Aibu at people expecting students to work for free

[aryto]

I've just graduated from a prestigious university in London and to be honest I'm crippled with debt, I know it was my decision to incur these costs but I am fed up with receiving emails from people wanting to use my (hard earned) skills for free and it then being dressed up as an "amazing opportunity". On a daily basis, my department is forwarding emails from people expecting to utilise my skills and I've had enough of these freeloaders. (I've volunteered and interned for a number of organisations and see the value in doing so but some of the requests are quite frankly bullshit).

@Walkingdeadfangirl obviously I'm not insulted at a few spam emails but the implications they have. These people are screwing people over, personally, I don't think that is trivial.

YANBU but it is the culture in this country that your employer is doing you a massive favour by employing you (rather than needing the skills you provide - and even students/teens have skills to bring to the workplace).

eg this comment

Many students are grateful for the opportunity to get some work experience because the market is saturated with graduates

Unpaid internships are rubbish and paying people under 21 (or is it 25) less than the minimum wage is rubbish too.

Sadly with Brexit this can only get worse as the first thing that will happen on March 30th will be a Bill brought forward to reduce employment rights. It's the main reason so many Tory MPs want us out of the EU because they hate having to treat employees/workers properly. If you don't believe me look at the record of the Coalition government - the first thing they did was to increase the period you have to be employed to claim unfair dismissal. And that was with the Libdems in government too.

And the debt thing is a red herring. People take out loans to study which do need to be repaid - it's not just tuition fees. Anyway why on earth shouldn't you be paid if you are working?

insulted by*

Well, OP, if you have not secured a job via your internships (pleny do) and you do not have a job, technically you do not have any debt! You will only pay a graduate tax when you earn over a certain amount. If you never earn a decent amount - no debt! You are certanly not crippled with it in your position because you are paying £0. Look on the bright side and get your facts right.

Rather than getting annoyed about silly adverts which are irrelevant to your career, why don't you spend more time in actuallly getting the job you need? Everyone knows London is mega expensive. You do not have to stay there if you cannot afford it. What is the field of work you are looking for? Can you not go elsewhere?

The loans do NOT need to be repaid if you do not earn the relevant amount. If you were a stay at home mum, or worked part time, you would pay next to nothing or nothing.

Contact your students union and suggest they advise departments to stop advertising unpaid roles (except when explicitly volunteering roles). Things will only change if the companies who aren't willing to pay get frozen out and nobody applies for their bullshit schemes

Good advice. I like it. Sadly, the companies will probably continue to advertise via other universities, but I hope it might make them reconsider their approach

Reminds me of this story
www.theguardian.com/business/2016/may/13/sainsburys-apologises-ad-seeking-artist-revamp-canteen-for-free

Expecting people to work unpaid for any length of time (I would say longer than a week) is damaging to the entire employment market, ie all of us. Employers won't offer decent pay if they can get people to work for free because contemporary culture says that's what people 'should' be prepared to do. I don't think this is a silly or trivial concern. And I bet those posting that it is don't work for nothing.

Everyone’s talking about loans being the only debt but please bear in mind a lot of students rely on an overdraft to help, it’s often a zero interest rate as a student but pops up quite quickly - so there are other types of debt.

@BubblesBuddy excuse me you have no idea what you're talking about. I'll be starting a graduate scheme for one of the biggest multinational companies in the world in September (thank God). I'm complaining because I have plenty of friends who are basically unemployable because they weren't able to work for free. Why should we accept this?

My loans extend beyond tuition fees massively (overdraft etc).

Well, OP, if you have not secured a job via your internships (pleny do) and you do not have a job, technically you do not have any debt! You will only pay a graduate tax when you earn over a certain amount. If you never earn a decent amount - no debt! You are certanly not crippled with it in your position because you are paying £0. Look on the bright side and get your facts right

How rude.

And how simplistic to think that everyone gets enough student finance to live on. The student loan offer my son has received doesn't even cover his rent in halls. If I weren't willing to top it up and help with living costs until he gets there and finds a job he would be in debt in the first term of a 4 yr course.

Read her responses again, Bubbles. She has debt in addition to the regular student loans.

I’m a big fan of student internships / work experience but I believe they should be during the degree and for course credit and not excessive hours. I ensure my masters student interns can always maintain their part time paying jobs during placements.

Reading university have a policy on internships - ask to see your university’s policy

www.reading.ac.uk/web/files/cqsd/University_statement_on_unpaid_Student_Internships.pdf

There is some evidence that taking unpaid internships has a negative effect on your salary

www.theguardian.com/money/2017/jul/29/unpaid-intern-damage-graduate-career-pay

museumum
I agree. Sandwich years/terms with a proper stipend would be a great way into careers.

I am confused. If the jobs are worthless to your career or CV and are unpaid, why would any one do them? You cant be forced to do it when you find out its not as advertised? And if people dont take the jobs, then employers will be forced to pay a wage.

Or the internship is worth something to your career and CV and it is worth doing. Your obviously not working at the moment so why not build up your CV?

Or the internship is worth something to your career and CV and it is worth doing. Your obviously not working at the moment so why not build up your CV?
If the job is enough to warrant an intern, It's enough of a job to pay a wage or a reasonable stipend.

Why should anyone be working for free? It allows certain industries to exploit students and graduates, whilst acting as a gatekeeper to the professions as it is ensuring that the only people who get their foot in can afford extensive unpaid work.

The idea that people should be so grateful for a job they work for free is bizarre

It's like placement for HCP courses. A lot of people in my class dropped out because they couldn't afford not to work whilst doing full time hours in a hospital unpaid.

Same for us as part of teacher training, but the placements for HCP, teachers and social workers are part of courses which enable a student to qualify. As a full time course the placement elements are reasonable (even if financially tough, but that is part and parcel of opting to retrain/doing a course with mandatory professional placements).

They are also not doing someone else's job. They are generally shadowing someone so a trainee teacher on placement gets my class but I'm on hand and I'm accountable. A trainee nurse or speech therapist (to my knowledge) is working alongside a team of nurses, not making the ward or clinic a viable clinic.

These unpaid internships are often being runners, copy editing, running social media, being an admin assistant etc which are jobs someone should be paid to do. Companies are using unpaid interns as a way to avoid having to pay a wage and then spin it as an amazing opportunity graduates should be grateful for.