To stay with DP for the children

[Peakypush]

Hi, this is my first post so please go easy on me I'm so sorry for the length but I'm trying hard not to dripfeed!

First some background:

I met DP five years ago while we were both living abroad (we're from the same country). I noticed fairly early on that he held what I considered 'old fashioned' views on some things for someone so young (early 30's), but he was intelligent and progressive in many ways so it didn't really seem to be an issue and I just put it down to him coming from a rural background and me being from a city.

I became pregnant two years into the relationship and we decided to move home before I had the baby. As DP owned a house close to his parents (he had been renting it out while abroad), it made sense that we would move there and also due to the fact that it would be easier for him to get work in his local area as opposed to my home city (three hours away).

When he was back in his home environment, his 'traditionalist' ways really set in. His parents have a large farm and it's expected that he helps out a LOT. This means he goes farming before work, sometimes after he finishes work and every single weekend.

After DD was born he did nothing parenting wise, despite being even more keen than I was to have children. No night feeds, no nappy changes (until I forced him to when she was 3 months old) he was less than useless. It was a very dark time for me and I felt like I had been duped. She had terrible reflux and cried incessantly, yet he'd sleep through it or piss off farming leaving me to struggle on. He had no tolerance for the baby crying and would get really frustrated instead of trying to soothe her. I had no friends or family close by and we live literally in the middle of nowhere so I was extremely isolated and spent many months with a very heavy heart wondering how on earth it had come to this. My mother saw I was struggling when she visited and she ended up coming down to stay with me regularly to help out. Although I was eternally grateful for her help (and am certain I would have spiralled into PND without her) I felt absolutely mortified that she felt the need to do it...

I was considering leaving him but wanted to at least try to salvage the relationship before giving up completely as I felt DD deserved that (I'm a child of divorce and did not want that for her). I sat him down and laid it all out there, told him how horrified I was with him and that I was considering leaving if things didn't change dramatically etc. he seemed genuinely shocked that i thought things were so bad.

For context his own family background is painfully sexist. His mother was a SAHM and did 100 percent of the childcare duties. She does everything around the house and his father literally never even makes a cup of tea or a sandwich for himself - he sits there waiting for her to do it. If she's not there he's even rang her to see when she's coming home. My DP doesn't think this is right and has complained about his father but this is how they were brought up so it's inevitable that some of it sticks.

After our talk he made some effort to change but I was still hurt and disillusioned and in my mind I was going to give it until DD was a year old and reasses if I could really put this all behind me and move past it.

When DD was just 6 months old I became pregnant again (pill failure). I was very upset when I found out as it was the last thing I wanted, however DD2 arrived 5 months ago and is a joy.

DP has been much more hands on this time. He has made a concerted effort but things are still far from equal and I still do the vast majority of the grunt work. As I'm at home with the children I obviously expect to do more, however he still spends hours and hours farming each week while I'm struggling to put two babies to bed etc. I'm sure he's thinking of future inheritance and that it will all pay off but I still resent what I see as him putting his father's needs before mine and our DDs. He still has low tolerance for crying and now there's toddler tantrums in the mix too and he doesn't handle it well.

So to (finally) get to my question. Would I be unreasonable to stay with this man? I know mumsnet tends to jump to "LTB" but has anyone stayed in similar circumstances and it all worked out? He does have good qualities and we do get along a lot of the time, but there's also many days that I can't believe I've ended up in this 1950's set up... would love any advice? If anyone has read this far I salute you!

I do so wish posters would advance search the likes of Sixaxion, then report them and act as if they don’t exist. For within a few hours once MNHQ gets back into action for the day, it will be as if they never did.

I don't think OP wants OH to work job 1 and job 2 and pitch in with the kids, I think she wants OH to drop job 2 and pitch in with the kids instead. Which I don't think is unreasonable.

Looking from the outside you seem lonely with your DP working such long hours. You also seem a bit passive in that things seem to have just happened and you have gone along with the situation. What changes can YOU do to make things better ? Where is the nearest school ? Can you volunteer in your local community ? I think that you need to do some things to make you happy. I expect that it will get easier when the children are older

Why would you stay with him "for the children" when he has zero tolerance of them cannot cope with toddler tantrums and is barely around them ?

That makes no logical sense.
They would be better off with regular set contact when he is forced to be responsible for them.

