Box rooms

[Beansonapost]

Why is it that houses in the U.K. are still being built with box rooms?

... and still being built with no laundry/utility room?

I grew up having all massive bedrooms... kitchen diner... lounge/living room... utility... garden... garage etc. This is in the Caribbean. My childhood bedroom could fit two uk sized box rooms.

I've lived in other countries almost all of them had utility rooms... except China where the washing was housed in the bathroom; which to me makes sense. Why would you want to do laundry in the kitchen?

Husband is British so is used to this way of life... but I am confused as it's 2018 and I am certain the way people use their homes has changed. Why are people still being forced to have a box room and do the washing in the kitchen? That slot could be used for extra storage.

We went to look at some new builds... while the house was nice for almost £500,000 it just didn't provide what I would want in a family home (based purely on my experience). I think when people buy a home they don't really intend to move anytime soon unless they have to... so why put a room that is useless beyond the age of 10? Then force people to either sell of "create additional space" why not just build a house people can live in for as long as they need or want?

Also where utility rooms are concerned... in a country where it rains so much, wouldn't a dedicated space for laundry be standard? Wash, dry, iron... leave clothes to dry with windows open. Clothes out of sight.

Why is this the norm in the U.K.?

Also... why are homes still built with such poor storage options? You might get an under stair cupboard, an airing cupboard but that's it?! Why aren't built in wardrobes standard in all bedrooms? Gives you back your floor space and means less furniture to buy.

It seems developers are more concerned about how many people they can cram into these developments than how people will enjoy their homes/space.

worrying about the potential of encountering a box room

WTF? Did a box room do something terrible to you? Don't buy a house with one if you don't want it (as I said, we find ours useful, and would rather have it than live in a two-bed - why would I actively want to lose a room?), but to be 'worried about encountering one'?!

I just find it strange that people accept basically the same style/type of home their grandparents lived in because "it's all you can afford" so should be so grateful. Developers and builders should be held to a higher standard it's 2018 and you're the consumer.

We, and everyone else, surely, bought the nicest house we could afford. How on earth do you think we could exercise our consumer choice beyond that? Do you think I should petition parliament for our third bedroom to be bigger?

Let me spell it out to you OP. In the UK, building land is expensive because it is in short supply, and we have a much higher average population density than many other countries.

Say a property developer buys some land for half a million. Do they build 2 nice, spacious large houses with utility rooms and big bedrooms, or do they build 4 smaller houses with no utility room and small bedrooms?

Option 1 -
Cost of piece of land 500k.
Cost of materials/labour to build 2 large houses 150k each.
Total cost 800k.
Sell each house for 450k.
Income 900k less cost 800k = 100k profit.

Option 2 -
Same piece of land 500k.
Cost to build 4 small houses 100k each.
Total cost 900k.
Sell each house for 300k.
Income 1.2m less cost 900k = 300k profit.

That's why they cram loads of houses on to the smallest area possible. Profit.

I think some people on this thread think I'm criticising uk housing standards..

Can't begin to imagine where people might have got that idea from

I agree homes should to be sold on actual size and not the number of rooms they've managed to fit in them

but that doesn't make sense to most families. Most families want a bedroom for each of their dc (obviously, if they can afford it - I'm aware many can't) - I have no idea what the square footage of my house is, what I do know is that we are lucky enough to have a house that meets our needs ie a bedroom for each dc, plus another space for me to work from home - what you would call a box room, which, according to you, no-one wants.

I just find it strange that people accept basically the same style/type of home their grandparents lived in because "it's all you can afford" so should be so grateful. Developers and builders should be held to a higher standard it's 2018 and you're the consumer.

I was in one of the beautiful parks in my City at the weekend, and appreciated how fortunate we are that 150 years ago we had such marvellous benefactors and people who planned the whole space. Today there is a lot of building going on near me, and every single time a new estate goes up, it is ludicrous the number of houses they squeeze into the spaces. No community halls. No shops.No play areas nor other green spaces. No libraries. No Drs surgeries. No religious buildings. Roads that are not spaced enough so visitors can park. Roads that a fire engine would really struggle to get through. I can't understand why there aren't higher standards in terms of installing things like solar panels.
A house having a small bedroom - useful for a cot or toddler bed, or useful for a home office, or useful for a hobby room - is way down my list of worries about new house building, tbh. Oh and all the new builds round here have utility rooms.
Now this, I do agree with.

