To not want to pay my neighbour this much....

[ss2011]

Hiya
Could really with some advice on this. Two and a half years ago we had a really bad leak in my daughters room, which turned out to be holes in our guttering. This was really old style Victorian guttering, set back into the roof and joined on to our neighbours’ guttering (we are a semi). None of the rooferswe asked would touch trying to repair such old guttering and all said it needed to be replaced. We asked the neighbours if they wanted to replace the whole lot...theirs as well...but they didn’t so we had to just do our half and break and block the join with theirs. unfortunately our roofers messed that up, left a hole and they got a leak. We got our roofers back straight away to fix it and said we would pay for the damage. This was 2 and a half years ago. We then heard nothing for ages.
In May 2017 I got a text from my neighbour saying they were now doing the repairs and would send us a quote. They said they were getting 3 quotes and would send them to us before deciding who to go with, so could look at and agree the prices. I chased this a few times but they never sent the quotes. In the meantime they were having lots of building work done, so I think this just slipped off their priority list.
But now , all this time afterwards, we suddenly have a bill from them and it’s massive..........over a grand. This is for patch up inside, replacing a picture rail (don’t understand that bit) and replastering he whole of the affected wall. They got their builders to do it but to itemise a separate bill and it’s just a bit crazy....it’s even charging for duct tape and plastic bags to clear rubbish away (£68 for that). We had to have our leak repaired and it did not cost anywhere near this. Because it’s so long after the event we can’t go back to the original roofer and claim any money now so it’s all on us.
Given that it’s been so long, and we had no chance to see any quotes and the costs look so high , do you think we should just pay the whole thing or whether IABU to just offer to half or two thirds? We do like our neighbours, and don’t want a fued with them....but don’t think they are being very fair and it’s so much money!
If you managed to get to the end of this post, what do you think?

I would tell them it is to late for you to claim against the roofer and to contact their own insurance for advice.

They didn’t provide the three quotes this is the main sticking point for me. I would happily pay for the damage but I would need quotes and a full list of damage with photos.

Absolutely.... The time gap is too large.... Unless you explicitly said... I'll pay any time over the next 15 years!

Other stuff could have happened in the meantime which is not your responsibility.

I'd ask insurers to deal with it... It will hopefully take 5he heat out of the conversations with your neighbours

I would expect them to claim on insurance but I'd offer to pay their excess. It's the whole point of insurance.

If the plaster is damaged, the picture rail would have to come off to allow replastering, so would need reinstating. Most local authorities now charge if you take plaster to the tip, at something like £4 for a small bag - that mounts up for a whole wall. If it's Victorian, then it may have still been lathe and plaster, so replastering would have involved putting up plasterboard and then a skim coat over that. It all adds up. Still seems a lot, so might be worth trying to get estimates from local firms to see what would be reasonable. You'd probably have to pay for this - you can't expect tradespeople to spend time giving you an free estimate with zero prospect of work.

So in an ideal world you would have had photos and 3 quotes and taken this through your insurance or better still through the roofers' insurance. But then your neighbour should have sorted this out 2 years ago.

If this went to small claims court I think the magistrate would say that the neighbours have contributed to the whole problem by waiting so long and then not getting photos and quotes etc. They did nothing to "mitigate their loss" and neither you nor anyone else has any way of testing what is reasonable. I wouldn't offer 2/3rds I'd say half. Basically, they saw you coming.

The law says the neighbour can choose who to use for repairs. You should be shown quotes and send to idiots who botched the repairs. If your roofer messed it up, they should fix it for free, tho.

It is up to your roofers and her insurance. That is the whole point of insurance. Relate it to car insurance - if you ram into the back of someones car and write it off even though it is totally your fault there is no expectation you should pay. And no you shouldn't pay the excess. The size of the excess is her choice, if she has gone for cheaper premiums for a smaller excess or less cover that is her issue not yours.

I know that sounds harsh but these things are swings and roundabouts. And any of us can easily be on either side of the equation.

Thanks everyone for your replies. It seems I have been a bit silly ....as I just had an agreement with the original roofer at the time that I would send him the quotes from my neighbour when I got them and then we would discuss again (he accepted some liability but also blamed the neighbour’s old and dodgy guttering). But I never got any quotes....despite chasing...just a bill 2.5 years later. Looking back I can see now that I should also have discussed wifh my insurers. A couple of people asked if we saw the neighbours damage ....we did see it at the time and it didn’t look nearly as bad as the “before” photos they have sent us taken in 2018 over two years later ....so possibly it did get worse cos of being left so long...though water can track through over time. The biggest part of the quote is labour which is for 24 hours....this seems loads to us . I have asked them for their original three quotes (which they promised us at the time) and if they provide these back up the bill then we will pay it in full. Otherwise I think we will make them an offer for what we think is fair.... thanks everyone.