You mean staying for yourself because you get a roof and food he pays for?

If not married you are not in a secure position. Go to counselling yourself.

Is he doing all this for inheritance? Is it guaranteed? I assume he isn't paid.

Does the farm have other workers or is it just your DP and his father?

And do I assume you're not married? If you're not, you need to think carefully about next steps as you don't work.

I can't give much insight into whether you should stay or leave, if he's making a conscious effort to change then I might be worth trying counciling of some sort. On the other hand I grew up in a household with obviously unhappy parents and spent most of my childhood and teen years just wishing they would split, if you are so unhappy that it will be noticeable to your children as they grow then imo its sending your children the message they should stay with someone even if they're unhappy. You need to think of you and your children, I hope you find the right decision for all of you.

I think this is a really tough decision but you’ve had some excellent advice already. I don’t have any new insight but just wanted to say that I sympathise! I can sort of see both sides though. He’s probably exhausted with the amount of work he’s doing and thinking that you’re ok as you’re “at home all day”... but having been in your shoes I completely understand that being a SAHM is exhausting and stressful in ways that I never felt in my full on stressful career. A few observations.. these early years with toddler and baby are the hardest, especially since you’ve got two so close - you are doing amazing to be coping with them without help!! If you can bear it, I’d put off any decision until the youngest is about 2, when I think things will get a lot easier. If you need help, could you get it from someone else other than your husband? Paid-for if no family around? I accepted this reality with my second child and it has been irritating (as I’d prefer my husband to shoulder more of a fair share) but ultimately less painful for everyone involved. My last thought is to consider whether you’re “cut out” to be a SAHM. I really don’t mean this as a criticism, but not everyone is. I’m definitely not!! I don’t enjoy it and I don’t think it’s the best solution for the children. If you’re the same, maybe you should plan to go out to work (or education or something)? In my experience, you’ll feel less resentment for the hubby if you have you’re own interests to pursue, and it also forces him into picking up more responsibility with the children.

There are some immediate things you need to do to clear your head.

Can you go and stay with your mum for a few weeks to clear your head, get some distance and perspective? Perhaps there you could work out if you could return to work. You may be in a better position to see your own strengths and know you can manage on your own.

If you decide to stay you need to get more security
Is the farm in your DP's name? If not, it needs to be signed over to him if he is to continue working there. I have a family member who was in your situation only the DH worked on the farm for very low pay and was promised the farm. He spent 20 years like this. Then he had a row with his dad and the farm was left to another son. Legal battle ensued and he got a settlement but no farm. They ended up emmigrating and starting afresh in their mid 30's with 2 kids.
Other family member runs family farm as second job. Wife accepts this as the farm has been signed over to him by parents, although they still live there.
Finally, you need to be married to have any legal rights in this. See the thread about the person who didn't get a widow's pension.

Thanks for all your replies. Sorry if I wasn't clear - no the farm isn't his job. He works long hours in an unrelated industry (sometimes night shifts). The farm is extra on top of that and he does feel obligated. His dad guilts him into it a lot, he'll ring him looking for help after a night shift when he's only been home a few hours, it's ridiculous. He encourages his parents go away for the weekend for a 'break' and he'll do all the farming that weekend and yet the next week his dad will complain that he "never gets any help".

There's no guarantees about inheritance and even if there was I don't fancy being held to ransom by it for the next 20 years anyway.

I've been completing a masters via distance learning to give me better job prospects, and I'm nearly finished. However, due to the location we're living in any job I get will mean a commute of 1.5 hours each way and would basically mean I wouldn't see my children Monday to Friday which doesn't sit well with me and I also think that I might end up even more frazzled as I'll probably still have to do everything at home as well... not to mention that it won't bring any extra money into the house as childcare and travel costs would take up the majority of the money. I do think I might have to just do it regardless though as I'll potentially go stir crazy otherwise.

I've suggested us moving to my home town as I think it would solve a lot of the problems, but financially it doesn't make sense as even though I would get work there, he most likely wouldn't and my earning potential is a fraction of his. Plus he has the house here that he owns outright and I know he doesn't actually want to move.

Oh I'm conflicted...

