*Poverty* Do you agree

[geekone]

BBC Scotland say 1-4 children in Scotland live in poverty, which is an aweful statistic and really sad. However they also state "According to the group's most recent figures, a two-parent family with two children of school age would be defined as being in poverty if they are living on less than £413 a week after housing costs."

This seems like a lot of money to me £1652 after housing costs? I don't think that's poverty? In London maybe but Scotland?

I may be wrong and I am happy to stand corrected but wanted to know what you all think.

According to the new definition of poverty I've lived in it my whole privileged life! Poverty used to mean having to choose between food and heat, not having enough to buy food every day living in cold, dangerous substandard conditions. Redefining it and misusing the terms to give a political party a short term boost has dangerous long term cultural consequences shame on them.

this is what they actually said in 2016

There are amendments to this which cover child poverty in 2018 but I can’t get my stupid phone to play ball this morning.

@TittyGolightly I just multiplied it by 4 to give a rough estimate.

Does that include gas elect council tax water rates etc. Then food on top?

Food alone costs me 80 a week minimum and I shop in Aldi.

Redefining it and misusing the terms to give a political party a short term boost has dangerous long term cultural consequences shame on them

They’ve redefined it to include more people, not less. So how does that give them a boost? And given that the current Westminster government actually voted against making homes fit for human habitation by law, despite that being the very definition of a house, they have no room whatsoever to shame another party for trying to improve things.

I'm in the South East and think it sounds tight/like you'd have to scrimp a bit...especially if the 2dc are late primary or teens.

Council tax is probably at least £100 a month
A monthly bus pass in my home town is £73. So that x2 adults working.
Plus food...we spend £60 in Aldi for 2 adults 1 toddler...And older kids dont get FSM
Plus Bills
Petrol
Insurance
Shoes/Clothes...I'm often shocked at threads on here about how expensive secondary school uniforms here, and the poor DMs having to buy bigger trainers every term

And then the extras like
School trips
Letting the DC have 1 afterschool club a week so they fit in.
Birthdays and Christmas

I wish! family of four here (single parent with 2 secondary and one primary) with a monthly income of less than £1652 before housing costs! Not in the UK but I am in Europe

I can cover my housing costs, bills, and food, sometimes its a struggle though, particularly at the end of the month, I wouldn't consider myself to be in poverty

@SoddingUnicorns I took the quote straight from the BBC website www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/uk-scotland-44295464 which says 2 parent family and 2 kids not 3.

I heard it on the news first it isn't misquoted.

I've just done the 2017 calculator and as a single parent,working full time and with a modest mortgage I am apparanyltly we below the minimum wage needed manage.
Yes,I don't earn masses but with outgoings that I can control down as low as I can this does not feel like poverty.
Some months are a bit tight but I have enough wriggle room to save on a good month to fill those gaps and have saved for a holiday this year.

Blimey we live in the South-East of England and we have nowhere near that much left after household costs! Then again, we do have to be very careful with money - we only give ourselves £100 a month for treats/clothes/days out etc. But I suppose that would seem luxurious to some people.

I heard it on the news first it isn't misquoted

Well it doesn’t match the figures on the scotgov website. And the BBC are known for being anti SNP.

It sounds alot but does not go far

What 'housing costs'? Just rent/mortgage? What bills are included in that? How many kids?
People need to read between the lines instead of just reacting.

There is a survey that all EU member states participate in.
Here in Ireland it's called the Survey on income and living conditions and its run my a government department called the central statistics office which I work for.
The same survey is done in the UK although it's called something different and the data collected is used to measure levels of poverty and deprivation.
Someone up thread said it's relative poverty and that's important. Some of the deprivation indicators are "do you have access to the internet" do you have 2 pairs of shoes", as well as other questions about heating your home, food you eat, clothing etc.
As with all statistics the really important thing is to look at the changes year on year. Are more people living in poverty this year compared to last year. Has average household income increased or decreased.

Oh and I forgot childcare! A full time place £240 a week here! But even after school clubs everyday add up to at least £20 a week.

In a lot of the posts saying it's not a lot of money holidays, sky, days out and luxuries are mentioned. When I was young we scraped by we holidayed with my gran and every 3 years or so we went on a caravan holiday. I would never have said we lived in poverty abject or otherwise.

'Those prices are for down south! I'm thinking the cost of living is much cheaper in Scotland! And we live quite comfortably.'

Why do people continually think this? Do they think Sainsbury's, BT, Eon and Esso charge less for different regions of the UK? Rents in Edinburgh, Glasgow, Aberdeen, where most of the work is, are not cheap.

Food, clothes, energy, petrol, transport, it's no cheaper than anywhere else in the . . . United Kingdom.

They’ve redefined it to include more people, not less. So how does that give them a boost?

Because it "proves" how badly things are going in Scotland according to the SNP. There was just something on BBC news saying the SNP are complaining that the Scottish economy is being seriously constrained by Westminster. Every single thing the SNP do is about showing how much better things would be in an independent Scotland. It's their raison d'etre. If they can convince enough people that things really are that bad and that they have an alternative, they'll get their dream of IndyRef2.

(An independent Scotland would be financially buggered with debts like Greece and massive taxation. But details, details. FREEEEEEDOM!!!)

I would have thought that far more than 1 in 4 children would be in families with that amount or less. Seems very strange.

Indeed expat. And council tax in many parts of Scotland is eye watering.

Oh and yes - agree with expat.

Prices for people living in Scotland are no different from anywhere else outside the South East housing bubble. We pay the same for our utilities, food and clothes. In fact, if you live in remote areas you probably pay more.

There are also areas of the country where rental property is very expensive and house prices are high.

Blimey yeah I just done that calculator a PP linked and we are £4.66 per week below the minimum income standard... (and I thought we had decent jobs)

People need to read between the lines instead of just reacting

This. It’s interesting that there’s a lot of sneering and patronising about the SNP but nowhere does OP or indeed anyone else point out the SNP targets to alleviate poverty, and the ways in which they’ve already put things in place to do so. It’s knee jerk SNP bad!

And no, it’s not all about Westminster. But if you see it that way there’s little I can do to change your mind. However recently a lot has come out, including from the governor of the Bank of England, about how independence is financially and practically viable.

The point here is that you, OP, took one statistic from a sketchy news article and jumped on it without context.

My essential outgoing after housing costs per month are:
Council tax £150
Gas/electricity £105
Phone/tv/internet £55
Food £350
Petrol £200
Car insurance £70
Tv license £13
Childcare £343

Total £1186

On top of those things I still have clothes/shoes, birthday gifts, car finance and haircuts days out etc for me and 2DC so relatively speaking it's not a comfortable amount to live on.
I'm in Scotland and above costs are for 1 adult and 2 kids.

Prices for people living in Scotland are no different from anywhere else outside the South East housing bubble. We pay the same for our utilities, food and clothes. In fact, if you live in remote areas you probably pay more

This is also true. I’m willing to bet it’s deliberate that the impression of Scottish income/costs is made to look worse by the BBC.