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AIBU?

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Original poster

to think they have made it near on impossible to challenge council tax band??! *help me!*

41 replies

flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 11:19

I am trying to challenge my council tax band.

I went on the money saving expert website, and did as they suggested and emailed to ask for it being re assessed.

I have got an email back asking for evidence.

They want evidence of similar properties on a different band, fine, I can do that. I have found 4 in my street alone, nearly identical a band lower than mine.

Then they want evidence of what my house was worth in 1991. Now, the land registry have not made this information publicly available, you can only see house prices from 1995 onwards on the internet. Now I understand that council tax banding was done in 1991 and this is why they want that information, but how do they expect me to get it?

My house was sold in 1998 for less (by quite a bit) than the limit for the band that I think I should be in. I can obviously tell them this but I assume that because it was 7 years later that they cant or wont take this as evidence?

Also, they want evidence that it was incorrectly banded in 1991. Other than the above, I don't know what they want? I wasn't even alive in 1991 and don't have a clue how they actually decided on the banding other than presumably house prices, but I cant see that my house was worth around 12 thousand pounds more 7 years earlier?

Can anyone advise what I should say or do? Has anyone successfully moved bands?

Thanks in advance!!

OP posts:
Petal12 · 02/05/2018 11:24

I am in the same predicament so watching with interest! We tried to the library for old sale ads but no luck, could work for you though. My next step is to approach a local, long established estate agent for any advice or guidance they can give me. I'm very aggrieved by it all. I understand an appeal to the ombudsman follows once we have sufficient evidence

SoupDragon · 02/05/2018 11:24

Can you speak to the people in the lower banded houses on your street and ask if they got their’s changed?

IrmaFayLear · 02/05/2018 11:25

I tried to challenge and failed. I found that my house’s band was higher than larger houses in the same road. The council came back with “Ah, but you have a double garage.” The house next door has an acre of garden and six bedrooms... but a single garage. If we had a single garage i’m sure the council would say that we have more roof tiles or something...

Hereward1332 · 02/05/2018 11:28

Use this table www.nationwide.co.uk/-/media/MainSite/documents/about/house-price-index/downloads/uk-house-price-since-1952.xls

Look at the quarter for which it sold in 1998, divide by the Index figure. Multiply by the index figure for the relevant quarter in 1991.

HoneyDragon · 02/05/2018 11:29

Has the house been changed or extended since 1991?

Yogagirl123 · 02/05/2018 11:30

Unless you have time on your hands OP, I wouldn’t bother. In my experience very rarely are appeals successful. Someone in my neighbourhood tried this, no ones band was changed.

HoneyDragon · 02/05/2018 11:30

When trying to guess what my council tax bans would be for a new build I used the tool Hereward linked too and was spot on Smile

Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 11:31

this doesn't sound promising does it haha!

One of the similar houses I am going to use in evidence, has just been sold (part of the reason why it came to my attention actually!) so I doubt id be able to ask them. I could ask the other 3 though I suppose!

I have just emailed the local library so thank you for that idea petal I might try an estate agents too. The woman who sold me the house was fantastic and we're planning on moving next year and using her so maybe she would help. I can give it a go for nothing!

Irma wow that's ridiculous! I have a feeling ours will go the same way. One of the houses is pretty similar, sold for a similar value for what we're expecting for ours. No garden but we have an unenclosed potentially shared (nobody knows have had prev threads under different names!) yard. Bigger kitchen but similar amount of square footage. Another is lovely, worth more than mine, large garden, same amount of bedrooms, v similar layout. Another looks quite similar in terms of size, style, yard etc.

Its difficult because no 2 houses on my road are they same. They range from 1 bed tiny terraces, to a 4 bed detached! mine is a 4 bed terrace for reference. Cheap area.

OP posts:
Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 11:35

honeydragon it had a tiny extension to the back, like 2 square metres, and its had a loft conversion, no idea whether it was declared or done properly or what! Cant see any plans online to say anyones applied to do either.

The table brings it out in the band I am in now, however, I have used the calculator on money saving expert which uses nationwides data, and it came out in the band I think I should be in!

Thanks for your help so far! I do not have that much time on my hands, but i do like writing a formal email or 2 so it wouldn't be a chore to me especially when there is chance of a refund, think it would also help to sell my house, so would be worth it.

OP posts:
scaryteacher · 02/05/2018 11:52

If the banding wasn't appealed at the time, and we all had loads of notice to do it, or was appealed and refused, then I don't hold out much hope for your chances.

This website might help you, though you may like to note that you can only appeal within the first six months of owning the property in question: www.valuationtribunal.gov.uk/your-appeal-type/council-tax/council-tax-banding/

IrmaFayLear · 02/05/2018 11:58

And of course the council response may be to raise the council tax of the other properties in the road, not lower yours, in which case you need to do a moonlight flit before the neighbours in question find out...

SluttyButty · 02/05/2018 12:01

I had exactly the same email back yesterday.

I'm not sure how to move forwards so I'll be following this to get some advice!

Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 12:03

scary how would I know if it was appealed at the time though? And surely nobody appealed because they wouldn't have known that their neighbours were different. I mean, did they look inside each house, or just survey the owner? From the outside all our street mostly looks the same but like I said upthread they all vary massively inside so I don't know how they would have decided in the first place?

I have seen that about the 6 months, but I emailed anyway and they have not even mentioned it!

