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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

To think 70mph is an acceptable speed in any motorway lane?

272 replies

AvocadosBeforeMortgages · 17/06/2018 23:20

Disclaimer: I have only recently started driving on the motorway regularly

Surely whatever lane you're in, 70mph is an acceptable speed to be doing? I keep finding that when I'm in the fast lane (eg when overtaking cars in the middle lane) at 70mph, I find I have someone driving 2 metres behind me in a way that suggests they enjoy causing a pile up. Once I'm able to get back into the middle lane they will rush past at well over 70mph.

Did I miss the memo where the fast lane became part of the German Autobahn?

OP posts:
Yokatsu · 18/06/2018 08:04

Highway code

137.On a two-lane dual carriageway you should stay in the left-hand lane. Use the right-
hand lane for overtaking or turning right. After overtaking, move back to the left-hand
lane when it is safe to do so.
138.On a three-lane dual carriageway, you may use the middle lane or the right-hand lane
to overtake but return to the middle and then the left-hand lane when it is safe.

You may be keeping to the speed limit but if you are sat in the middle or right lane when you aren't overtaking You are still breaking the law

And in a far more dangerous way than speeding, because you are making undertaking likely. In my time in car insurance I have never seen an accident that was caused by speed. The damage may be worse but the accident is always caused by driver either by error or misfortune.

Motorways are some of the safest roads in the country not because of the speed limit but because you can't turn right in them. Turning right a cross a lane of traffic is one of the most dangerous things you do on the road at any speed

auntiebasil · 18/06/2018 08:05

For what it's worth, in an old job I had (not that old) I saw people getting prosecuted for driving at 75.

auntiebasil · 18/06/2018 08:06

On a motorway, I mean.

borlottibeans · 18/06/2018 08:06

If someone is 2m behind you while you're overtaking is it possible you're pulling out without looking and not paying enough attention to the speed other cars are going at? Safe motorway driving involves being aware of other drivers and not giving them the opportunity to cause an accident if their attention wanders for a second, regardless of who's technically in the right.

And if someone is driving like an idiot it's better to let them do that ahead of you where you can keep an eye on them.

drearydeardre · 18/06/2018 08:06

since when is 70 mph 'tootling' Hmm

siwel123 · 18/06/2018 08:07

How is it policing others by following the law yourself?

reeldoop · 18/06/2018 08:08

I also find it hard to believe that you'd ever have much call to overtake in the outside lane if you never exceed 70mph. The advice that comes up on MN to always drive in the inside lane unless overtaking is also ludicrous. Where do you all drive? The outer Hebrides? On the motorways I drive on daily (M25, M3, M4) you rarely are able to drive in the inside lane (unless late at night and its empty) because it is nose to tail lorries doing 58 and nervous drivers doing 60. If you drive at or around the speed limit your opportunity to be in there, unless leaving the motorway, is so transient that its not worth bothering, and not safe imo as you'd constantly be moving in and out, constantly! Which cant be safe and freaks out the nervous types.

Equally, I rarely see people in the outside lane sticking to 70 so opportunities to overtake at that speed must be limited. Righty or wrongly this results in a practical sitiation where people who drive at 70 effectively stay there doing 70 and anyone that wants to drive at the de facto standard of 80, plus the dickheads going faster, weave in and out of them between the middle and outside lanes. Constantly weaving in and out must increase the chance of insidence? Like it or not, legal or not, this is what actually happens, on those motorways at least, and i think new drivers are risking their lives if they dont follow suit, until such time as someone either chnages or enforces the 70 limit.

Yokatsu · 18/06/2018 08:09

And yes we should change the speed limit on motorways because you get idiots that think they can sit in the right hand lane but It's ok because they are within the speed limit and anyone who wants to go faster is breaking the law.

It's not you are also breaking the law in a far more dangerous fashion

BertieBotts · 18/06/2018 08:10

Motorways are the safest because there is a barrier between the sides so effectively it is a road where everybody is going in the same direction. It's nothing to do with going the same speed - there are no roads where people are driving at vastly different speeds, anyway. Rural roads tend to be the most dangerous because of the combination of no barriers between the directions plus speed plus poor visibility in many cases. Overtaking is much safer on motorways as you aren't driving into oncoming traffic.