A neighbour had a similar issue, with water coming in from joint guttering with their neighbour. The guttering was fixed very quickly, so no more water got in.

The internal damage, however, was left to sit for nearly 24 months - as neighbour couldn't be bothered getting quotes and having it sorted. When she finally did get around to getting quotes as she wanted to take in a lodger using that room, the neighbour's insurance refused to pay for more than an estimated value of the original damage.

The argument/law the insurer based this on was that the delay in rectifying the situation (ie repairs not done in a timely manner), resulted in compounded damage (it spread throughout the wall and down into the flooring, impacted on the wiring, grew mould, etc).

The insurer, therefore, only paid the amount they estimated as the original damage repair cost - not the total amount for the repair as determined 2 years later.

I think I'd offer to pay whatever an original quote estimated from the time of the damage (or what a builder you ask estimates it may have been at the time). I would not pay over £1000 several years after the event (especially as they have had other work done by the same builder).

I would give your neighbours the roofers details. They should have insurance to cover things like this.
If the neighbours have caused further damage by not sorting it sooner and allowing the leak to get worse then they may be negligent for this.

Insurance companies will be dealing with this every day so will know what is reasonable costs, timescales, etc.

I don't think either your or your neighbour's insurance company will want to pay out anything as the damage is entirely caused by the lack of maintenance to the property.

However, your builder will have his own insurance for just this sort of incident where he has damaged someone's property accidentally.

If you are satisfied that you made every attempt to sort out the matter with the neighbours at the time, and the neighbours are aware that the builder admitted his partial liability at the time, I don't see any reason for you to pay anything or be involved in the matter at all after 2 1/2 years. Your neighbours should be dealing with the builder and his insurance company directly.

So they chose to not update their guttering in a timely manner and chose to live with a leak.......now years later they want you to pay for it all to be updated?

They're making a mug out of you.

then we will pay it in full. Otherwise I think we will make them an offer for what we think is fair. It sounds like you are paying as you don’t want to upset / fall out with them.
They don’t seem to be thinking the same about you.
Most people would be mortified asking their neighbour for money YEARS later.
You sound lovely, don’t let them take advantage of you.

They should claim on their insurance, this all happened years ago.

Their fault for letting it drag on.

Kardashian is right, they don't care about you.

Had they have either (a) fixed it when you had yours fixed or even (b) taken you up in a timely manner, the amount of damage they are now paying for would have been far, far less.

Say to them that you’ll make a contribution, but that they have neglected the repair themselves and you’re not responsible for anything caused over the last 2 years.

What would they have done if you had just decided to move house?

Good luck, please let us know if it ever makes Judge Rinder.

Reply saying that they were to provide 3 quotes 2.5 years ago so can you have them now, along with photos if damage taken at the time of leak & you'll get back to them

Chances are they decided to get it fixed as part of bigger renovations & thought you'd sub the cost by £1k

Sorry not had chance to read all replies, but I’d argue if the damage was so bad to warrant over a grand in repairs, why have they waited 3 years to repair it?
I think they’re trying to make more money off you to cover their other work. I wouldn't pay.
You did agree that you could chose a quote before the work started and they’ve not given you this opportunity so they’ve already broken their verbal contract.

Get your own builders in to quote for the work. Go with them to understand exactly what your neighbours are asking them to do. You do need to repair any damage, but you should mitigate cost of course and this ensures you have full knowledge

Their insurer should either pay or contact your roofers insurer. Nothing to do with you personally.

^This. Also why has it taken them 2.5 years to sort this out? I think they have got their builder to give you an inflated invoice to covers works they are already doing.

Nope, I wouldn't be paying this. Two and a half years is a ridiculous time to wait to have it repaired. If they were able to wait that long then it probably didn't really need doing. You have no way of knowing if the damage was worsened by them not having it repaired for so long. I'd also look into whether you are fully responsible for the guttering. Often in attached properties roof and gutterings etc are treated as communal even if on the other side, as not repairing them can affect the whole building.

I'd explain that you're not comfortable paying that amount this long after the incident and that you'd prefer it was handled through insurance companies. If it's too late for you to claim it back from the roofer, why is it not too late for them to claim it back off you?

For £68 I'm not sure it's worth the trickle

Good point by someone uothread.... What if you had moved out in meantime...

And
You're wanting to avoid bad feeling.... But it seems this isn't mutual....

I think trying to hang costs of over 1k almost 3years post the original incident is cheeky fuckery...... They're trying it on