Irma yes that's possible. It would only be a few houses in the street and surrounding, and like I say I am planning to move soon anyway!

OP posts:
Ilovecamping · 02/05/2018 12:18

When the valuations were carried out they did not look at individual properties, quite often just banded the street. I went to the Nationwide calculator and as a consequence of that information appealed for my banding to be looked at by the Valuation Office we were turned down.

jasjas1973 · 02/05/2018 12:22

Its the Valuation Office not the Council.
I have just successfully got a property changed from band D to C and got a refund (from the council) of the difference going back to 1993! as executor of the Will, i argued this was money owed to the estate.

The VO assume the property was in good repair, had CH and double glazing (as most houses would have, their words not mine!) in my case there were hazardous materials in the build affecting the value and i proved they didnt take this into account..
Property valuation websites, are not evidence, so you need to prove there are really differences between your property and neighbouring properties ie build, no of bedrooms, land area, insulation etc
TBH the difference from one band to another is nt very much, if it was'nt for the refund it would nt be worth it, in my Council its just over £100 per year difference.

MissCharleyP · 02/05/2018 12:27

I had to get a flat I rented valued by the VO, as it hadn’t been used as a residential property (just a holiday let) for years. It’s the VO who do it. However, I have read of cases when someone has asked for a lower valuation and, as said upthread, it resulted in their neighbours CT being hiked.

SluttyButty · 02/05/2018 12:30

jasjas ours is banded D but my next door neighbour C. We pay over £300 a year more. We've been banded the same as other neighbours who have a proper three storey town house. Ours looks the same as a regular 3bed two storey house with a half loft conversion not a full floor bedroom on the top floor. I'm at a loss as how to proceed so need to get my head together.

I can't open the above link btw.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 12:30

ilovecamping I don't think they can have banded our street as a whole as it's mostly a's a few b's (me and a couple of bigger houses) and one lonely c, but that was only build in about 2004 and is detached so I can understand that one.

jas
wow my childhood home didn't have double glazing until about 2006! and that was a council house. Next door still have single glazing!
no you're right it wouldn't be worth it for the reduction alone, but it would for the refund, and also I think its off putting fo potential buyers, why buy my house and pay more council tax when you can buy a similar one about 5 doors up and pay less.... I know its not a massive thing but If I can get it changed i'd like to!

OP posts:
jasjas1973 · 02/05/2018 13:22

Yes but i believe there are time limits and if you ve "happily" been paying CT for years, you cant ask for a re-valuation, only a new owner can.

As i said, you need to find something substantially different about your house which was nt taken into consideration in 1991, being in disrepair isnt good enough because it should be! so, construction, no of bedrooms and size of build/plot would be a start.
Bear in mind that if the VO up your neighbours properties to your current band, you wont be popular!

Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 13:26

they haven't said that I cant appeal for that reason? I have told them how long I have lived there and they never mentioned it.

I don't understand what you mean about finding something substantially different? Different than what?

OP posts:
Wincher · 02/05/2018 13:33

I've appealed council tax banding on both properties I've bought when I moved in. The first time, the flat was clearly identical to others on the same road and the appeal was successful with no issues. So I tried again when we bought a house, as it is a higher band than neighbours, but I was chancing my arm really as the houses are all different and ours is a bit bigger than many, so the appeal was unsuccessful. I thought it was worth a punt! I never had to prove the 1991 value - I put down what I thought it would have been and wasn't asked for proof. Maybe different councils vary.

Wincher · 02/05/2018 13:35

Just checked again (as it was five years ago) and every single other house in our postcode is a band C and ours is the only D. But we're the end of terrace with an extra bit on the side of our house.

Original poster
flamingofridays · 02/05/2018 13:36

wincher it's the valuation office that are asking from the proof rather than the council. When they will email me back I will ask if its the same procedure for everyone as I have also posted this on facebook on a page and loads of people have said they were never asked for proof, only to name similar properties which I can.

thank you

OP posts:
eleventwinkles · 02/05/2018 13:49

I have just moved into a new build and believe the council have also put us in the wrong band.
Fortunately my DH has access to the house price index in 91 and based on what the council have banded us in they are claiming that our house is worth £480k in today's terms if you pull it up according to the index from 91. We just bought our house off the builder for £305k so they are wildly out.
Unfortunately all of the same style houses on our estate have also been pushed into this band but again I think they are all wrong.
From what I gather other house owners have failed to change the band but we are determined to give it a go also.
Good luck OP I heard that from last year the figures show that of the 40k people who appealed their band 30k were rejected and 10k were successful. (A poor 30 were changed to a higher band!)

jasjas1973 · 02/05/2018 13:56

they haven't said that I cant appeal for that reason I have told them how long I have lived there and they never mentioned it. I don't understand what you mean about finding something substantially different? Different than what

Go on the VO website, they explain the criteria, if you enter your postcode, bring up the list of properties and then click on yours, then click "i think this CT band is wrong" and fill out check list, one Q is have you lived there longer than 6 months.......

If you still go ahead......

So, substantially different from your lower CT band neighbours properties ie yours is a prefab built in 1952 and theirs are std brick build, your plot size is 100m2, theirs are 200m2 yours has 2 bedrooms and theirs 4 that sort of thing, i could nt get any sale price info from the late 80s to early 90's if you can get that, will be good evidence too.

You need to show why your house is in the wrong band.

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