It doesn't encourage unsafe lane changing to use the right two lanes to overtake - if people only ever changed lanes in order to overtake, then it would actually be much safer. The problem with lane changes is when they are unpredictable, which tends to happen when people dodge between lanes based on where they think they can drive faster, this is a really dangerous practice. Accidents are less likely when you can guess what other drivers are likely to do before they do it, they tend to happen when people are taken by surprise. If proper lane discipline is adhered to then driving behaviour tends to be very predictable.

It would not be safer for all traffic to be evenly split across the lanes for this reason - it might be more efficient, arguably, but not safer. As other people have mentioned, some vehicles are speed limited, such as trucks, horseboxes, and some classic cars. These vehicles should stay in the left lane so that other drivers can overtake them safely.

Europe does have more driving deaths than the UK but most European countries clock up more kilometres on average than the UK too, we're a small country so don't drive as much. When this is accounted for the figures (especially in North/Western Europe) are not massively different - it is Eastern and Southern Europe where the driving deaths are significantly higher despite comparable distances being driven.

Personally I feel very safe on Dutch and German roads in particular. Dutch roads everybody just seems to be really nice and obeys the rules without really quibbling about it, which is very relaxing - possibly a bit too relaxing as Dutch roads are also very long, straight and flat. German drivers have a huge thing about lane discipline (you learn rather quickly never to sit in the outside lane there) but aren't so bothered by speed, of course supported by many motorways having no speed limit, however, this seems to work. (You can still be prosecuted for causing an accident while driving at higher than the recommended speed of ~75mph). France can be a bit hairy as drivers have the tendency to pull out suddenly with no notice, indication, or seemingly any logic. Belgium seems to have an unwritten rule of "if you want there to be a space/higher speed limit, just pretend there is one and act accordingly" which can be a bit alarming. The UK is not terrible but lots of people ignore both speed limits and lane discipline which means you end up with quite a jumble which is confusing and can be frustrating to navigate.

If you want to look you can see road casualties by kilometres driven here (the sorting doesn't seem to work properly) - the UK is in the lowest group but is also joined by the Nordic countries, then you have central Europe not far behind, with Eastern European countries having much higher rates.
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Road_safety_in_Europe

PolkerrisBeach · 18/06/2018 08:12

It's policing others if you are aware of drivers who wish to go faster piling up behind you while you drive at 70mph on the dot, and are unwilling to pull in to let them past because you're in the right, you're doing 70 and 70 is the limit.

It is not your job to do that. You pull in, let people past and hell mend them if there's a cop car a mile up the road which clocks them doing a ton. Doesn't affect you in ANY WAY.

And that is also the very definition of tootling along - being in your own wee world at whatever speed, totally oblivious to everyone else on the road.

Gaspodethetalkingdog · 18/06/2018 08:18

Don’t try high speeds on the southern end of the M3 - smart lanes, speed cameras, average speeds plus a lot of time the traffic is so heavy and slow you can barely do 50

Loonoon · 18/06/2018 08:20

As other people have said, if you aren’t overtaking you should be in the inside lane.

OrchidInTheSun · 18/06/2018 08:21

Brake, not break. So ashamed Blush

Missingstreetlife · 18/06/2018 08:21

The outside lane is only for overtaking, but if traffic is moving slowly in middle lane you can be overtaking all the time! I always move over for anyone to overtake me, you should not hog any lane. Those tailgaters are scary and v dangerous.

IIIustriousIyIIlogical · 18/06/2018 08:23

I bang along on the motorways at an indicated 75mph on my speedo, which is 70mpd real speed (as indicated by my GPS).

It's the idiots that sit in the outside lane at 65mph (indicated 70) that are a hazard.

If you've completed your overtaking, get back into the left hand lane so other people can get past.

You're not the police, it's not up to you to try & "traffic calm" by doddering around in the wrong lanes. Leave that to the professionals (or their cameras).

Yokatsu · 18/06/2018 08:24

See I like the German system very much.

70 can be a dangerous speed to travel at if generally the motorway traffic is travelling at 60 (weather conditions ,volume of traffic etc) . But actually 70 can also be a dangerous speed if the rest of the motorway is driving at 80-90. For me it's far more important that your behaviour is predictable to other drivers and you don't driver in a way that means another driver has to alter their behaviour unexpectedly.

