Sharing cost of childcare

[whenskiesaregreyRETURNS]

Quick background - DH and I are separated. Generally amicable although we've fell out a couple of times recently. But, they are out of the norm. Usually, will go out with the kids as a family, will still get kids joint presents and generally a pretty good arrangement. Recently watched some of the world cup together, sorted kids parties together for birthdays, wrapped the presents together with a bottle of wine. No animosity etc. Haven't gone down the child maintenance route as we've sort of agreed our own terms. I moved out of the family home 2.5 years ago and I am now in rented. I work full time but my wages are such that I am supplemented by TC, WTC and HB. So, basically, they're shite! DH gets no support in that sense but his son (from first marriage, wife died, son is 26, works full time) pays rent. I imagine this covers the mortgage (which, incidentally, is less than my rent). I have the kids Monday - Saturday morning and he has them Saturday night, Sunday and takes them to school Monday.

Stick with me.

So, we agreed that he would pay for most extra curricular stuff, including the breakfast and after school club. He also pays for school dinners. That's his financial contribution and amounts to about £300 a month in total. I'd say that's about 10% of his monthly income. I have asked him if, during the summer weeks, as he won't be paying for any after school clubs, no gymnastics, no wrap around care and no school dinners, would he be willing to give me some money to cover the extra food shopping and 'entertaining the kids' money. He said no. He said that's what my child benefit is for and he was hoping to have a month where he had a bit more money. He has recently had to pay out for his car and was hoping to use this month to 'recover'. He took them abroad in May and said that he had to pay for that, so it's unfair that I then ask for money to do things with the kids without him during the summer.

My points were that I don't get to choose when the holidays are. I'm not taking them abroad. I'm talking about the extra meals and living costs etc. I don't have the extra. The fact that I work term time (and therefore earn less) means that we don't have to pay child care costs. I genuinely don't know if I am be unreasonable to ask for him to contribute for some of the summer holidays. It is for the kids, not me.

AIBU?

CMS. No brainer.

That is all.

In what sense? In terms of the immediate issue though?

He should be paying you £450 a month cash, 12 months a year.

I would say cms too, but do a calculation first to see how much better of you will be. Would you be entitled to extra tax credits to cover childcare?

Just to add, I know going down an official route would be more financially beneficial. However, for the sake of our friendship and not wanting to make things clinical, this unofficial relationship has worked.

For context, he got a new job which had a company car. My car was about to give up, so he gave me his car as he no longer needed it. It had a value of £4k. I then scrapped my car. 12 months later he got a new job with no car. Offered to buy 'his' car back off me. Gave me £3k, which considering it was his to begin with, I thought was a very amicable agreement. That's the kind of (usually) reasonable agreement we have. When I moved out, he paid for a new washer, dryer and fridge for me.

More curious as to whether IABU to ask for a contribution for the summer.

I have Aspergers so I genuinely am unsure in a lot of social interactions like this!

I wouldn’t go down the official route. You have a good arrangement as it is. You can’t put a price on that.
Could he have kids to stay with him a bit more in the holidays?

Surely it’s now time to proceed with a divorce and set up formal financial arrangements? You should both be entitled to a fair share of the house, pension pots etc. Was his car a marital asset? If so it was half yours anyway.

He sees his money as his to keep or spend on himself or dole out benevolently as he sees fit, whereas he sees responsibility for providing for the children on a daily basis as your responsibility. The chumminess and cash on his terms leave you afraid to upset the applecart. The unofficial arrangement has worked for him- he gets to keep far more money than he otherwise would, and he gets to splash the Disney Dad cash while you do the hard yards. Three grand net per month is a very significant income.

Was the house jointly owned? He is paying less on mortgage than you are on rent, while you claim benefits to support his children. He needs to pay you the CMS minimum, whether it's through them or not, and a decent man would pay whatever he could to support his children

He earns £3000 a month and his son pays the mortgage, he's making a fool of you

He sold his house which contributed about 80% of the value of the joint property we owned. I know I don't have a property now, but I didn't have one to begin with. I want to be fair.

So, am I right in assuming these responses mean that I wasn't being unreasonable with me asking him?

Op you say this unofficial relationship has worked. Up to now. For both of you. He gets to contribute way less than he should, you're ok with that as you can both be amicable.

Now it isn't working for you. Or your kids. He thinks it's ok to contribute even less and you're going to struggle even more.

CMS can figure out the sums for you and you can still choose to do it amicably, for example you could agree that he contributes less in a sticky month or if he does something like buy a new fridge for you.

He SHOULD be contributing the minimum that the CMS calculate. Tax credits and cm is on top of that.

So yes, ask him - tell him - that he should contribute to his kids over the summer. Then call the CMS to get a real idea of exactly how much that should be.

You should also get the ball rolling for the divorce and financial settlement- remember the car and house and savings are still joint assets!

YANBU - school holidays are expensive! However the other things that you have explained, like the car, suggest that he has been more than fair in the past so I can see your dilemma! A PP suggested that he has them more over the holidays - is that possible?

In divorce the starting point is 50:50 if you've been married more than s few years and have kids.

This means you are probably entitled to half the house value.

Obviously the moment you get advice and start talking financial settlements he's not going to be so chummy, But are you going to sacrifice yours and your children's financial stability to keep him happy?

And no you weren't being unreasonable about some help over the summer. He's being selfish and only thinking about his pockets not his children

This man is taking advantage of your good nature. He knows full well you're entitled to half the equity in the home (regardless of who contributed more to the purchase- marital assets and all that) and he's happy for you to live in rented accommodation with a tough six weeks ahead so long as he can fix his car.

You've tried the unofficial way and it's not worked- time to see a solicitor.

He knows full well you're entitled to half the equity in the home (regardless of who contributed more to the purchase- marital assets and all that)

That depends on how the property was held in joint names. However it is definitely something the OP should take advice on.

OP - it is worth calculating how much you would get via the CMS and if it would be worth your while. We do maintenance etc ourselves so I understand totally about you wanting to keep it amicable.

The CMS calculation is the absolute minimum you should expect you shouldn't feel guilty asking for that and he shouldn't think its too much. Often it's too little and a good parent with a decent job and disposable income shouldn't begrudge going over this especially in the holidays

The problem with an 'amicable' arrangement like this, is that you are beholden to him and what he believes is a reasonable expense. Is he usually controlling, because this sounds like a way of controlling you and your finances.

You have two options:

1. asking for the CMS amount, and asking for this to be enforced if he refuses to pay it. You would get more money and not be controlled, however you believe it may jeopardise your friendship
2. Continuing as is. You say that you cannot afford this in the holidays. You could appeal to him once again, and offer the option of 1) instead to him.

The house was joint owned, but he remortgaged it in his own name and gave me £3k from that, which I used as a rent deposit and to buy things such as kids' beds etc. I know I could officially push for more but the reality is that would probably mean he'd have to move out and that would impact on the kids. At the moment, we live very close and it works for kids school, drop-off etc. Ultimately, the arrangement does work and is usually reasonable. Was taken aback a little at his response tbh. Expected him to say yes. Possibly the fact that it has just been the kids' birthdays within two weeks of each other has affected his response, but we split the expenditure on this 50:50. He has also just paid for DS to go to Ireland with cubs, but the arrangement was that he did that and I bought all the equipment (kit, sleeping bag etc) which I still have to buy.