I definitely don't expect him to do 50 percent of the childcare, just to pull his weight at the weekend etc. cestlavie no I don't mean staying for me because he pays for things, I mean staying to keep our family together. If we split I would move home and would happily pay for myself, but It would mean taking the children more than 3 hours away from him. They wouldn't see their father regularly (even though he's not here a lot they still see him almost daily even if it's only for a little while and in spite of this our toddler adores him).

It sounds v tough Peaky - for you, and to be fair, for him too.

Do you actually like him? Do you like where you live etc? Would life be better if you split and were free to move closer to work, family etc?

I think what was our saving grace is that DH and I did/do actually like each other's company when we're not at each other's throats about who is more tired

Granted, currently he is working hard supporting the family farm- but you are working hard with 2 small kids - and the family farm work has no benefit to you as (a) you're not married and (b) even if you were you + DP have no legal interest in the property. So your domestic labour is essentially freeing your DH up to enrich your in-laws.

Calculating yes but your labour has value (as does his - if he values his family, I.e. You & the DC, he needs to start setting some boundaries).

His parents managed without him when he was living overseas. You must barely see him awake right now and that’s no relationship.

Sounds like another conversation to be had, as you said he did respond the first time. You need a family life balance that works for both of you, can his parents pay for help on the farm?

It is tough for him Gennz I know he feels pulled in every direction and he thinks I don't "get it" as I'm not from a farming background. So I have tried to be understanding and keep my mouth shut but then inevitably I'll have a bad night/day/evening with the DC and my resentment will bubble to the surface as I know my day would have been much easier if he was here actually co-parenting instead of helping out someone else. He says he's trying to keep "everyone" happy and he can't win but I tell him his obligation should be to me and the DC and it's not his job to keep his dad happy. They have tons of money and could afford to hire someone but they won't. I don't like where we live, it's too rural and I'm at home most of the time which I know contributes massively to my frustration and I have suggested we move but as it doesn't make financial sense he's shot it down...

I used to like him but it's often hard to see that now through the rage!

One of the greatest difficulties is that so often we assume a present father is better than an absent one. Much of the research has compared good dads to non existent ones. The reality is that an emotionally available dad who has visitation is much better for DC than an unengaged father who lives in the family home. Does your partner actually parent, or does he occasionally hang out with the kids? Are you enjoying your life?

You and your kids are now your husbands priority and not his dad/parents. You would be wise to remind him of that and he has two young kids to raise with you. Don't accept this now - put your foot down.

What do you think his reaction would be if you said right sod this I'm taking the kids and moving back to my mum's/civilisation/work opportunities etc?

Right now it doesn't seem there is a huge incentive to stay, given you do all the childcare, hardly see him while he prioritises his family for a property you don't have a financial stake in.

That said I'd caution against making any life changing decisions while in the throes of looking after a young baby. I was permanently angry with DH that first year. God I can't believe I'm about to do it all again 😱

That's interesting calvin he does more parenting than he used to as when's he's here I literally say what I want him to do: "feed DD such and such", "DD2 needs a nappy change" etc. but if I'm not telling him exactly what to do he doesn't do it generally. No I'm definitely not enjoying my life, but since we've moved here I've either been pregnant/breastfeeding/sleep deprived and I worry that this is clouding my judgment and the tiredness/hormones are making me unreasonable? Perhaps waiting it out another while would be the best course of action until things settle down...

I have said that gennz and he got angry and told me I know where the door is he's come back and apologised afterwards and said obviously he didn't mean it and he didn't want us to go anywhere and then he made more effort in the following days but slipped back to the status quo within the week

@Peakypush tbh by him saying you know where the door is it shows he has low respect for you and has taken you for granted. I'd be minded to start considering my options to leave at that point even if I were doing it secretly. Maybe time to start gathering a leave the building piggy bank together.

Don't make any hasty decisions. To me, 'you know where the door is' sounds exactly the sort of thing said in the heat of an argument, especially if he felt that there was a chance that he could lose his children.

Op, I had a dh when my dc were small but he worked mad hours too, away for weeks at a time and no family support nearby. I really do sympathise. I used to resent him for working because at least he left the house, put smart clothes on, used his brain, spoke to people. He resented me because I was at home with dc, with no work stresses or long commutes.

I really do think it's a difficult time in any relationship, more so when one parent is a sahm.

....it's only for a little while and in spite of this our toddler adores him).

A toddler is programmed to adore people.toddler would adore a friend or neighbour who popped in each day to say hello