@Bekabeech I did read that. It's quite disgraceful... but greed. I don't want to name the developer... but they did seem upmarket.

Some of you took that last statement in a literal sense 😐.

My DH grew up in the type of house I'm talking about, albeit they added an extension to get their utility room and as a result he was no longer in a box room. His room could only fit a mini-single bed he spent years with his feet hanging off the bed. However, I am well aware his parents paid a fraction of the cost of what it is worth today... as it's detached etc etc. And in Kent.

So what I meant was the houses are still the very simplistic design. My husbands parents who are now in their 80s saw the need for a utility room back then... as I'm sure a lot of people would have liked/required in their home in those days.

So why are developers still putting the washing machine in the kitchen and giving families a box room in 2018 if families in the 80s and 90s were adding utilities to their homes by way of an extension and getting rid of the box room.

I also take issue with the lack of services on the estates and narrow roads. We drove around a few when we were looking for a rental and all the roads seem to have those side roads like you would expect to see on a country road to allow someone to pass. Although I did think architecturally it was well designed and a lot of the homes didn't look the same and lots of greenery to be seen. I know about profit maximisation. But if you must put so many people in such small spaces why not make their space a bit nicer?

Someone just proved my point about bedrooms being the main denominator in house purchases in the U.K. .. and I think it should be more than that.

You have a population density issue in the south mainly because of how the economy is set up. London-centric. Nobody wants to move from London and the surrounds because you wouldn't get the same salary anywhere else in the U.K. so this is exploited by developers. IMO.

in 2018 if families in the 80s and 90s were adding utilities to their homes by way of an extension and getting rid of the box room

Because in the 80s and 90s families could afford homes which met their needs without using the box room as a bedroom and with decent size gardens big enough for extension. That’s unaffordable now.

@Mightymucks

My husband had a box room until he was a teenager.

It's unaffordable which is the reason developers should put more thought into house design than just the walls.

For those who live in a new build, does it have a pantry/larder?

Why are developers still putting the washing machine in the kitchen and giving families a box room?

BECAUSE MANY OF THE HOUSES ARE SMALL. LOTS OF PEOPLE CAN'T AFFORD TO BUY OR RENT BIGGER HOUSES.

What do you expect us to do? Knock down 10 million+ perfectly good dwellings, pave over the entire countryside and build bigger houses just so everyone can have a utility room? Who's going to pay for it all anyway?

Houses are cheaper outside London - but then salaries are lower so you're no better off.

Someone just proved my point about bedrooms being the main denominator in house purchase in the UK... Two houses a similar price, one with two large bedrooms, one with three small ones. Which one would most families go for? The one with three smaller bedrooms. They'd like a house with three large bedrooms, but guess what? They can't afford it so they have to compromise.

Economics isn't your strong point is it, OP?

I once said to a somewhat dimwitted distant cousin that I'd love a dishwasher and she said "well, buy one then". I said that I would, but our kitchen wasn't big enough, so she said "Well why don't you just buy a bigger house then?"

Doh.

Because you can't fit them into a 650 sqft "affordable" home.

For those that live in a new build, does it have a pantry/larder?

Doubt it, but then that's because some people cleverly invented fitted kitchens and fridges so a pantry isn't necessary any more. it probably won't have a parlour, a drawing room, a music room or a library either

You'll be wondering why on Earth everyone doesn't have a swimming pool and tennis courts in their garden next.

@hedgebackwards

Macro yes... micro no.

People keep missing the point...

how big does a house have to be to have a utility or decent bedrooms? 🤔.

@hedgebackwards no need to be so snaky, it's not my fault...

pantry/larder doesn't have to be a "room"

Just a built in cupboard in the kitchen or most people seem to have a free standing one.

It would be nice to have a space to store food other than a wall mounted cupboard likewise removing the washing machine gives you another base unit or dishwasher space!

Number one complaint from home owners is always lack of storage.... developers clearly don't care.

how big does a house have to be to have a utility or decent bedrooms? 🤔.

Well, if you're looking for a house for a family of 4 with a good double and two good (at least 8' square) singles, plus usable kitchen, utility, lounge big enough for seating for 4, plus dining room or useful, not cramped, area in the kitchen (not mentioned but lack of space for a dining table is often lamented) and a bathroom on one floor and toilet on the other, plus adequate storage, you'd need at least 900 sqft.

