so I've made my excuses not to go this week.

Problem is she seems to have picked up on it and is asking why I'm not coming now it's the holidays. I can tell she's pissed off and it's probably quite obvious why I haven't gone.

To be honest, going forwards I'd quite happily only see her with no children (mine included - I love a bit of adult time especially when I can have a chilled out natter and a glass of wine somewhere nice!). I'm not a massive fan of the way she parents, the way her children behave or the way she seems to have appointed herself as the place we all must go to meet once a week because it suits her. But I do love her, she's an old friend and I would really hate to lose her friendship entirely.

How do I deal with this? Do I just need to cut my losses and wave goodbye?

Also before anyone jumps on me saying 'perhaps the children have SEN, thats why they behave like that' they don't. They absolutely, definitely don't.

Could you not just say it’s too much for your DS with all the big kids? As a kind of half truth? You definitely can’t say anything about her children if you want to keep the friendship.

Have you tried suggesting an adult only meet up, or a smaller get together with less kids around?

Maybe if you phrased it along the lines of “I love seeing you, but I don’t really get a chance to talk to you properly when there’s so many other people there” then she’d at least be less pissed off about you not going to these get togethers in the school holidays, even if she can’t manage any adult meet ups.

I know, I wouldn't dream of saying anything about her kids to her. I wouldn't want to hurt her feelings.

I have tried to say before how nice it'd be to just meet up a couple of us but she's always too busy. It's like she's got this slot for socialising on this particular day so she invites everyone she wants to see to her and that's the only time she can do.

Just tell her it’s too hyper with the extra children through the holidays.

Or that you are finding it too much with you being pregnant.

Adults only meet ups do happen occasionally, sometimes four of us will go for dinner or drinks. Usually around a birthday.

It's maybe two or three a year though - lovely but not really enough to sustain a friendship.

Personally if she’s pushing for an answer I’d be honest.

I’d just say X was too rough for my DC. As he’s much younger he can’t cope with hitting etc.

I’d also say that I was uncomfortable with the language being used.

Could you not just say it’s too much for your DS with all the big kids? As a kind of half truth? You definitely can’t say anything about her children if you want to keep the friendship.

Yep this, tell her you would really love a break from kids in general though and you should meet for lunch/dinner/coffee etc

Say you would love a child free catch up, you can't relax with so many little ones around and being pregnant you would love a little break!

If she's already pissed off at you not going to these get-togethers as often as you used to, she'll probably find something to take offence at regardless of how you phrase your reasoning, so I wouldn't worry too much about how you raise it. If she's not willing to compromise by meeting up just with you now and then on neutral territory, there isn't much you can do. It needn't be a weekly or even a monthly thing, but if she values your friendship as much as you do she will be able to find some time. Even if it's just you and she and your respective kids going to a cafe somewhere, at least it won't be as much of a circus as this huge get-together at her place. Sounds like the friendship would benefit from some quality time together.

I suppose if I think about it over the years since we've had children she never ever sees any of our friendship group one on one unless it's specifically a child centred meet up at an event for example: She only really seems to socialise in a big group now. Possibly time constraints (she works part time) or possibly that's how she prefers it.

There are four of us who've been friends since we were maybe about 12 and I see the other two individually, together and sometimes (not that often, and one more than the other as she's a SAHM like me) with our kids. But their kids are fine, mostly older than mine except for two babies but generally nice to be around. Misbehave sometimes - as does mine, he can throw a wobbler with the best of them - but it gets sorted appropriately. Seeing them never feels like a free for all like it does with the big group get together.

I'm going to try and organise an adults only dinner before my baby comes in the next two months - should be enough notice to try to get it sorted!

It can be very difficult when old friends (or family) have very different parenting styles to your own.

I find that is comes and goes though. One close friend’s children were extraordinarily difficult up until they were about 8 yo but have significantly calmed down now.

Similarly another friend’s children were fine when they were young but are now stroppy preteens. I’m sure they’ll be delightful again in a few years.

I think it’s a good idea to always try to have a mixture of child and child free visits. It helps maintain the relationship even when getting together with kids is difficult.

After all your own children might not always be as completely lovely to others as they are now.

God it sounds dreadful. I had a friend who would try and shoehorn a large number of people with their children into an afternoon at hers. You couldn’t relax and chat, there was always a child butting in or someone needing refereeing. I told her prefer smaller numbers and that’s what we do now.

You can't relax and chat @Jillyjollyjandy . It's chaos. To be honest even when the children are behaving beautifully it's mad.

I suppose I just don't love big groups. I feel like I take DS to playgroups and toddler groups in big halls where he can socialise with loads of other kids around his own age and I can make passing small talk with other mums. I'd rather be able to have a proper conversation with my actual friends!

Blame the heat, being pregnant, dc being overwhelmed by older kids - all valid in themselves as reasons.

Also say you're suffering from ante natal anxiety on of everything and that could do some from her, one on one see what says...