In an "empty" motorway you are no more likely to have an accident driving at 90 that 60.

frumpety · 18/06/2018 08:26

It may be that ABS has a factor in reducing that length, due to improved friction, however the human in charge of the vehicle is the one who is going to be applying the brakes, having had a quick look it would appear that the average stopping time ( which includes driver thinking time ) is going to be about 5 seconds in good weather conditions, and you are travelling at 105 feet per second at 70 mph. You may have the reflexes of a cat , but what about the person behind you who is less than 2 metres from your rear bumper ?

drearydeardre · 18/06/2018 08:27

And that is also the very definition of tootling along - being in your own wee world at whatever speed, totally oblivious to everyone else on the road.
BUT the OP was not tootling in that sense - she pulled out to overtake slower moving traffic and moves back in again - it is a tad insulting and arrogant to accuse her of being oblivious.
The speed limit on a motorway is 70 mph - if one is 'tootling' at that speed - there could be 3 lanes going the same speed and no-one is oblivious to anyone else.
Time for driverless cars and removal of twats who think like that from the road. Hmm

kamilahbobo · 18/06/2018 08:28

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alreadytaken · 18/06/2018 08:34

the ignorance on this thread is amazing.

You dont have the right to exceed the speed limit when overtaking.

Car safety has improved, drivers reaction times do not improve.

Serious injuries on motorways are actually increasing, although deaths are not.

If you regularly exceed the speed limits you can expect to suffer for it, even if it is just the higher insurance premiums. Speed cameras are increasingly common and the introduction of more average speed monitoring means more of us will have to slow down.

ScrubTheDecks · 18/06/2018 08:34

OP, before you pull out check the speed of the car coming up in the outside lane. If it is travelling faster than the speed you will be overtaking at then you will be causing them to either slow down or bunch up behind you. If you are overtaking a long line of 65mph middle laners, and the outside lane ahead is clear, pull in and let the faster drivers go past you.

Yokatsu · 18/06/2018 08:37

she pulled out to overtake slower moving traffic and moves back in again - it is a tad insulting and arrogant to accuse her of being oblivious.

But by the op she must be.

Now assuming you take her entirely at face value. She's overtaking the car to the left but the car behind her is behind her and whizzes past her when she pulls back in.

But for a car to be sat on her tail for the minute maybe she is overtaking she must have pulled out without taking into account the speed of the cars in the right hand lane.

Not very aware or safe.

In this case actually the chances are all the cars involved are breaking the highway code. Chances are the OP shouldn't have been overtaking because she was travelling faster than the car in front so unless the car in front was overtaking the car in front should have been in the left hand lane. The OP shouldn't have moved out into the path of a faster moving car. And the car in the outside lane was speeding.

How anyone can justify the OP being in the right simply because she wasn't speeding is a mystery

maxthemartian · 18/06/2018 08:40

This is why driving on French motorways is so pleasant compared to the UK. People actually know how-to drive on them. The use the passing lane for passing, and know what their indicators are for. No wonder they are allowed a higher speed limit.
Maybe it will gradually improve here with the advent of motorway driving lessons as standard.

BreakfastAtSquiffanys · 18/06/2018 08:41

@kamilahbobo

So 90% motorway drivers are twats for you? If 80mph on motorway causes you a panic and anxiety why dont you stick to mobility vehicles and stay on pavements away from people or stick to public transport...road ain't place for pussies

If this is in response to my post (since I used the word twat), I'm perfectly capable of driving on a motorway. But flashing your lights at people because YOU are driving too fast is twattish.
90% of motorway drivers don't do 80 to 90 and flash their lights at people.
Just the twats.

If I'm in the outside lane OVERTAKING someone, don't drive up my arse and tell me to get out of your way.
I'll move left as soon as I can and let you go.

PolkerrisBeach · 18/06/2018 08:42

Further up I said that if the OP was pulling out to overtake, not causing anyone in lane 3 already to brake, then pulling back in that is perfect driving.

The oblivious comment was in response to the passive aggressive drivers who think it's their job to demonstrate what perfect individuals they are by driving at 70mph whatever is going on around them.