Over £200k for a new build that size, where I live. Inaccessible to FTB couple on nmw.

Particularly if they'd previously been paying through the nose for rent.

how big does a house have to be to have a utility or decent bedrooms? 🤔.

You could always build your own.

Then you could have as many larders and utility rooms as you please.
And no box rooms (obviously).

My 2 bed ex council house had double bedrooms (double bed, wardrobe and still disposable space) plus a coal shed that was converted into a laundry and storage area off the kitchen. It was built post WW2 and had a big garden too.
When it was built the 3 boys in the family shared the biggest bedroom and the parents had the smaller room. You could tell from the wallpaper.

Don't be so condescending OP. I know perfectly well what a pantry/larder is. I grew up in a house with one.

How big does a house have to be to have a utility or decent bedrooms? Bigger than what a lot of people can afford. FFS.

Developers are frequently legally obliged (as part of their planning consent conditions) to build a certain percentage of 'affordable' homes in their development. They aren't going to waste space on utility rooms, pantries and spacious 3rd bedrooms with those now, are they?

When we first bought a flat we had a thing over the kitchen door that held an ironing board and the iron. I can see why the developers don't put them into show homes.

I think the op has a point though, we accept really low standards, in general.

I do understand about developers making money.

It's a shame that developers can't provide places that are really effortless to live in and still make a profit.

@ButchyRestingFace I could, but that's not the point of this thread.

I'm sure If most people could they would build their own house.

@hedgebackwards 🗣 ok! Condescending was not my aim though.

I think I get it. People in the U.K. should be so happy they can even afford to own a home even if it might be the only home they may ever own in their life, that they shouldn't question developers and the types of homes they are building because god forbid you might want the luxury of not hearing your washing machine while is churns away or want more storage for your belongings. Or in your retirement you might want a lift to be in the flats.

I cannot believe people think asking for better thought out homes is beyond the realm of affordability for the average home buyer whether ftb or someone moving up the ladder.

OP you are so obsessed with new builds, if they upset you so much become a councillor for your local area, get yourself on the planning committee, join protest groups regarding new developments, you could have your own campaigns “ban the boxroom” “utilities for all” “stamp out postage stamp gardens” “dressing rooms for the deserving” I can see the placards now.....

@BettyBooJustDoinTheDoo

Me thinks you have missed the point hun.

I kind of get what you're saying but effectively the box room means that a family can put a child in their own bedroom. To swap it for a laundry would mean the house has one less bedroom and is not therefore suitable for that family. And the bottom line is that the family can't afford a bigger house so they have to make their choice. Most families obviously do make that choice hence developers continuing with those kind of builds.

Betty boo speaks the most sense in the whole thread. It is simply economics. Tbh new builds are really not a great option economically unless you are buying at the "executive" level which is obviously out of the price range of many ftb's. I have friends wirh beautiful new build four bed houses, separate studies, utilities, playrooms etc.

You will get better value for money with an older house that has been renovated and extended or as you say, do it yourself as you can afford to. You pay a premium for having a brand new house so have to compromise on size which many people choose to do.

I've never understood why the UK has washing machines in the kitchen instead of a bathroom.

Because the kitchen has a door to to the back garden and the bathroom doesn't.

I think we should leave the OP to get on with her hatred of British houses (or more specifically her hatred of how she imagines all British houses to be) and call it a day now. I think it's probably a form of culture shock. I've lived in 3 other countries and have witnessed quite a bit of this. People find it hard to settle and lash out at some of the fundamentals of their new host country while wistfully looking back on their homeland / previous country with rose tinted glasses. It's ugly and quite sad but hopefully OP will move on to the next stage of acceptance or else move on to a different country soon where she will find new things to moan about

@Tringley I think I'm right that some countries think us Brits are a bit bonkers for hanging our washing outside, you know like we've done for years on sunny and windy days! Hence they don't see the need for a machine in the kitchen.

I've only recently had a utility room, always had everything in the kitchen before. But I grew up in only houses with utilities that had all laundry related gubbins. And my father who's very tight always still insisted the washing is hung outside to dry, although he does that himself he doesn't insist dm does it herself 😉