To ask if this actually voluntary then or not? School trip fees

[Barkface]

Got an email regarding a trip for ds. It's an oversees trip (£800) for 5 days. Whenever my dc have had residential trips my understanding was payment was not optional, you had to pay if you wanted them to go. Which is fine. But this has confused me. Email states:
"Under the terms of the 1996 Education Act, payments for activities of this nature must be voluntary and it is only fair to state that the visit taking place is dependent on its financial viability and if insufficient parents choose for their child to participate such as to cover the costs it may be necessary to cancel the trip. Please let me know if there are particular difficulties.

For students in receipt of free school meals, please contact me to discuss how the school might be able to support you with funding this opportunity.

The method of payment will be via your secure online ParentPay account (www.parentpay.com) from September, however would we ask that you pay your non- refundable deposit of £100 via bank transfer no later than 4th July if you would like to your child to participate."

Could it be because it will actually be educational (as opposed to a week away at Butlins), so has to be voluntary? How do you voluntarily not pay a deposit but still expect to go? I am planning on saving this up for ds, it was just surprising to see the voluntary disclaimer.

i know mil never pays for her ds trips, nothing £800 odd trip to cadburys world and other places - i dont know where?? and i know her ds2 &3 she could have let them go to derwent hill and didnt have to pay, but she didnt like the idea of them going. she is on benefits though?

Isn't there a difference between trips within the school day for the whole year where they can only request voluntary contributions and trips for just some students and outside of school time?

I think legally they have to say it's voluntary. However they can (and are in this case) cover themselves by saying that if not enough people pay then the trip is cancelled. Sounds like they are saying it you're genuinely struggling then your child won't miss out but you can't just decide not to pay.

Maybe the wording has arisen from a complaint, which has promoted the school/LEA to check the legal system?

But agree it's pretty circular!

I thought state schools always had to say payment was optional for trips. I’m a teacher but have been in the private sector the past few years.
I think I’m right, and they have to state it’s optional. But they’re dependent upon enough people paying - if people refuse to pay, they can’t go on trips.

When mine were at school, we got the 'this is the financial contribution and its voluntary' spiel but they also -refused to run the trip- sorry, couldn't run the trip without 95% of those going on the trip paying to do so! So they covered their backs under the 1996 EA but also meant that no one could go without paying.

It's voluntary but it isn't. If people don't pay then the school won't run the trip. They rely on honesty and that people who are able to pay actually do so.

I've not seen this for big trips before but DD's school trip was £12 per pupil or £6 on pupil premium. All "voluntary" but with the understanding that it wouldn't go ahead if not enough people paid.

At ds’s school trips that happen within the school day or are a compulsory part of the curriculum are voluntary contribution but residential trips & after school trips eg sports tour, outward bound weeks, theatre trips are go only if you pay.

It says this on every letter I’ve had for my dd 7. A couple of parents don’t pay but I think they maybe can’t. I always pay a little extra though, so she’s off to the deep tomorrow and it was £25 but I paid £30 and told them to keep the £5 in case someone else couldn’t pay as I didn’t want it cancelling

I think the message means ‘payment is voluntary but if you choose not to pay then the trip won’t happen for anyone’ which is kind of fair enough.

If the trip is part of the curriculum the school can't require payment and contributions to costs are voluntary. If they think it's important they will be prepared to subsidise it in some way. If the school isn't an essential part of the curriculum then it's only going to happen if they get enough interest. If the family is eligible for Pupil Premium then the school might help out by using that fund.

£800 for five days? Ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculous. Schools shouldn't be doing trips like this. Surely they should be teaching children how to have a good (and educational trip) on a budget.

Yes it's a weird one! I would have thought they could clarify it with a figure maybe, as I'd assume £800 per pupil is the actual cost (five days full board at Switzerland, skiing and designing something to be used on slopes), unless it factors in teacher places cost as well of course.

Hannah that's lovely of you. I hope your dd enjoys the trip. I wish I could afford to be generous on top of requested trip money but definitely not for this one!!

Doesn't it just mean that going on the trip is not compulsory but if you want to go you have to pay, and that if not enough people sign up it won't go ahead? DD3's (yr 7) school just cancelled an £800 trip to Italy because there weren't enough takers.

Schools have to say this.

It's different in Scotland too - trips are not considered an integral part of the curriculum so if you don't pay, you don't go. £800 for five days overseas inclusive of travel, accommodation, all activities and food isn't that bad, but obviously depends where they're going and how they're getting there.

I think they might have got themselves a bit confused.

If it is a trip that is designed to fulfil the requirements of the national curriculum, no charges can be made for the activities or transport, although voluntary contributions can be requested.

Day trips from school in school time (even if not relevant to the NC) cannot make a compulsory charge for activities or transport either, although again voluntary contributions can be requested.

However, for residential trips, board and lodging can always be charged and are not voluntary, regardless of whether the trip is related to the NC. So in this case, if you want to go, you have to pay!

What they actually mean is what AuntieUrsula said!

Yes what AuntieUrsula said. The trip is voluntary (not the payment). There will be a minimum number of students required for it to cost that price because of group discounts/ sharing rooms so if not enough people sign up it will be canceled. But separate to that, if you have free school meals there might be some funding available to help if you want to go.

This started on our letters a couple of years ago. Inside school hour trips they can’t make you pay but if enough don’t then the trip will be cancelled. Residential trips however you might be able to set up a payment plan or a reduced fee but no pay means no go.

One of ours had if the vouluntry payment wasn’t paid that although they would be allowed to go they wouldn’t get X treat on the trip as that was part of the fee but would still get the curriculum part.

@Barkface - it means that going on the trip is voluntary. Your DC can go, or not go. But if they go then you do have to pay for it. Some schools will give financial assistance to pupil premium students, but they probably won't cover the whole amount for a residential trip.

Obviously if not enough people sign up then the trip will be cancelled. It wouldn't be viable to take a small number.

Schools can charge (on a - you must pay to go, we can leave you out if you don’t even if everyone else in the class is going - basis) for board and lodging on a residential visit. But if the visit is covering national curriculum material or education towards an Adam students are studying for at the school, then the cost of the activities during the trip must still be paid for through school funds or on a voluntary donation basis. So they may going with the voluntary wording because it is easier and more effective than saying “ to go your child must pay £x for board and losing. We also need a voluntary contribution of £y and if enough parents don’t make that contribution we will have to cancel the trip.” Which would, I suspect, lead to a lot more payments of £x only than simply asking for a voluntary payment of £z (where x+y=z).

"unless it factors in teacher places cost as well of course"
This would have to be factored in or the school wouldn't be able to afford to go.

Ahh they’re not voluntary at all. At my DC’s school it always states how it is voluntary and if they don’t receive enough payments, the trip will be cancelled however the teachers come out at home time with a clipboard calling out all of the parents who haven’t paid .

your pta may well be subsidizing trips for those that can't pay, we do. I take that wording to mean that they expect people to pay, if they can afford to.

If they don't have enough paying it's cancelled.