School has puppy, not a great idea

[Rainbowtrees]

www.thecomet.net/news/longmeadow-primary-school-in-stevenage-employs-therapy-labrador-murphy-1-5556930

A local school has a puppy. It’s a lovely idea yet puppies are far from calming! They are crazy, cute little bundles of fun - they can go from adorable to little devils in seconds especially when over stimulated.

AIBU to think a puppy in a school is not a good idea? A dog over 1 who is known to be calm, has been tested with children and can cope with a busy environment yes a young puppy no way!

Because it's incredibly easy to get caught out and teachers are busy.

Would a reputable breeder even give a puppy to someone who planned to bring it to a school? They certainly aren't home during the day to take other a walk so the breeder would probably question that too?

If this is the same dog as the previous thread it's definateky from a puppy farm

If the head knows what she's doing with dog training, and has trained dogs previously so has already made the mistakes that everyone makes with their first dog and the puppy's welfare is paramount at all times, it could, possibly work.

Puppies tire easily, they wee on the floor, and they mouth with some very sharp teeth.

The idea of 12 SEN children having immediate and intensive therapy with a new puppy does not, however, sound promising. Even if each child only had half an hour a week (not particularly intensive IMHO) that's still over an hour a day for a tiny, tiny puppy who is still getting used to the world and won't understand an outburst that an SEN child may have.

Guide dog puppies are introduced to challenging environments really young like road machinery noisy stations because they need to find out quickly which dogs can cope so a therapy school dog I'll be introducing to children from the get go. Not once it's trained. See

I've always had German Shepherds. They were all managed when they went through the teething stage and my children (two with SN) were never bitten.

You teach the children to always have a toy to give the dog and sternly correct the puppy when it goes near a hand.

Some breeds of dog are less excitable wt the puppy stage. Exercising well before socialisation, helps.

"How do we know this puppy came from a reputable healthy source? And doenst have some joint problems that will cause it pain and make it unsuitable or comes from aggressive parents?"

This has been approved by the SEN Coordinator, the LEA and the Governors. It hasn't been done on a whim. The puppy will have been carefully selected.

Therapy dogs need to have different "skills" to guide dogs. It would be rare that a carefully selected dog, bought up and socialised properly wouldn't be suitable.

Of Course to start with the interactions will be fully supervised.

This would really bother me.. My DS has SN's but is in mainstream but really struggles with all animals..He has had CBT for dog phobia but that doesn't mean he would want them in the classroom where he is learning.

I am sure some children would love and benefit from the dog but sure others would suffer too.

"The idea of 12 SEN children having immediate and intensive therapy with a new puppy does not, however, sound promising. Even if each child only had half an hour a week (not particularly intensive IMHO) that's still over an hour a day for a tiny, tiny puppy who is still getting used to the world and won't understand an outburst that an SEN child may have"

However, the Headmistress may have taken a therapy dog handler course. She knows her Pupils, as does the SEN Coordinator.

It is a mainstream school, so we don't know the extent or nature of the SEN Pupils. There may not be any outbursts. It may be more of an anxiety/emotional nature that the dog is wanted for.

In the Ofstead reports her Leadership has been described as Highly Effective.

The puppy is on the two year training course and the contact with the Pupils will be guided by what is advised by the trainers.

It out the box thinking by the head, which is what is needed for all Pupils, at times.

@Giles

I have a degree in canine behaviour, and I deal with rescue dogs a lot.
And yes I know a dog can bite out of fear (not likely as it's being trained to be bombproof) or pain, but IF it did, which is very, very unlikely it should have developed a good bite inhibition from its siblings so would not significantly harm a child.

A puppy will behave however it's raised to behave, same as children and I'd imagine it comes from a dam and sire with sound temperaments, although a puppy is a blank canvas and grumpy parents don't mean that a pup will be nasty when it's older.

I take on dogs with no background history and when they are treated right they thrive and flourish...I have no idea what their parents were like and it really doesn't matter.

Starlight345 do you think that the Therapy Trainers aren't aware of this and contact would on be given if appropriate?

It works well in the US and other schools/Residential Homes/Care Homes/Hospitals/Hospices in the UK manage it, why all of a sudden do you think the dog will free run through the school?

SweetCheeks1980, two of my Male Big boned GS's were rescue, one had an abuse background and hated Men because of it. People thought I''d be eaten by them. They were wonderful dogs. We (Humans) really don't deserve their devotion.

If you really know dogs, you know a lot said on here is bullshit. Every situation can be managed.

There is a lot of hatred towards dogs across MN.

Why does everyone assume the pup will 'bite' a child?

We don't. But ALL puppies mouthe and bite - it's how they learn and discover the world, and also how they play with their siblings. Our puppy is nearly 15 weeks old and when he mouthes you and bites, it hurts! They have sharp teeth and bite in play - it takes months to train a dog not to jump, mouthe and nip people.

Are people missing the bit where the dog is about to embark on a two year training course? My friend's dog is a therapy dog (in education but not a school), he had lots of very short, very well controlled interactions throughout his training and spent the majority of his time in the office once he was past puppy hood.

I think this is a brilliant idea and it's not been done on a whim either.

@starlight
I'm pretty sure you'd be able to stipulate that your child had to (miss out ) be kept away from the dog, whilst acknowledging how beneficial it is to (except yours apparently) children.

@Adalime
I said in my reply all pups nip, however if children are taught to react properly with using a toy and not squealing and waving their hands about puppies learn much quicker.

I am truly amazed that there are people who actually exist who wouldn't think this was a lovely idea.

@birds
I've noticed the dog hatred on MN before. It's awful how ignorant how people are about dogs.

I think therapy dogs are a.lovely idea. In fact I dream.of having one myself.

But I think it's a big risk to get the kids excited and involved with a puppynajd for whatever reason the dog doenst work.out for the intended purpose and what they intend on doing or teaching the kids then?

My sons school have done this. The dog was specially chosen - lovely lab, much calmer than many lab pups. She has a designated “area” in the school office so lots of quiet and calm. She was obviously on a structured training programme and the office administrator (who was married to the head) was responsible for her. The children have learnt how to approach her, and not to approach when she is working. She is now fully grown and lovely for the children. As long as it’s done properly I think it’s a very useful thing to do.

I’m certainly not a dog hater, I have a puppy.
My concern is that a puppy is being introduced not a dog that is known to have to correct temperament or ability to cope with the demands that will be placed on him.

I said in my reply all pups nip, however if children are taught to react properly with using a toy and not squealing and waving their hands about puppies learn much quicker.

Of course they do, but there's still a huge scope for accidents to happen, and it only takes one parent who doesn't understand puppies to complain that their child has been bitten/hurt/scared by the dog for it to end up needing to be rehomed.

I am truly amazed that there are people who actually exist who wouldn't think this was a lovely idea.

I think done properly, a school dog/therapy dog is a great thing and can be a real asset, but they'll need to be SO careful with a young puppy. They're bouncy, excitable and unpredictable, as are small children. Like I said above, all it takes is for someone to get over-excited and a child will get nipped, a parent will complain and the school won't be able to keep the dog.

When kids go to boarding school quite often they meet the dogs owned by teachers and other staff. Just like in the "real world" kids meet other people's dogs. This is a puppy presumably chosen for its good nature. It will be introduced to the kids bit by bit. It's a good thing.

(except yours apparently what is that supposed to mean...

My son is anxious in the presence of dogs. They don't have to be running around the corridors for him to panic..

My DS is not the only child who is phonic of dogs.. it is quite common so my concern is not about my DS as it isn't happening in his school but in general children who like my Ds are phobic of dogs.

Interesting Nellie, do you know whether, if the headteacher and spouse leave, does the dog belong to the school or them?

It's not about dog hatred, it's about whether a puppy being trained by a teacher is the best route. There are many Pets as Therapy dogs in this country, it doesn't seem necessary for the school to lay out on the purchase and training of their own dog - if it is the school's dog.. That's my quibble. It's the same with the chick raising in schools, I don't think head teachers think things through properly sometimes.

It's just a puppy, not a wild, disease-carrying beast! It seems far more likely than otherwise that they'll handle the situation carefully and protect the best interests of both the puppy and the students.

Surely there will be supervision whenever the puppy is spending time with the kids, and I can't imagine they'll be forcing terrified children to be near a dog against their wishes. This experience could well help some students to overcome a budding fear of dogs.

There's very little new in this world, just a new spin on things.
During my 1970s south London education, Mrs Boreham always had her Great Dane in the classroom, Mrs Burrell (headteacher) had her King Charles in her office and in assembly too, and at secondary Mrs Broadley had two chihuahua things in her office. No reports of injuries sustained, although one of the chihuahua things did growl a bit when disturbed.

Gosh, what a lot scare-mongering!